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Community => Society and History => Topic started by: Askold on July 07, 2016, 03:52:58 am

Title: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Askold on July 07, 2016, 03:52:58 am
http://www.startribune.com/aftermath-of-officer-involved-shooting-captured-on-phone-video/385789251/#1

I am honestly confused as to why USA still hasn't fixed this shit.

Quote
“asked him for license and registration. He told him that it was in his wallet, but he had a pistol on him because he’s licensed to carry. The officer said don’t move. As he was putting his hands back up, the officer shot him in the arm four or five times.”

Unless the witness is lying it appears that when the officer combined "this person has a gun" and "black person" he went into panic mode and shot the guy. Though it is also possible that it was just a case of "this person has a gun" that made the cop go into panic mode and overreact. (If you consider shooting a person over imagined movement or twitch as overreaction.)

Aren't there cases like this all over the place? I mean it appears that the BLM movement also has its share of assholes but you would think that the added publicity would encourage the police to do at least some changes in their "training" to reduce these kinds of incidents.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: dpareja on July 07, 2016, 05:07:04 am
Because if you criticise police then you're racist against white people and if you say a bad word about guns you hate America.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Askold on July 07, 2016, 05:11:25 am
But what if non-white people have guns? When was the last time NRA and associates defended their right to guns?

EDIT: The statistics in this article are thought provoking.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36732908?ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbcnews&ns_source=facebook

Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Damen on July 07, 2016, 06:46:06 am
But what if non-white people have guns? When was the last time NRA and associates defended their right to guns?

EDIT: The statistics in this article are thought provoking.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36732908?ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbcnews&ns_source=facebook

Last I heard on the NRA, as of 2016 their membership was 40% women and as for demographics, 40% were minorities comprised of predominantly Asians and Hispanics. And the average age has dropped to around 40 - 45 and is comprised of 23% Democrats.

I can provide a link if requested, but I found these numbers on Ammoland.com and that site is so right wing it makes my skin crawl. These numbers seem to be gathered by Friends of NRA.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: RavynousHunter on July 07, 2016, 07:00:33 am
But what if non-white people have guns?

You shoot them, obviously.  You never know if they're some gangbanging atheist jihadi beaner come to take our jobs, institute Sharia law, and rape our white women.  Better safe than sorry.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Askold on July 07, 2016, 07:22:44 am
But what if non-white people have guns? When was the last time NRA and associates defended their right to guns?

EDIT: The statistics in this article are thought provoking.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36732908?ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbcnews&ns_source=facebook

Last I heard on the NRA, as of 2016 their membership was 40% women and as for demographics, 40% were minorities comprised of predominantly Asians and Hispanics. And the average age has dropped to around 40 - 45 and is comprised of 23% Democrats.

I can provide a link if requested, but I found these numbers on Ammoland.com and that site is so right wing it makes my skin crawl. These numbers seem to be gathered by Friends of NRA.

Not what I asked. NRA is big on open carry and concealed carry but when was the last time they defended a gun owner that had been shot (or otherwise bothered) by police for carrying a gun BUT also happened to be black?
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: ironbite on July 07, 2016, 09:07:28 am
And this isn't the first one this WEEK to have been shot while carrying a gun.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/alton-sterling-video_us_577d668ae4b0c590f7e7d2a7

The cops body cams somehow "fell off" during the struggle but there's video showing that they had him on the ground, shot him 3 times, demanded he get on the ground, then shot him another 3 times and then pulled the gun out of his pocket as he lay dying.

Ironbite-just...what the hell?
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Eiki-mun on July 07, 2016, 09:47:16 am
Prediction: none of these cops are going to be convicted of anything, they'll all get paid administrative leave, end up with the support of millions. And everyone is going to be shocked at these things. For some reason.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Damen on July 07, 2016, 04:58:46 pm
But what if non-white people have guns? When was the last time NRA and associates defended their right to guns?

