Author Topic: Google facing multiple lawsuits  (Read 2714 times)

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Offline SCarpelan

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #135 on: October 08, 2017, 08:15:52 am »
Do we know if he was a repeat offender?  People like that usually don't just start shit outta the blue, so it isn't unreasonable to assume that he might have had other incidences of inappropriate behaviour.
I haven't seen it said anywhere that this is the case but put the conditional sentence to the end of my previous post to make it clear I have no problem with the firing if this is the case.

Quote
Besides, the bigger and more public the cockup, the more severe the punishment.  Considering that Google has been trying to establish a more inclusive image, a black eye like this is something they can ill afford.
He was trying to make suggestions about how to be more inclusive, not trying to fight the company's goal. He just did it in a way that exposed his own sexism and stupidity. The company had the option of making a public denouncement and make it clear the employee is getting disciplined. It should also have been made clear that Demore has killed any chance of being promoted to a leadership position within the company unless he demonstrates that he understands why he was wrong and builds a long track record of understanding and inclusive behaviour. I would be surprised if he was smart enough to have this required understanding but as long as he understood to keep his mouth shut about any gender related issues I would have no problem keeping him as a low level employee.

Yes, from the company's perspective firing him is the easiest and safest solution. I just take worker rights seriously enough that I expect them to try to find another working solution first before taking this step.

Offline Lana Reverse

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #136 on: October 08, 2017, 09:20:55 pm »
Okay, seriously. Why do you think Damore is sexist?
I also pissed in an old woman's sauce pan when I was a child. Have you?

Offline Art Vandelay

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #137 on: October 08, 2017, 11:16:43 pm »
Okay, seriously. Why do you think Damore is sexist?
"She" asks after over 130 posts of people describing, often in minute detail, why they think this guy is sexist.

Just in case there was even a shred of doubt that this is yet another Ultimate Dragon sock.

Offline SCarpelan

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #138 on: October 09, 2017, 03:23:06 am »
A new person entered the thread which means (s?)he thinks there is a chance to rekindle the fight and perhaps gain something that feels like a victory.

Offline Skybison

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #139 on: October 09, 2017, 04:48:16 am »
Okay, seriously. Why do you think Damore is sexist?

Well if I had to guess I say Damore is sexist because of pride.  Guys like him prize reason and intelligence and rationality and want to see themselves as the embodiment of such things.  But human beings are irrational and the smarter someone is the better they are at rationalizing their irrationality.  So when the big mean feminists and SJWs come along and tell them they aren't perfectly rational and are buying into common prejudices and that their position isn't just because they are smarter then everyone else but is also because they had a head start due to gender, racial or class privilege they get angry and see this as an attack on themselves.  So they jump on dumb rationalizations like "the dumb broads are just biologically inferior that's why they disagree with me."  These beliefs flatter their egos, causing their pride to grow and thus become more and more likely to take greater and greater offense over smaller and smaller bits of criticism until they become full blown misogynists.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2017, 04:51:24 am by Skybison »

Offline Lana Reverse

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #140 on: October 10, 2017, 12:10:22 pm »
Okay, seriously. Why do you think Damore is sexist?
"She" asks after over 130 posts of people describing, often in minute detail, why they think this guy is sexist.

Just in case there was even a shred of doubt that this is yet another Ultimate Dragon sock.

I'd like you to please stop making accusations that you can't back up. And that goes for all of you.

Back on topic, I ask because from what I see, a lot of it is people making gargantuan leaps in logic or outright unsubstantiated assumptions. That's the point I was trying to make when I responded to Tol's three questions. I was hoping at least some of you would understand the frustration I was feeling in regards to people constantly interpreting Damore and his memo in really unflattering ways, often ignoring or rationalizing away evidence that doesn't fit their narrative in the process. At least, that's how I saw it. And the unwarranted attacks on my intelligence and character certainly didn't help.

When I asked why, I was offering each poster who views Damore as sexist a chance to state and justify their views, to try and convince me that their arguments have merit, and that they were based on actual evidence rather than preexisting assumptions. A chance to prove that I was incorrect in my views about their beliefs. So go ahead, make your case. I'm all ears.
I also pissed in an old woman's sauce pan when I was a child. Have you?

