Author Topic: A(nother) dangerous opinion.  (Read 6857 times)

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Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #15 on: November 09, 2016, 06:52:05 pm »
Of course for some the "left" are just the folks they won't let into their private club. Which is how Conty here manages to mangle blue dog Democrats, actual socialists and identity politics supremos to form a hideous Voltron like flesh golem of non Toryness.

Art Vandelay

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #16 on: November 09, 2016, 07:30:06 pm »
However, no one ever acted on it...thankfully.
Thirty seconds with Google shows that that's demonstrably false. http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/03/02/a_list_of_violent_incidents_at_donald_trump_rallies_and_events.html. That's just at Trump rallies. I'm sure there were plenty more punches being thrown elsewhere. Again, though, only the pro-Trump people were actually endorsed and encouraged by their leader, who it just so happens is now president of the US. If you're so concerned about political violence, I'm rather surprised that this somehow isn't your biggest worry.

Offline SCarpelan

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #17 on: November 09, 2016, 07:31:37 pm »
Of course for some the "left" are just the folks they won't let into their private club. Which is how Conty here manages to mangle blue dog Democrats, actual socialists and identity politics supremos to form a hideous Voltron like flesh golem of non Toryness.

I occasionally wonder how much of the generalization is trolling and how much is just him being thickheaded. Then I realize I don't really care.

Offline Sigmaleph

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #18 on: November 09, 2016, 09:57:15 pm »
*shrug* heard the theory proposed before before. There is nonzero evidence for it; apparently Trump polled better when people talked to recordings than to humans.

But, y'know, polling error is a thing and has many possible sources. 538 on the matter.
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Offline The_Queen

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #19 on: November 09, 2016, 11:08:30 pm »
(2) Is an odd one.  What possible reason could people have for hiding their political opinions when questioned on them?

Bradley Effect

ETA: From Sigma's link

Quote
Several pollsters rejected the idea that Trump voters were too shy to tells pollsters whom they were supporting. But James Lee of Susquehanna Polling & Research Inc. said his firm combined live-interview and automated-dialer calls, and Trump did better when voters were sharing their voting intention with a recorded voice rather than a live one.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2016, 11:11:03 pm by The_Queen »
Does anyone take Donald Trump seriously, anymore?

Offline TheContrarian

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #20 on: November 10, 2016, 03:47:20 am »
Of course for some the "left" are just the folks they won't let into their private club. Which is how Conty here manages to mangle blue dog Democrats, actual socialists and identity politics supremos to form a hideous Voltron like flesh golem of non Toryness.

All conveniently standing shoulder-to-shoulder next to the smashed up shop and burning effigy of Trump.

If they aren't subdividing themselves, why should I?


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Offline dpareja

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #21 on: November 10, 2016, 04:04:51 am »
Corporate Democrats and socialist Democrats are like Armenia and Azerbaijan: they hate each other, but can't disentangle themselves without destroying both of them in the process.
Quote from: Jordan Duram
It doesn't concern you, Sister, that kind of absolutist view of the universe? Right and wrong determined solely by a single all-knowing, all powerful being whose judgment cannot be questioned and in whose name the most horrendous acts can be sanctioned without appeal?

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Being required by someone else’s religious beliefs to behave contrary to one’s sexual identity is degrading and disrespectful.

Offline Murdin

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #22 on: November 10, 2016, 05:18:59 am »
A(nother) dangerous opinion.

You really do think highly of yourself, don't you. I mean, just from the title. Unless you are an actual authority on the relevant subject, that's generally a very bad sign.

I'm aware that you probably see yourself as "trolling" and "not serious" and "fucking with us" to "see the butthurt reactions". I'm also very much aware that trolls usually do a terrible job trying to hide their real opinions and personality, if they bother at all. That characteristic combination of arrogance and stupidity doesn't just belong to your troll persona, it's very much yours, honey. It doesn't take Freud to notice that.

Your entire argument relies on two incredibly ass-backwards ideas:
  • That Clinton's defeat was mainly caused by higher-than-expected Republican turnout. It wasn't ; Trump didn't win the election ; Clinton lost it. She failed to bring her likely voters to the booths. You can be certain this has absolutely nothing to do with the fabricated scandal one week before the elections, nor with the wave of voter suppression that was backed up by the fucking Supreme Court.
  • That any discrepancy in favor of Trump is most logically explained by social intimidation from whoever is currently around the responder.  Simply put : most people aren't as edgy and clear-minded and shameless as you are. Many Trump voters were disgusted with the character and/or had some moral qualms about throwing underprivileged groups under the bus, but felt that they still had to vote for him, either by party loyalty or because they saw him as a "way out" of conventional politics. Those people were personally ashamed of their choice, even outside of any immediate social pressure, and justifiably so. This may actually explain why Trump did surprisingly well with white women.
Note that I was being generous in the previous point, since you were specifically talking about roving bands of liberal youths looking out for anything that might be interpreted as tacit or overt support for Trump, ready to bury the offender under an onslaught of... trigger warnings? Improvised dissertations filled with -isms? Physical violence? It doesn't really matter, since this is obviously your "trolling" opinion, an Overton-window-pushing red herring to attract emotional responses and make your sincerely held opinion (cf first sentence of the point) seem more sensible by comparison.