EDIT: The statistics in this article are thought provoking.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36732908?ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbcnews&ns_source=facebook

Last I heard on the NRA, as of 2016 their membership was 40% women and as for demographics, 40% were minorities comprised of predominantly Asians and Hispanics. And the average age has dropped to around 40 - 45 and is comprised of 23% Democrats.

I can provide a link if requested, but I found these numbers on Ammoland.com and that site is so right wing it makes my skin crawl. These numbers seem to be gathered by Friends of NRA.

Not what I asked. NRA is big on open carry and concealed carry but when was the last time they defended a gun owner that had been shot (or otherwise bothered) by police for carrying a gun BUT also happened to be black?

Ah, my mistake.

Unfortunately, the NRA Civil Rights Defense Fund doesn't mention the ethnicity of the people in their cases and research is a pain in the ass on an unstable tablet. However, what did spring to mind was the NRA got Florida's SYG law expanded to include warning shots in time for Marissa Alexander's retrial. Saved her from 20 years in the pokey. That's the only once I can think of off hand; I don't typically pay attention to the persons skin colour and it's rarely mentioned in these cases.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Damen on July 07, 2016, 07:54:02 pm
Can't have silly things like justice when you've got quotas to fill and win /loss ratios to pad.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: dpareja on July 07, 2016, 07:57:35 pm
At this point, I don't think there's any amount of money someone could give me to get me to go to the US. The police are out of control and even though I'm the palest guy I know, I'd be afraid for my life if I even thought I saw a cop.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: dpareja on July 07, 2016, 08:32:29 pm
At this point, I don't think there's any amount of money someone could give me to get me to go to the US. The police are out of control and even though I'm the palest guy I know, I'd be afraid for my life if I even thought I saw a cop.
With hate crime skyrocketing, fascist parties gaining popularity, austerity measures, and anti-labour bills I'm be afraid Europe is gonna start looking like the US pretty soon.

I wouldn't go to Europe, either.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Ironchew on July 07, 2016, 09:14:13 pm
The police are out of control

No, they aren't. Police serve an elite few who, generously speaking, don't share the interests of most U.S. citizens. If they were truly out of control they would disappear pretty quickly.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: rookie on July 07, 2016, 11:46:53 pm
At this point, I don't think there's any amount of money someone could give me to get me to go to the US. The police are out of control and even though I'm the palest guy I know, I'd be afraid for my life if I even thought I saw a cop.

That's probably smart. The police districts here base pay raises on the amount of cities shot. Police officers here get very angry when their shifts ends abs anyone they shoot now doesn't count until tomorrow. A full 3/8 of the budget of most metropolitan police departments go towards bullets with another full half going to defense lawyers. Somalian pirates, Asian warlords, and most of Putin's cabinet have cycled through the United States for training on how to better shoot people. And Mad Max Fury Road was based loosely on the New Jersey Turnpike during rush hour. In fact, as I now sit here on my pricy there's a cop car driving by and he wan
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: rookie on July 07, 2016, 11:52:57 pm
Sorry for the break there. Cop shot me a few times.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: dpareja on July 08, 2016, 12:06:57 am
Sorry for the break there. Cop shot me a few times.

Only shot at you, I hope, not actually hit? If he hit you, I hope you recover.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Tolpuddle Martyr on July 08, 2016, 01:16:49 am

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgxWzPVXSoc

Poor woman.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Askold on July 08, 2016, 01:50:34 am
And now for the backlash: http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Protests-in-Dallas-Over-Alton-Sterling-Death-385784431.html

Four police officers dead, several more injured as snipers opened fire on the police during a peaceful protest.

Quote
"Tonight it appears that two snipers shot ten police officers from elevated positions during the protest/rally. Three officers are deceased, two are in surgery and three are in critical condition. An intensive search for suspects is currently underway. No suspects are in custody at this time. We ask that any citizen with information regarding the shootings tonight call 214-671-3482. We will provide more information once it is available. Please keep us in your thoughts and prayers tonight."


...This is not going to make things better. And it's not like we know that those who got shot had done anything wrong to deserve it (much like many of the victims of police violence but that's not the point.)