Offline ironbite

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #141 on: October 10, 2017, 03:42:09 pm »
You're an idiot.

Ironbite-just so we're clear.

Offline Askold

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #142 on: October 10, 2017, 04:22:15 pm »
Okay, seriously. Why do you think Damore is sexist?

Well if I had to guess I say Damore is sexist because of pride.  Guys like him prize reason and intelligence and rationality and want to see themselves as the embodiment of such things.  But human beings are irrational and the smarter someone is the better they are at rationalizing their irrationality.  So when the big mean feminists and SJWs come along and tell them they aren't perfectly rational and are buying into common prejudices and that their position isn't just because they are smarter then everyone else but is also because they had a head start due to gender, racial or class privilege they get angry and see this as an attack on themselves.  So they jump on dumb rationalizations like "the dumb broads are just biologically inferior that's why they disagree with me."  These beliefs flatter their egos, causing their pride to grow and thus become more and more likely to take greater and greater offense over smaller and smaller bits of criticism until they become full blown misogynists.

I think you are touching on something important. There's that quote on how as long as you tell the poorest white man that he's still better than any black man he'll empty his pockets out for you. And really, that is something that appeals to people in all kinds of bigotry. If you feel unwanted, are poor, can't get a date or otherwise are down on your luck it can be a great distraction to use hate to fill the emptiness inside your heart.

It's not YOUR fault that things are bad. It is the OTHER who is to blame for your misery. YOU are not a bad person, it is the OTHER who is worse than you are. No matter how bad things may seem, at least on some level you are a superiour being to the OTHER. And don't forget that they link up with others who are like them and get peer support.

That's how Incels are born. Whether it is their fault or not that they couldn't get a girlfriend they seek to feel better by hating all women. Racists who live in a trailer park below poverty line believe that all will be better as long as immigrants and local "untermensch" are driven out or exterminated. Extremists who join KKK, Neo-Nazis or DAESH and become willing to commit crimes and even murder on other human beings because they have convinced themselves that it is the right and just thing to do for the OTHER.
No matter what happens, no matter what my last words may end up being, I want everyone to claim that they were:
"If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine."
Aww, you guys rock. :)  I feel the love... and the pitchforks and torches.  Tingly!

Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #143 on: October 10, 2017, 05:15:24 pm »
Okay, seriously. Why do you think Damore is sexist?
Damore is pushing a pseudo scientific ideology of biological determinism to suggest that women are, by virtue of them being women, less suited to certain jobs than men hence his belief that diversity policies designed to deal with the effects of structural sexism are doomed.

This horse is dead, stop beating it!

As to the labor rights issue, although his co workers certainly expressed their disagreement loudly with his views I haven't seen evidence that it was a pattern of bad behavior.

It was however a high profile case in a company that bills itself as promoting diversity, if I expressed racist views which were leaked while I work a company that publicly promotes education and rights for asylum seekers I don't think my employer would need to give me repeated warnings before they fired me for this behavior.


Offline Wurdulac

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #144 on: October 10, 2017, 06:32:41 pm »
I think you are touching on something important. There's that quote on how as long as you tell the poorest white man that he's still better than any black man he'll empty his pockets out for you. And really, that is something that appeals to people in all kinds of bigotry. If you feel unwanted, are poor, can't get a date or otherwise are down on your luck it can be a great distraction to use hate to fill the emptiness inside your heart.

It's not YOUR fault that things are bad. It is the OTHER who is to blame for your misery. YOU are not a bad person, it is the OTHER who is worse than you are. No matter how bad things may seem, at least on some level you are a superiour being to the OTHER. And don't forget that they link up with others who are like them and get peer support.

That's how Incels are born. Whether it is their fault or not that they couldn't get a girlfriend they seek to feel better by hating all women. Racists who live in a trailer park below poverty line believe that all will be better as long as immigrants and local "untermensch" are driven out or exterminated. Extremists who join KKK, Neo-Nazis or DAESH and become willing to commit crimes and even murder on other human beings because they have convinced themselves that it is the right and just thing to do for the OTHER.

Huh.  So, either through a decent upbringing or just depression it seems I barely avoided becoming one of those shitheads.

Good to know.
Then again, I could be wrong.

