Wheeled life-forms and intelligent design?

[MadCatTLX]

So I was reading the Wikipedia article for "Rotating locomotion in living systems" and found this:

Molecular biologist Robin Holliday has written that the apparent lack of biological wheels argues against creationist or intelligent design accounts of the diversity of life—for, free of the limitations imposed by evolution, an intelligent creator would be expected to deploy wheels wherever they would be of use.

(Fourth paragraph of "Biological barriers to wheeled organisms" section)

Something about the wording made me laugh.



As the Wiki article says, I think the probability of a wheel life-form existing naturally is low, but not impossible. Do you all think it would require a god or human engineering to exist? I was wondering what you all think about about the possibility of a wheeled animal. What would it be like? What kind of environment would it live in? Predator or prey? What size?

A natural wheel would obviously lack a tire, but I doubt it would be just a smooth disk. If natural wheel formed I think the wheel itself would be shaped much like an old all-metal tractor wheel like these:



One possibility is a combination of both wheels and legs either by having wheels in the foot or having legs and wheels, being able to retract the one not being used. If you take wheels further into tracks then you might get a "living tank" of a creature.




As well as working on land tracks can be used for propulsion in water. This is shown in amphibious vehicles, using there tracks instead of adding a propeller and all the extra drive gear needed for it.

And lastly, here's a couple examples of humans adding wheels to existing animals that were injured.



<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fwv8-QWVsz8" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fwv8-QWVsz8</a>


(I wasn't sure whether to put this in the R&P or S&T sections, so I chose here because it involves religion and is more likely to get noticed than in the somewhat neglected S&T section. If it's in the wrong section please move it.)

[SpaceProg]

A life form could have wheels if it wasn't limited by attached muscles.  Otherwise it'd just get all wound up and spin backwards eventually.  Maybe some kind of fluid conductor like between the synapses of the brain...

Huh... *muses*

[Fpqxz]

Wikipedia has articles on stuff that I would never even have thought of.  And I actually write/edit articles there from time to time.

That quote made me LOL though.

[Yaezakura]

Well, the His Dark Materials trilogy of books actually has a "wheeled" life form in it. In truth, the wheels are super-durable seed pods from gigantic trees. It's a sort of symbiotic relationship--the seed pods need to be "driven" on the hard lava-rock "roads" that crisscross the planet to be broken up and planted, while the species uses the pods as their primary mode of transportation. The seed pods have little holes in them that the species has adapted claws to hook into. They propel themselves with their other two limbs, pushing themselves forward somewhat like a skateboarder.

[DarkfireTaimatsu]

I keep thinking about the wheeled creatures in The Andalite Chronicles. Mortrons, weren't they? And the wheels weren't the weirdest part! Their heads could fly off and fly around like pterodactyls! And if you cut them apart, they'd grow into completely whole creatures again, doubling in the process!

Animorphs sure got creative sometimes. I wouldn't've minded a bestiary for that universe.

[Sylvana]

I think in a natural environment lacking roads wheels would be at a disadvantage.
Also I cannot think of how a natural version of a wheel would exist. The primary problem is that the wheel itself would have to be completely detached from the organism in order to freely rotate. However, a symbiotic relationship between two different organisms could work. I have a hard time imagining how it would come about, but I can see it existing and working far better than a single organism being wheeled somehow.

[Art Vandelay]

If actively and indefinitely rotating body parts were possible, I highly doubt wheels would be one of the applications, as legs are almost always superior at negotiating any land other than completely flat terrain. While I've no doubt they'd have their uses, it would likely be as propellers for both aquatic and flying life forms, as in both cases they're more efficient than a back-and-forth motion used by fish to swim and the wings of all flying animals, and impellers for internal processes, such as circulation and breathing.

I'm not saying wheels definitely wouldn't at least have some sort of evolutionary niche, just that the underlying process would likely be far more commonly serving other functions.

[speshuled67]

i think the invention of the wheel or any of the other 5 simple machines (screw, lever, ramp, pulley, or wedge) implies some intelligence, but because of their simplicity they fit a basic need of a reasonable being. evolution is about simply outpacing the abilities of a competing species or neighbor. including higher constructs of advancement shows that these inventions were born to make the simple tasks of life easier.

if anything, these 6 simple machines refute ID. if life needed wheels (which were invented along with the axle to make hard, driven paths more passable) to survive, then the 'creator' would have included them in the design for its creation.

if there was a creator, and it wanted us to advance, it would have given us rollerskates...


edit
(my point is that wheels would be included in an omnipotent design if ID was true. life would be made to the specifications of the nature of the creation, so advancement would be unnecessary)

[Witchyjoshy]

There's a reason we're trying to give robots legs instead of wheels

[Yla]

That's a good argument against creationism indeed. Yes, wheels are only useful on flat plains, but there they offer the advantage that as soon you're moving, you continue moving without additional energy expenditure. (Practically, you'd need some muscle tension to maintain stance). Assuming divine creation, flat plains would be a given. There are obstacles of course, but if you can also lift individual wheels off the ground, you have almost the same navigative ability as simple legs.

There's a reason we're trying to give robots legs instead of wheels

In addition to, not instead.

[MadCatTLX]

There's a reason we're trying to give robots legs instead of wheels

In addition to, not instead.

[Cataclysm]

Would the flagellum kind of count?

[MadCatTLX]

Would the flagellum kind of count?

The wiki article covers flagellum, which are the only known form of "rotating locomotion" that is known to exist in nature. I don't think they count as wheels though.

If actively and indefinitely rotating body parts were possible, I highly doubt wheels would be one of the applications, as legs are almost always superior at negotiating any land other than completely flat terrain. While I've no doubt they'd have their uses, it would likely be as propellers for both aquatic and flying life forms, as in both cases they're more efficient than a back-and-forth motion used by fish to swim and the wings of all flying animals, and impellers for internal processes, such as circulation and breathing.

I'm not saying wheels definitely wouldn't at least have some sort of evolutionary niche, just that the underlying process would likely be far more commonly serving other functions.

The wiki article said that propellers were actually less efficient than the oscillating motion of bird wings and fish tails. The reason we use them is that they much easier to operate mechanically, though ornithopters and "mermaid" diving fins exist. It may be more efficient the bigger it gets in scale, since it probably takes less energy to turn a propeller than make a container ship wag it's tail or a 747 flap it's wings.

[Art Vandelay]

The wiki article said that propellers were actually less efficient than the oscillating motion of bird wings and fish tails. The reason we use them is that they much easier to operate mechanically, though ornithopters and "mermaid" diving fins exist. It may be more efficient the bigger it gets in scale, since it probably takes less energy to turn a propeller than make a container ship wag it's tail or a 747 flap it's wings.

So it does. Whelp, there goes that idea.