So yeah, let's just make the divide between the police and the rest of the people wider and make them think that they are at war with the people of USA... Maybe the militarization of police will go up another notch...
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Svata on July 08, 2016, 02:05:19 am
Yeah... soon as i can, i think i'll gtfo. Shit's getting far too hairy for me.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: dpareja on July 08, 2016, 02:29:19 am
Yeah... soon as i can, i think i'll gtfo. Shit's getting far too hairy for me.

Just drive north. (Unless you're in Detroit, then drive south.)
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Tolpuddle Martyr on July 08, 2016, 02:46:29 am
Holy shit.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Skybison on July 08, 2016, 03:10:39 am
To be fair, it's not like Canada doesn't have issues with police brutality.  Maybe not as bad, but that's not a high bar.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Søren on July 08, 2016, 03:53:57 am
Bet is either on BLM or whites putting the heat on BLM.

Either way shits gonna get fun.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Askold on July 08, 2016, 04:03:21 am
http://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-36743033?ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbcnews&ns_source=facebook

Update: Five officers dead, six injured.

The police are negotiating and/or having a shootout with a suspect who claims to have explosives and threatens to use them.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: dpareja on July 08, 2016, 04:20:40 am
To be fair, it's not like Canada doesn't have issues with police brutality.  Maybe not as bad, but that's not a high bar.

I don't feel afraid when I see a police officer, nor would I feel afraid to call the police if I felt it necessary. That's a damn sight better than the US.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Askold on July 08, 2016, 04:25:15 am
In comparison a comment from a Finn:

Quote
All this police brutality reminds me of a night some years back. I wake up to a commotion outside and see two men chasing a third guy to the nearby courtyard and start beating the living shit out of him.

So of course I call the cops. A couple of minutes later they arrive. The moment they see the car the muggers just drop what they're doing, politely greet the officers and walk to the back of the car with hands clearly in view. Cops quickly check for weapons and help them to the back of the van. Meanwhile the guy getting the beating quietly sneaks off.

The professionalism on all sides was pretty impressive.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Tolpuddle Martyr on July 08, 2016, 04:35:39 am
Quote
The suspect who was involved in a stand-off with police in a Dallas parking garage is now dead, according to multiple local media reports.

Police have not confirmed the reports.

The suspect was one of four believed to have launched a co-ordinated attack to kill Dallas police officers. The other three suspects are all in custody. (http://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-36743033?ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbcnews&ns_source=facebook)

Welp, now we get to find out who's bright idea this was.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Svata on July 08, 2016, 05:38:14 am
Yeah... soon as i can, i think i'll gtfo. Shit's getting far too hairy for me.

Just drive north. (Unless you're in Detroit, then drive south.)

And therein lies the problem. Also, I wanna finish tech school first.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: RavynousHunter on July 08, 2016, 09:07:10 am
I wanna say that I called it, but that'd be just a little bit crass.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Canadian Mojo on July 08, 2016, 09:32:40 am
I wanna say that I called it, but that'd be just a little bit crass.

Yup.

About as surprising as 9/11 was. The incident itself comes as a shock, that it happened, not in the least. Blowback is a bitch and about as predictable as the tides.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: RavynousHunter on July 08, 2016, 09:35:15 am
I just wonder how big the mountain of corpses, on both sides, is going to get before someone realizes that the system is fucking broken and finally gets around to fixing it.  How many are going to have to die because of the bloodlust of a few control freaks?
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Canadian Mojo on July 08, 2016, 09:45:25 am
Some people walk to the edge of an abyss and back away. Others jump off.

I'm not sure which way this is going to go but the heavily ingrained cowboy culture is going to push it in a certain direction quickly.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Askold on July 08, 2016, 10:11:29 am
I have already seen comments to the tune of "time to choose sides, start carrying a long arm." And I have no doubt that things will get worse before they get better.

Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Askold on July 08, 2016, 10:32:50 am
Suspect was killed by a robot! Now it is only a matter of time before we see armed police drones in the streets and skies of USA. http://insider.foxnews.com/2016/07/08/dallas-police-chief-says-ambush-suspect-killed-blast-bomb-robot

Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: ironbite on July 08, 2016, 11:19:43 am
What do you mean matter of time?  We already have 'em.  They're being used.  Just not as publicly yet.

Ironbite-police get first crack on surplus military hardware, often without their consent it's just thrown at 'em.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: dpareja on July 08, 2016, 12:45:04 pm
Yeah... soon as i can, i think i'll gtfo. Shit's getting far too hairy for me.

Just drive north. (Unless you're in Detroit, then drive south.)

And therein lies the problem. Also, I wanna finish tech school first.

Fair enough; I don't drive either. So take a train, take a bus, take a plane... just go north.

As for tech school, we've got a pretty good one where I live, but housing is stupidly expensive where I live.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: dpareja on July 08, 2016, 10:29:08 pm
(http://i.cbc.ca/1.3670191.1467985046!/fileImage/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/original_620/joe-walsh-reacts-to-dallas-shootings.jpg)
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: niam2023 on July 08, 2016, 11:46:01 pm
(http://i.cbc.ca/1.3670191.1467985046!/fileImage/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/original_620/joe-walsh-reacts-to-dallas-shootings.jpg)

With what, Walsh? Did you slap together Metal Gear Excelsus in your basement? There is no "Real America" to come after anyone.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Art Vandelay on July 09, 2016, 12:35:07 am
When you're making unironic references to Sarah Palin, you should probably just stop talking about politics. Find something to do that's less embarassing, like whacking off to My Little Pony fanfiction, or shitting your pants at family gatherings.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Cloud3514 on July 09, 2016, 03:00:20 am
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sJHvppVEBTY

So this appeared on my Facebook wall. Apparently I haven't heard and don't know how to thoroughly debunk every one of these rhetorical point I guess because this is just tired fucking rhetoric that's been spewed out since BLM first showed up.

Side note: The only bit in there I hadn't seen before is that approximately the same number of unarmed whites are killed as unarmed blacks, which, as opposed to the video claiming this shows that white and black people are killed at the same rate, means that unarmed black people are killed by police FIVE TIMES MORE than unarmed white people.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: TheContrarian on July 10, 2016, 06:15:32 am
Side note: The only bit in there I hadn't seen before is that approximately the same number of unarmed whites are killed as unarmed blacks, which, as opposed to the video claiming this shows that white and black people are killed at the same rate, means that unarmed black people are killed by police FIVE TIMES MORE than unarmed white people.

I bet you can't name any of the white ones without the help of google.
I also bet you can rattle off the names of about a dozen of unarmed black people killed by police.

I wonder why this could possibly be?
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Askold on July 10, 2016, 06:20:35 am
...Because unarmed black person is much more likely to get shot by police in USA than a white person and this is just one point of data pointing towards a systematic bias in US police?
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Cloud3514 on July 11, 2016, 04:07:49 am
(https://external-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/safe_image.php?d=AQCyHr-whDgAjXX1&w=660&h=520&url=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.huffingtonpost.com%2Fasset%2F2000_1000%2F5782c4731a00002700dd084a.jpeg%3Fcache%3Dgpdsmcw9er)

The journalist in me is gushing at this picture as a piece of photojournalism, but that's not what i want to talk about.

Various folks are comparing this to the famous Tienanmen Square picture. I think the comparison is hyperbole, but it does come across very similarly. We have a peaceful protester who is very obviously not a threat to anyone standing opposite of police officers who are excessively equipped for the situation.

And yet, the response from the usual suspects is exactly what I knew it would be.

"She's blocking traffic!"
"She's breaking the law!"
"The cops need to protects themselves!"
"The cops told the protesters to disperse!"

