Fairly substantial massacre in Egypt.

[PosthumanHeresy]

At this point, I almost would prefer the first world nations marching in and taking complete control of the Middle East. Not forever, but at least until everyone living there now is dead of old age. They've proven themselves unable to handle freedom and independence at all, so it should be taken, just like any criminals'. Sure, there's good people, but they'll just be oppressed and murdered by the people with power, so, fuck you, Middle East.

Oh yay, the white man's burden strikes again! I'm sure it'll work out just as well as it did in the past.

More like, "Could we, oh, idk, perhaps help out instead of just shipping shit there and praying that works?"

Yeah, no.

What you're arguing was the same argument that the European countries used to justify colonialism. Taking control of countries and continents because the natives can't do it properly. It worked ever so well, and totally didn't lead to issues that are still going on now, hundreds of years later.

I understand the issues, and I understand how it can go in the shitter, but things are, well, pretty damn bad already.

[Art Vandelay]

I'd support it as a UN effort, not 'Murica.

And where would the troops and funding ultimately come from?

It wouldn't be American-controlled, though, but UN. And at least we'd be doing something good with our insane amount of military spending. I can't imagine most members here support theocracies, oppressive dictatorships and the general insanity that is the Middle East.

Yeah, did you notice how I wasn't objecting to who's leading it, but rather the cost? Hell, going through the UN would be even more expensive, since it would be another layer of administrative costs to deal with.

[PosthumanHeresy]

I'd support it as a UN effort, not 'Murica.

And where would the troops and funding ultimately come from?

It wouldn't be American-controlled, though, but UN. And at least we'd be doing something good with our insane amount of military spending. I can't imagine most members here support theocracies, oppressive dictatorships and the general insanity that is the Middle East.

Yeah, did you notice how I wasn't objecting to who's leading it, but rather the cost? Hell, going through the UN would be even more expensive, since it would be another layer of administrative costs to deal with.

On the other hand, going to a much larger war (an entire region) might actually help the economy.

[Art Vandelay]

On the other hand, going to a much larger war (an entire region) might actually help the economy.

Oh sure, just like Iraq and Afghanistan.

[PosthumanHeresy]

On the other hand, going to a much larger war (an entire region) might actually help the economy.

Oh sure, just like Iraq and Afghanistan.

That was a tiny thing, which was destined to be crap.

[Art Vandelay]

On the other hand, going to a much larger war (an entire region) might actually help the economy.

Oh sure, just like Iraq and Afghanistan.

That was a tiny thing, which was destined to be crap.

Indeed. Just imagine the effects magnified a thousand fold. Needless to say, not so good.

[PosthumanHeresy]

On the other hand, going to a much larger war (an entire region) might actually help the economy.

Oh sure, just like Iraq and Afghanistan.

That was a tiny thing, which was destined to be crap.

Indeed. Just imagine the effects magnified a thousand fold. Needless to say, not so good.

On the other hand, remember World War 2 and the Great Depression.

[Art Vandelay]

On the other hand, remember World War 2 and the Great Depression.

The pre-war build up? That had a nice side effect of boosting the economy. The actual war, however, everthing from coal to clothes to food, was hugely expensive and rationed. Every male between the ages of 18-30 was conscripted and all savings went into war bonds. People were really living it up back then.

[PosthumanHeresy]

On the other hand, remember World War 2 and the Great Depression.

The pre-war build up? That had a nice side effect of boosting the economy. The actual war, however, everthing from coal to clothes to food, was hugely expensive and rationed. Every male between the ages of 18-30 was conscripted and all savings went into war bonds. People were really living it up back then.

I'm not saying to bring back the draft. The buildup helped, though, and I'd actually like to see the option for people to buy war bonds to come back.

[Osama bin Bambi]

At this point, I almost would prefer the first world nations marching in and taking complete control of the Middle East. Not forever, but at least until everyone living there now is dead of old age. They've proven themselves unable to handle freedom and independence at all, so it should be taken, just like any criminals'. Sure, there's good people, but they'll just be oppressed and murdered by the people with power, so, fuck you, Middle East.

Oh yay, the white man's burden strikes again! I'm sure it'll work out just as well as it did in the past.

More like, "Could we, oh, idk, perhaps help out instead of just shipping shit there and praying that works?"

Yeah, no.

What you're arguing was the same argument that the European countries used to justify colonialism. Taking control of countries and continents because the natives can't do it properly. It worked ever so well, and totally didn't lead to issues that are still going on now, hundreds of years later.

Can I just point out the irony that the whole reason why Middle Eastern states even exist today is because the League of Nations divided them up into Mandates and handed them over to Britain and France to colonize lead to modernity? And that the Arab leaders, who were originally seeking British help during WWI as they rebelled against the Ottoman Empire, were cheated out of it by the completely secret Sykes-Picot Agreement?

[Art Vandelay]

On the other hand, remember World War 2 and the Great Depression.

The pre-war build up? That had a nice side effect of boosting the economy. The actual war, however, everything from coal to clothes to food, was hugely expensive and rationed. Every male between the ages of 18-30 was conscripted and all savings went into war bonds. People were really living it up back then.

I'm not saying to bring back the draft. The buildup helped, though, and I'd actually like to see the option for people to buy war bonds to come back.

The point is that living in a war economy fucking sucks. Not only is supporting a huge war like that is a massive drain, but also said war becomes #1 priority while the citizens' needs come second. That's why rationing becomes a thing.

Then of course there's the government, and the astronomical amount of debt it would have to wrack up to pay for such a massive war. Like I said, it would turn the entire 1st world into Greece within a week.

[Her3tiK]

We should give every Middle Eastern nation nuclear warheads and delivery systems. So many, in fact, that nothing remains of the region but a glass parking lot.

[Undecided]

We should give every Middle Eastern nation nuclear warheads and delivery systems. So many, in fact, that nothing remains of the region but a glass parking lot.

We should glass every place that more than a hundred people or so die at once, just to make sure that no residual violence escapes the scene.

[kefkaownsall]

At this point, I almost would prefer the first world nations marching in and taking complete control of the Middle East. Not forever, but at least until everyone living there now is dead of old age. They've proven themselves unable to handle freedom and independence at all, so it should be taken, just like any criminals'. Sure, there's good people, but they'll just be oppressed and murdered by the people with power, so, fuck you, Middle East.

Oh yay, the white man's burden strikes again! I'm sure it'll work out just as well as it did in the past.

More like, "Could we, oh, idk, perhaps help out instead of just shipping shit there and praying that works?"

Yeah, no.

What you're arguing was the same argument that the European countries used to justify colonialism. Taking control of countries and continents because the natives can't do it properly. It worked ever so well, and totally didn't lead to issues that are still going on now, hundreds of years later.

Can I just point out the irony that the whole reason why Middle Eastern states even exist today is because the League of Nations divided them up into Mandates and handed them over to Britain and France to colonize lead to modernity? And that the Arab leaders, who were originally seeking British help during WWI as they rebelled against the Ottoman Empire, were cheated out of it by the completely secret Sykes-Picot Agreement?

Also even after being a colony for 5 years France didn't see the irony of not giving Mali and Morocco and Vietnam self rule

[PosthumanHeresy]

We should give every Middle Eastern nation nuclear warheads and delivery systems. So many, in fact, that nothing remains of the region but a glass parking lot.

Sometimes that does seem like the saner option. I still think it's possible to drag their asses into the modern world, but not without, well, a full takeover.