Author Topic: Canadian Politics  (Read 3936 times)

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Offline niam2023

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Re: Canadian Politics
« Reply #15 on: November 19, 2018, 02:27:40 pm »
When I hear people saying the left "failed to create a populist front", I hear "they failed to gather properly around a singular messiah".
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Offline DarkPhoenix

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Re: Canadian Politics
« Reply #16 on: November 21, 2018, 09:17:54 pm »
Populist doesn't seem to have anything to do with what a candidate actual says but if they campaign based on yelling instead of facts.  Wynne raised the minimum wage to $14 an hour, cracked down on wage theft and introduced pro-worker laws and didn't get an once of credit for it.

Most of them likely think like my old man: "She blew a BILLION DOLLARS on the gas plant debacle!"

Of course, even he saw through the Kingpin of Toronto.  Apparently a number of other morons did not.

Offline Skybison

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Re: Canadian Politics
« Reply #17 on: November 22, 2018, 01:51:04 am »
^I was talking to a co-worker about why he was planning to vote for Doug Ford:

Him: "Taxation is Theft!"

Me: "Er no, taxes are needed to pay for services like welfare, education, healthcare, police, etc that you (a retail employee with a two year old kid) need but can't afford out of your own pocket."

Then he gives me this look of shocked disbelief and in a tone that screams "I can't believe how stupid you are" explains very slowly and carefully in the most condescending way: "The government prints the money.  They don't need taxes.  They can just print money."

Then I tried to explain how economics works, but everything I said was clearly in one ear, out the other.

Offline niam2023

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Re: Canadian Politics
« Reply #18 on: November 22, 2018, 02:14:42 am »
You were dealing with a hick.

Their family tree is less a tree and more a bush of kudzu. Don't expect intelligence out of hicks.
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Offline dpareja

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Re: Canadian Politics
« Reply #19 on: November 22, 2018, 03:27:07 am »
Never mind that printing money is a federal thing, the provinces have to make do with what they can get.
Quote from: Jordan Duram
It doesn't concern you, Sister, that kind of absolutist view of the universe? Right and wrong determined solely by a single all-knowing, all powerful being whose judgment cannot be questioned and in whose name the most horrendous acts can be sanctioned without appeal?

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Being required by someone else’s religious beliefs to behave contrary to one’s sexual identity is degrading and disrespectful.

Offline Skybison

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Re: Canadian Politics
« Reply #20 on: October 22, 2019, 01:01:57 pm »
So Canadian election is over.  Conservatives got the highest percentage of the popular vote (34%) but liberals won the most seats and get to keep a minority government, mostly because Ontarians hate Doug Ford and didn't want a national government that was out to cut all government services down to the bone.

Hopefully the NDP will hold the liberals to the left, instead of their standard not fix anything but at least not make things worse we get when they have majorities.

And Bernier was humiliated that was funny.

Offline dpareja

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Re: Canadian Politics
« Reply #21 on: October 22, 2019, 09:10:15 pm »
Honestly I'm not sure if the best thing to come out of this election was Bernier's humiliation or the Bloc's resurgence.

And I say that because we've had nine federal elections since Mulroney's coalition of Western conservatives and Quebec separatists disintegrated. In that time, we've had four elections with both a unified right-wing party and a strong Bloc Québécois. All four resulted in minority Parliaments. The other five resulted in majority Parliaments.

I do wonder if there'll be some discussions inside the Conservative Party about whether supporting proportional representation might not be such a bad idea.
Quote from: Jordan Duram
It doesn't concern you, Sister, that kind of absolutist view of the universe? Right and wrong determined solely by a single all-knowing, all powerful being whose judgment cannot be questioned and in whose name the most horrendous acts can be sanctioned without appeal?

Quote from: Supreme Court of Canada
Being required by someone else’s religious beliefs to behave contrary to one’s sexual identity is degrading and disrespectful.

Offline Skybison

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Re: Canadian Politics
« Reply #22 on: October 23, 2019, 12:58:58 am »
Admittedly there is a... what's the opposite of a silver lining?  one of those... to Bernier's self destruction in that having a vote splitting second party on the right could have helped balance things out and reduce the risk of a conservative majority with only 40% of the vote.  Although that could also mean a minority government where alt-righters hold the balance of power could happen too so it's probably for the best they're dead in the water.

As for the bloq, would they be left wingers taking votes from the liberals/ndp or right wingers taking votes from the cons these days?  They're left wing on most issues, but now that they seem to have given up on independence their big issue is mostly islamophobia/xenophobia.

Also I'm not sure if it's hypocritical to complain about Hillary losing while gaining the popular vote and gloat about conservatives losing while getting the popular vote but I'll do it anyway.

Offline dpareja

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Re: Canadian Politics
« Reply #23 on: October 23, 2019, 01:28:12 am »
The Bloc actually have a good number of left-wing policies; opposition to pipelines, for instance.

The thing you really have to keep in mind about Quebec's secularism bill is that, unfortunately, it's pretty popular. And not just in Quebec. And in fact it's decently popular among Liberal and NDP voters.

And yes, it is hypocritical to complain about it. Hillary Clinton should be President of the United States right now.

However, if we actually had a proportional system, and not one that rewards efficient vote distribution and punishes vote concentration, we would probably have a situation somewhat similar to New Zealand's. The Conservatives would have the most seats (probably; the drastic overrepresentation of the Atlantic provinces in the Commons might put that in doubt), but the Liberals would be in government, in some sort of formal coalition and/or confidence and supply agreement with the New Democrats and the Greens.

Liberals govern like Conservatives when they have a majority, but when they're pushed to it they'll do a few NDP things to get their support when necessary.
Quote from: Jordan Duram
It doesn't concern you, Sister, that kind of absolutist view of the universe? Right and wrong determined solely by a single all-knowing, all powerful being whose judgment cannot be questioned and in whose name the most horrendous acts can be sanctioned without appeal?

Quote from: Supreme Court of Canada
Being required by someone else’s religious beliefs to behave contrary to one’s sexual identity is degrading and disrespectful.