Author Topic: US to have fewer grad students after July 2012  (Read 4843 times)

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Offline gyeonghwa

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Re: US to have fewer grad students after July 2012
« Reply #15 on: April 14, 2012, 02:56:33 pm »
Except, graduate school is a luxury. It is what undergraduate school used to be. A bachelor's degree is a necessity, a master's, not so much.

Not so much, if you take into account law school, med school, vet school, etc are all "graduate schools." In addition, some fields (many of the sciences, for example) require advanced degrees in order to get a job. (That's one reason I majored in chemical engineering rather than chemistry.)

^. Anthropology/Archaeology requires grad school because most higher paying jobs need people with more experience.
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Offline Auri-El

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Re: US to have fewer grad students after July 2012
« Reply #16 on: April 14, 2012, 03:08:17 pm »
Fair enough, but my point was more that you don't need grad school to get a decent job. Maybe not the job you'd like, but a job that supports you and your family. Getting a job you enjoy in and of itself is a luxury, imo.

Offline Dantes Virgil

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Re: US to have fewer grad students after July 2012
« Reply #17 on: April 16, 2012, 04:55:51 pm »
I agree, Kali, though I don't want to, lol.  I think a job you like should be a goal for everyone, but you're right in that getting a decent job does not require grad school.  By the same token, though, getting a decent job that can support a family doesn't require a college degree, necessarily, either.  There are loads of skilled trades that make more money, and those jobs usually can't be outsourced.

Offline Yla

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Re: US to have fewer grad students after July 2012
« Reply #18 on: April 16, 2012, 05:05:25 pm »
What happened to higher education being a worthy goal by itself and a gateway to academic research, not a preparation for a job?
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Re: US to have fewer grad students after July 2012
« Reply #19 on: April 16, 2012, 06:09:56 pm »
What happened to higher education being a worthy goal by itself and a gateway to academic research, not a preparation for a job?

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Offline Dantes Virgil

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Re: US to have fewer grad students after July 2012
« Reply #20 on: April 16, 2012, 06:12:47 pm »
What happened to higher education being a worthy goal by itself and a gateway to academic research, not a preparation for a job?

As universities began to cater more towards a business model instead of an academic/research model, the student and families of students began to be treated as a "customer" -- and that develops the attitude of "what are we getting for our money?"  It's part of a huge debate going on in academia right now about how we get students to reconsider the value of a university beyond a dollar sign or a job.  I'm developing a new course or my university this summer on that very topic.  There's been a lot of interesting work on the subject recently, including a controversial book called Academically Adrift that questions whether students are even learning anything at all at universities or whether we're simply taking their tuition dollars and rubber stamping them through, provided they can jump through enough hoops. 

Offline TheL

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Re: US to have fewer grad students after July 2012
« Reply #21 on: April 16, 2012, 09:19:37 pm »
I vote we pass a law that says all higher education tuition and additional fees cannot exceed the amount of $10,000 dollars per student. Also, all student loan debts will cease accruing interest after the sum of $5,000 dollars over the principal has been reached and can be covered by bankruptcy again.

Honey, I love you, but you know numbers aren't your friend.  The amount you're suggesting for a full 4-year degree isn't even remotely feasible.


Now, for all non-dorm expenses to total $2000 or less per full-time semester would make sense.  That's what my undergrad education cost just 5 years ago, and still only adds up to $16,000 over 4 years.  Unfortunately, it requires states to actually have and provide money for schools.

Education dollars go to K-12 schools, community colleges, AND state universities.  Every cut in education spending hurts all of those institutions.
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Offline MadCatTLX

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Re: US to have fewer grad students after July 2012
« Reply #22 on: April 16, 2012, 09:33:05 pm »
I vote we pass a law that says all higher education tuition and additional fees cannot exceed the amount of $10,000 dollars per student. Also, all student loan debts will cease accruing interest after the sum of $5,000 dollars over the principal has been reached and can be covered by bankruptcy again.

Honey, I love you, but you know numbers aren't your friend.  The amount you're suggesting for a full 4-year degree isn't even remotely feasible.


Now, for all non-dorm expenses to total $2000 or less per full-time semester would make sense.  That's what my undergrad education cost just 5 years ago, and still only adds up to $16,000 over 4 years.  Unfortunately, it requires states to actually have and provide money for schools.

Education dollars go to K-12 schools, community colleges, AND state universities.  Every cut in education spending hurts all of those institutions.

four out of every three people aren't good with fractions :P.

Spend money on education? Are you crazy!? We gotta dump funds into the military so we destroy and destabilize third world countries then take their shit! CAUSE THIS IS 'MURICA!
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Offline Morgenleoht

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Re: US to have fewer grad students after July 2012
« Reply #23 on: April 17, 2012, 07:29:51 am »
What happened to higher education being a worthy goal by itself and a gateway to academic research, not a preparation for a job?

As universities began to cater more towards a business model instead of an academic/research model, the student and families of students began to be treated as a "customer" -- and that develops the attitude of "what are we getting for our money?"  It's part of a huge debate going on in academia right now about how we get students to reconsider the value of a university beyond a dollar sign or a job.  I'm developing a new course or my university this summer on that very topic.  There's been a lot of interesting work on the subject recently, including a controversial book called Academically Adrift that questions whether students are even learning anything at all at universities or whether we're simply taking their tuition dollars and rubber stamping them through, provided they can jump through enough hoops.

This. I spent 13 years at uni (I love being Aussie and able to defer my payments until I make a set income) and saw from 2000-2012 how the culture's gone from semi-academic to totally business-oriented. You want to know how I figured this out? I did humanities. Every time the School of Humanities had a gathering, we got cookies, tea and coffee with the fanciest thing ever done a Subway platter. School of Business or Medicine? Those fuckers got sandwiches, fruit, cookies, juice, tea and coffee, and even hot food. I made it a point of honour to scavenge from them whenever I could get away with it.
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Offline Dantes Virgil

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Re: US to have fewer grad students after July 2012
« Reply #24 on: April 17, 2012, 07:08:31 pm »
There's definitely more of an operating budget in the business schools instead of the Humanities (where I work).  Here, though, Health Sciences has it all.  Full of scandal too, but damn they have the cash to blow!