Hello, Nebulesque! Welcome to FSTDT.
Hi all,
I've reached a stage in my life where I actually need some affirmation. I'm having a bit of a crisis of faith. It has nothing to do with my religious beliefs, apart from in a contextual sense. If you're reading this, then I hope I don't bore you...
Okay... I'm not sure how much affirmation a non-denominational-Christian-turned-Atheist can give, but I'll try to offer support as I can. Will that help?
I'm Catholic. I come from a long line of Catholics, as my family are Irish. My mother married an Anglican, which is close enough (I'm playing). My uncle on my father's side is an Anglican vicar. My uncle on my mothers side is a monseigneur in the Catholic church, based at the Vatican in charge of eccumenical affairs.
So that's my family... I believe, but I keep it too myself. I'm well educated. I drink, I smoke (sorry) and generally enjoy my life. Currently I work in a Muslim country, and am doing my best to learn about the Muslim faith, to see what compliments my own. I challenge my beliefs daily (Judas? He should be a Saint. If God gave man free will, yet Jesus was able to prophesise his own demise at the hand of Judas, Judas by definition could not have had free will. This he was there for a purpose, thus Judas = Saint). I find religion fascinating. I overtly reject the retarded within the church and embrace the coherent. Condoms? Fire them out the back of the popemobile. Go nuts. And yet I'm still Catholic.
...I like you. Let me just throw that out there. First of all, I don't condemn people for smoking or drinking. They are either natural products or based on them, and if you believe in creation, I posit that God would not see to great a deal with their use. Hell, Jesus drank. Why should you be sorry for that? I think it's
abuse of these things that would be the problem. Anyway, I like your take on Judas; it's always been one of my major complaints about the church in general, that they portray him as a villain, when he was a key part of the crucifixion story! Without his betrayal the death couldn't have happened, etc...
My question, and yes I have one, is based on something I said on YouTube. After reading someone's comment stating that you can't go to heaven if you don't believe in our capital G God, I stated plainly that they're a fucking moron. Due to my response, I'm apparently not a Christian. You see, the ONLY way to heaven is by believing in Jesus. Now here I smell bullshit. The people who stated this also cite homosexuality as a sin and believe in the rapture.
Sounds like a Rapture Ready-an... if you've seen the main page, we have a TON of quotes from idiots who think the same way, many of which come from Rapture Ready. We have a name for them: Raptards.
Can anyone tell me how many times Jesus mentions homosexuality in the bible? A hint: it's less than once. The rapture is a man made item of pseudo-religios arse gravey, unmentioned in the bible.
As a gay man, this is something I've spent a great deal of time reading about. Indeed, the passages that condemn homosexuality are located in a couple places. The first is in Exodus, as one of a number of laws passed down to Moses... for his people. It is the Jewish people who would, therefore, consider a man lying with another man "an abomination ... [to be] put to death", if we were following the text. In the New Testament, Jesus never said it, though several apostles did (most notably Paul, who wrote most of the things in the New Testament I object to), which leads me to believe that Jesus is more tolerant than conservatives today would like to believe.
So a) why can I only find intellectual discussion among fundie haters, b) does anyone find my rather boring beliefs offensive, and c) why, and I mean no offence to Americans in general, do I only hear this hatred when I wander into US dominated Internet space? I don't get this shit in the UK...
Hope someone's up for a chat about this. Much love xxx
a) I think a lot of fundie haters are former fundies, people who were raised by them, or knew them, and subsequently fought back against their teachings through research and critical thinking. A lot of fundies resort to simple brainwashing techniques to try to get their kids/friends/etc to think the same way as they do, by providing only information supporting their viewpoint, using fear, etc... and the smart are the ones who learn to fight back against it. As such... I'd imagine a lot of them are bitter over it.
In short, it might be a cause-and-effect: Those who learn to dislike fundies are the ones who can argue best against them. Of course, your mileage may vary when discussing people; obviously that isn't everyone.
b) No. I actually have a lot of problems with the Catholic Church, but that doesn't mean I hate or even dislike practitioners. It's what you
do with it, what your
character is, that determines whether I like you or not. I have Christian friends... not many, admittedly, but I don't dislike people just for having a spiritual belief.
c) I... can't explain my country. Honestly, I love the US, I grew up here, it's got a lot going for it... but damn do we have some inbred-level stupid people in this country.