When it comes to your own thoughts at the very least, you seem to have have a hard time telling apart audacity and vacuity. It's really a shame that Trump decided to center his artificial affect on gross lower-class sensitivities, rather than the more aristocratic brand of conservatism you desperately try to pose as. I'm sure you would be head over heels in love with him.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2016, 05:24:31 am by Murdin »

Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #23 on: November 10, 2016, 06:58:53 am »
If they aren't subdividing themselves, why should I?
They did.

See Sanders VS Clinton, Clinton and Sanders VS Stein etc, etc.

There's also the fact that they believe in different things which is how one typically subdivides political groupings. The fact that they are united in disliking Trump means sweet FA. There are Republicans who despise Trump.

But if you're just doing it for shits and giggles you can throw lots of completely unrelated groups in together. How many political groupings have the word "liberal" in their name, Australian Liberal Party who are classically conservative, the even more conservative Liberal Democratic party of Japan...obviously completely the same as Trudeau's Liberals.

Hey, if they aren't subdividing themselves why should I?

« Last Edit: November 10, 2016, 07:01:34 am by Tolpuddle Martyr »

Offline dpareja

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #24 on: November 10, 2016, 07:16:23 am »
But if you're just doing it for shits and giggles you can throw lots of completely unrelated groups in together. How many political groupings have the word "liberal" in their name, Australian Liberal Party who are classically conservative, the even more conservative Liberal Democratic party of Japan...obviously completely the same as Trudeau's Liberals.

Trudeau's Liberals are Conservatives in drag. And then there's the BC Liberals, who are basically just Conservatives.
Quote from: Jordan Duram
It doesn't concern you, Sister, that kind of absolutist view of the universe? Right and wrong determined solely by a single all-knowing, all powerful being whose judgment cannot be questioned and in whose name the most horrendous acts can be sanctioned without appeal?

Quote from: Supreme Court of Canada
Being required by someone else’s religious beliefs to behave contrary to one’s sexual identity is degrading and disrespectful.

Offline davedan

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #25 on: November 10, 2016, 07:17:14 pm »
What is funny is that Johnathan Pie agrees with Contrarian:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLG9g7BcjKs" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLG9g7BcjKs</a>

Poor old bugger can't even have an original 'dangerous' opinion.

Offline RavynousHunter

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #26 on: November 10, 2016, 08:07:21 pm »
Jonathan Pie is fucking epic and, as usual, completely on-point.
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Offline SCarpelan

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #27 on: November 11, 2016, 03:37:28 am »
I don't agree with every point he makes (he strawmans the Social Justice discussion badly but that's part of his comedic style). What I agree with him 100% is that the left needs to look at the mirror and not just blame the other side - no matter which part of the left wing spectrum you position yourself in.

Pie does make enough 100% accurate points that his emotional outburst is very cathartic to watch.

Offline TheContrarian

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #28 on: November 11, 2016, 04:59:39 am »
What is funny is that Johnathan Pie agrees with Contrarian:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLG9g7BcjKs" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLG9g7BcjKs</a>

Poor old bugger can't even have an original 'dangerous' opinion.

Good chap.  I mean I know it's satire but he's not wrong :)


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Art Vandelay

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Re: A(nother) dangerous opinion.
« Reply #29 on: November 11, 2016, 07:05:46 am »
Pie is absolutely bang on. I have to say, maybe Trump's victory will be a good thing long term. Maybe this is just wishful thinking on my part, but it seems like leftists are indeed starting to realise that simply writing their opponents off as stupid yokels and other feel good bullshit isn't going to cut it. Perhaps they'll realise that real change doesn't happen overnight, that they can't just give up or let themselves be distracted when things turn into a slog (looking at you, Occupy Wall Street). Hell, maybe even environmentalists will stop doing such a bang up job of living up to the armchair intellectual, insufferable self-congratulatory cunt stereotype who thinks planting a tree or turning the lights off for an hour a year makes any actual difference whatsoever and start taking things a little more seriously.

Yeah, I know, fucking unlikely. But a guy can dream, no?
« Last Edit: November 11, 2016, 07:19:41 am by Art Vandelay »