Offline ironbite

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #145 on: October 10, 2017, 06:41:31 pm »
Believe the former newbie/lurker.  Cause the other is a mite depressing.

Offline Askold

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #146 on: October 11, 2017, 03:29:14 am »
Huh.  So, either through a decent upbringing or just depression it seems I barely avoided becoming one of those shitheads.

Good to know.

Obviously it doesn't happen to everyone but based on what I've seen a lot of people who join extremist groups do so because they are looking for validation. Some seek validation for their bigotry, some just seek validation for existing.

Unfortunately those groups aren't healthy and even the ones who just joined club "hasn't kissed a girl and is tired of everyone making fun of it" because they wanted peer support are going to start taking in the hateful beliefs merely because they will be surrounded by them all the time. Unless they get out fast enough.
No matter what happens, no matter what my last words may end up being, I want everyone to claim that they were:
"If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine."
Aww, you guys rock. :)  I feel the love... and the pitchforks and torches.  Tingly!

Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #147 on: October 11, 2017, 04:49:59 am »
Huh.  So, either through a decent upbringing or just depression it seems I barely avoided becoming one of those shitheads.

Good to know.

Obviously it doesn't happen to everyone but based on what I've seen a lot of people who join extremist groups do so because they are looking for validation. Some seek validation for their bigotry, some just seek validation for existing.

Unfortunately those groups aren't healthy and even the ones who just joined club "hasn't kissed a girl and is tired of everyone making fun of it" because they wanted peer support are going to start taking in the hateful beliefs merely because they will be surrounded by them all the time. Unless they get out fast enough.
The thing is, unlike the case with real drugs, one set of bigoted beliefs can be like  an entry level drug. A lot of the alt right guys got their start in sexism, Damore our google bro certainly fits that pattern. Vents his sexism, gets rejected in a severe way by his own employer no less, becomes more embittered.

A month passes and he starts tweeting about how cool senior officer positions in the KKK sound in tabletop RPG terms. Take one Gamergater, add salt, get a fresh baked salty Gruppenf├╝hrer. Just like pretzels.

Offline The_Queen

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #148 on: October 13, 2017, 12:50:39 pm »
I don't know much about Zoe, other than that she apparently made an overrated game, but the same goes for her.
I am in awe of someone who chases drama on the internet as much as you seem to and you doesn't know the skinny about Gamergate.



This is my totally not skeptical face!

Lana is familiar with cultural Marxism (historically known as "cultural Bolshevism" or "cultural Judaism"), SJWs, space spaces, power + prejudice, James Damore, the Alt-right, and "alleged sexism," but unfamiliar with GamerGate. Bull-to-the-shit.
Does anyone take Donald Trump seriously, anymore?

Offline The_Queen

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Re: Google facing multiple lawsuits
« Reply #149 on: October 13, 2017, 01:06:26 pm »
What.

Okay, this little theory of yours... it holds absolutely no water. Damore was fired on August 7. The plaintiffs didn't file their suit against Google until over a month later. So unless time suddenly became non-linear and nobody told me, what you're suggesting is factually wrong. How hard is it to check a couple of dates?

Double post, your explanation is more spurious drivel that isn't convincing. It isn't uncommon in big suits to try to settle without filing. Very often, litigation begins with a demand letter saying "your client sucks ass, give my client money." The two sides talk, discuss the merits of the case and go back and forth. This can last several months as counsel attempts to settle prior to filing the case. Alternatively, it isn't uncommon to wait as late as you can before filing, only filing a few days before the statute of limitations. Again, in either hypo, Google would know of the threat of litigation when Damore wrote his sexist tirade; in fact, I first learned of the suit the day I learned of Damore's memo, on a drive home while listening to NPR.

Also, my employment law is rusty, but I believe the plaintiffs must first file a claim with the EEOC 150 or so days before a private attorney may prosecute the claim. Ergo, Google knew this suit was coming.

You looked for the first argument to make yourself look right without giving a solitary shit of its veracity. This is why I insult you, because I do not see enough good-faith on your end to actually warrant the investment of my time. Cheerio.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2017, 01:07:58 pm by The_Queen »
Does anyone take Donald Trump seriously, anymore?