And so on and so fucking forth. Because apparently I should be more worried about a 100 or so pound woman standing peacefully than the small army of cops wearing gear more akin to an invasion force than a police service, driving around armored combat vehicles, using a sound cannon that was designed for use in war zones, carrying military issue weapons (with tear gas probably prepared for use in a moment's notice) and being more heavily armored than soldiers in Iraq. Yup, these guys are totally there to keep the peace and prevent anyone from getting hurt. They're TOTALLY not there to quell the protest and shut it down to prevent them from being heard.

Has this fucking country learned nothing from Ferguson and Baltimore?
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: dpareja on July 11, 2016, 04:28:34 am
But don't forget, Black Lives Matter is a terrorist organization and the black KKK.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Askold on July 11, 2016, 07:16:30 am
Well you do have to admit that when the cops didn't have that much gear several of them were murdered in the previous protest by the same group...
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: RavynousHunter on July 11, 2016, 08:29:24 am
Ya know, if only America had some kind of provision in its most important legal document regarding the right for people to kinda gather together, peacefully, and protest things they don't like...a Right to Assembly, if you will.  Too bad, I guess, because that'd be really nice, right about now.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: The_Queen on July 11, 2016, 11:32:11 am
Well you do have to admit that when the cops didn't have that much gear several of them were murdered in the previous protest by the same group...

In my experience from researching excessive force cases, both civil and criminal, the courts appear to promulgate standards in response to the rare circumstances, but then the police take that exception and make it the rule, and subsequent courts go along with it. This argument is no difference.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Askold on July 11, 2016, 12:34:20 pm
Not  saying that the police haven't done a lot of bad things or that the militarization of the police in USA isn't worrisome but wasn't this literally days after the massacre?  The police had to gear up in case someone else tried the same trick...

But I do admit that the complaints about the protest getting onto the roads is ridiculous.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Cloud3514 on July 11, 2016, 02:28:19 pm
I can imagine that having officers check buildings in the path of the protest for threats is more effective at preventing a repeat of Dallas than automatically assuming the protesters are going to riot.

And even if I were to accept that they're armored in case the worst happens, it doesn't justify pulling out the APC with the sound cannon. Again, that kind of hardware was designed for use in war zones.

Meeting protesters as if you're expecting them to riot and hitting them with the sound cannon is excessive force no matter how you justify it. Our justice system is supposed to be based on "innocent until proven guilty." These officers went out presuming guilt.

I'm not saying that they shouldn't have the riot gear ready to go or reinforcements on stand by in these cases. History has shown that these kinds of protests can and do devolve into rioting, but this isn't having people or gear on stand by, this is meeting protesters as if they were enemy combatants.

Actual Afghanistan and Iraq veterans have pointed out that the gear they used in actual war zones was less extreme than what the officers here are using. These officers look like they've stepped out of a cyberpunk novel, but they didn't.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Askold on July 13, 2016, 12:34:10 am
According to study black people are not in fact more likely to get shot by police in USA: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/jul/11/no-racial-bias-police-shootings-study-harvard-prof/

...But blacks and hispanics ARE more likely to get shoved around and pushed by police or arrested at gun-point.

The article seems to imply that BLM should just shut up and take their beatings like a man safe in the knowledge that they aren't more likely to be killed than any other person in USA? Really, the conclusion is:

Quote
It is plausible that racial differences in lower level uses of force are simply a distraction and movements such as Black Lives Matter should seek solutions within their own communities rather than changing the behaviors of police and other external forces,

...Although there appears to be no peer review for this study yet. The papers were in a hurry to get this published because this kind of story gets a lot of readers but waiting to see if it's bullshit would take a long time and someone else might run the story first.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Tolpuddle Martyr on July 13, 2016, 01:05:04 am
Quote
...seek solutions within their own communities...

Stop impeding the passage of police bullets you silly black people.

Since when was doling out condescending advice to activists part of a researchers brief anyway?
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Canadian Mojo on July 13, 2016, 10:20:39 am
Is it just me, or does the paper appear to basically say that everybody has the same chance of being shot during an interaction with police but fails to mention the disproportionate rates of police interaction certain groups seem to seem to be subjected to?

<cough> looks more like one of our suspects ‘cause of the wide set nose. <cough>
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Even Then on July 13, 2016, 10:25:18 am
"Black people are more susceptible to having guns pointed at them by the police, but more susceptible to being shot by the police? lol that's impossible"
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Sigmaleph on July 13, 2016, 12:20:09 pm
Is it just me, or does the paper appear to basically say that everybody has the same chance of being shot during an interaction with police but fails to mention the disproportionate rates of police interaction certain groups seem to seem to be subjected to?

<cough> looks more like one of our suspects ‘cause of the wide set nose. <cough>

It doesn't fail to mention it. It mentions it and says it is studying something else:

Quote
To be clear, the empirical thought experiment here is that a police officer arrives at a scene and decides whether or not to use lethal force. Our estimates suggest that this decision is not correlated with the race of the suspect. This does not, however, rule out the possibility that there are important racial differences in whether or not thse police-civilian interactions occur at all.

(there are plenty of other studies on the question of if higher rates of police interaction are driven by discrimination or not)
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Askold on July 13, 2016, 12:22:55 pm
...Then again we are talking about the country where wheelchair bound elderly are shot by police so it could be that the real problem is that the police simply use too much force and don't know enough about de-escalating conflicts.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Canadian Mojo on July 13, 2016, 02:18:01 pm
Is it just me, or does the paper appear to basically say that everybody has the same chance of being shot during an interaction with police but fails to mention the disproportionate rates of police interaction certain groups seem to seem to be subjected to?

<cough> looks more like one of our suspects ‘cause of the wide set nose. <cough>

It doesn't fail to mention it. It mentions it and says it is studying something else:

Quote
To be clear, the empirical thought experiment here is that a police officer arrives at a scene and decides whether or not to use lethal force. Our estimates suggest that this decision is not correlated with the race of the suspect. This does not, however, rule out the possibility that there are important racial differences in whether or not thse police-civilian interactions occur at all.

(there are plenty of other studies on the question of if higher rates of police interaction are driven by discrimination or not)

In that case it is probably a decent study. Of course, the initial soundbite of no racism is probably going to be the only part mentioned in certain circles, just like "more whites than blacks are shot by cops" is.

I tend to think like Askold on this topic; there seems to be too much force used by the cops (in the US) in general.




Rather than double post:

does anyone else thing getting pulled over three times a year is excessive -- particularly if half the charges are dropped? I think I've only been pulled over three times in the last five or six -- and all of them were RIDE program check everyone stops.
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Cloud3514 on July 13, 2016, 10:17:05 pm
The thing is, even if it was proven that American police have ZERO racist tendencies and that all allegations of profiling and bias were false, we still have an average of 1100 people dying at the hands of police every year. I think the statistics prove that there is some level of racial bias with policing and talking about police exclusively doesn't take numerous other areas of systematic racism into account, but even if there was no racism forever, it is absurd to look at 1100 people killed by police every year and think "yup, no problem here. Police are doing their jobs without any problems."
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Sigmaleph on July 14, 2016, 12:50:10 pm
Data Colada took a look at the study (http://datacolada.org/50) and suggests that the reason blacks appear to be shot less than whites might be because racial bias makes officers stop people with lower threat levels.

Their conclusion is basically "too noisy to tell, need bigger sample size".
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Askold on July 17, 2016, 11:04:34 am
This story made it to the Finnish news but I have no idea if it's connected to the earlier attack on police and similarly motivated or just business as usual in USA: http://ktla.com/2016/07/17/3-baton-rouge-police-feared-dead-in-shooting-scene-active-official-says/
Title: Re: How about those trigger happy police officers?
Post by: Dakota Bob on July 17, 2016, 02:55:42 pm
Things are gonna get fun for Black Lives Matter activists now with all these cop killings, I'm sure they're gonna find themselves under intense surveillance pretty soon, already people were getting arrested for facebook posts in the wake of the last shooting (https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20160713/08585834961/police-step-up-arrests-threatening-social-media-posts-wake-dallas-shooting.shtml)