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91
Preaching and Worship / Re: More proof that Christianity is true.
« Last post by Jacob Harrison on October 15, 2018, 04:49:32 pm »
And that's quite frankly horrifying. Anyone and everyone can be killed in the name of God, because it's justified because they're sinners. That's one hell of a good reason not to subscribe to a belief system like that.

It DOES NOT MEAN that we are allowed to kill anyone. We are all sinners so we are not justified in killing others. However God is justified in killing anyone or ordering people killed because he is an omnibenevolent being without sin so he has the moral high ground unlike us.

So in regards to abortion, it is evil for humans to kill babies, however God can do so, or order the killing of babies like he did to the Canaanite babies in the Bible because babies are born in original sin due to the curse on mankind after the first evolved Homo sapiens Adam and Eve eating the forbidden fruit.
92
Preaching and Worship / Re: More proof that Christianity is true.
« Last post by Jacob Harrison on October 15, 2018, 04:45:35 pm »
1. Well the Canaanites performed human sacrifice so it is a good thing that God ordered them killed, so that the Israelites would not convert to their wicked religion.
Quote
Does God approve of human sacrifice?
Yes.
God told Abraham to sacrifice his son Isaac as a burnt offering.

And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of. Genesis 22:2

He commanded the Israelites to give him their firstborn sons.

Thou shalt not delay to offer the first of thy ripe fruits, and of thy liquors: the firstborn of thy sons shalt thou give unto me. Exodus 22:29
He said that every "devoted thing ... both of man and beast ... shall surely be put to death."

No devoted thing, that a man shall devote unto the LORD of all that he hath, both of man and beast ... shall be sold or redeemed: every devoted thing is most holy unto the LORD. None devoted, which shall be devoted of men, shall be redeemed; but shall surely be put to death. Leviticus 27:28-29
Moses commanded his officers to kill every Midianite male and non-virgin female, but to keep the virgin females alive for themselves -- except for one in a thousand which were to be given to God. After examining the females, the soldiers found 32,000 virgins, 32 of which were God's "booty". Sixteen of these were sacrificed to God as a "heave offering."

And Moses was wroth with the officers ... which came from the battle. And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive? ... Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.
...
And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying, Take the sum of the prey that was taken, both of man and of beast ... And divide the prey into two parts; between them that took the war upon them, who went out to battle, and between all the congregation: And levy a tribute unto the Lord ... one soul of five hundred, both of the persons, and of the beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep: Take it of their half, and give it unto Eleazar the priest, for an heave offering of the Lord. ... And Moses and Eleazar the priest did as the Lord commanded Moses. And the booty ... was ... thirty and two thousand persons in all, of women that had not known man by lying with him ... of which the LORD's tribute was thirty and two persons. Numbers 31:25-40

The Spirit of the Lord inspired Jephthah to to sacrifice to God whatever came out to greet him when he returned from slaughtering the Ammonites. When his daughter came out to greet him, Jephthah kept his promise to God by killing her as a burnt offering.

Then the Spirit of the LORD came upon Jephthah ... And Jephthah vowed a vow unto the LORD, and said, If thou shalt without fail deliver the children of Ammon into mine hands, Then it shall be, that whatsoever cometh forth of the doors of my house to meet me, when I return in peace from the children of Ammon, shall surely be the LORD's, and I will offer it up for a burnt offering. So Jephthah passed over unto the children of Ammon to fight against them; and the LORD delivered them into his hands.... And Jephthah came to Mizpeh unto his house, and, behold, his daughter came out to meet him with timbrels and with dances: and she was his only child.... And it came to pass, when he saw her, that he rent his clothes, and said, Alas, my daughter! thou hast brought me very low, and thou art one of them that trouble me: for I have opened my mouth unto the LORD, and I cannot go back. And she said unto him, My father, if thou hast opened thy mouth unto the LORD, do to me according to that which hath proceeded out of thy mouth.... And it came to pass at the end of two months, that she returned unto her father, who did with her according to his vow which he had vowed. Judges 11:29-40
God sent a famine is sent on David's kingdom for three years. When David asked God why, God answered: "It is for Saul, and his bloody house, because he slew the Gibeonites." To appease God and end the famine that was caused by his predecessor (Saul), David agreed to have two of Saul's sons and five of his grandsons killed and hung up "unto the Lord." God stopped the famine after they were killed and hung up for him.

Then there was a famine in the days of David three years, year after year; and David enquired of the LORD. And the LORD answered, It is for Saul, and for his bloody house, because he slew the Gibeonites.... The king took the two sons of Rizpah the daughter of Aiah, whom she bare unto Saul, Armoni and Mephibosheth; and the five sons of Michal the daughter of Saul ... And he delivered them into the hands of the Gibeonites, and they hanged them in the hill before the LORD....And after that God was intreated for the land. 2 Samuel 21:1, 8-14
Josiah "did that which was right in the eyes of the Lord" when he killed "all the priests of the high places" and burnt their bones upon their altars.

And, behold, there came a man of God out of Judah by the word of the LORD ... And he cried against the altar in the word of the LORD, and said, O altar, altar, thus saith the LORD; Behold, a child shall be born unto the house of David, Josiah by name; and upon thee shall he offer the priests of the high places that burn incense upon thee, and men's bones shall be burnt upon thee. 1 Kings 13:1-2
Josiah ... slew all the priests of the high places that were there upon the altars, and burned men's bones upon them. 2 Kings 23:20

Josiah ... did that which was right in the eyes of the Lord ... And he burnt the bones of the priests upon their altars. 2 Chronicles 34:1-5

Jesus was the ultimate human sacrifice, redeeming us all with his precious blood.
(Now God doesn't have to torture us all after we die, since he tortured Jesus to death as a substitute for us.)

Christ our passover is sacrificed for us. 1 Corinthians 5:7
Ye were not redeemed with corruptible things ... But with the precious blood of Christ. 1 Peter 1:18-19

For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh: How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God ... that by means of death ... they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance. For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator ... and without shedding of blood is no remission. Hebrews 9:13-22

We are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. Hebrews 10:10

No.
At least God doesn't want us to sacrifice our children for any other god. That would be evil in the sight of the Lord.
And thou shalt not let any of thy seed pass through the fire to Molech, neither shalt thou profane the name of thy God: I am the LORD. Leviticus 18:21
Every abomination to the LORD, which he hateth, have they done unto their gods; for even their sons and their daughters they have burnt in the fire to their gods. Deuteronomy 12:31

He [Manasseh] made his son pass through the fire, and ... wrought much wickedness in the sight of the LORD. 2 Kings 21:6

If we sacrifice our children to another god, we must be stoned to death.
There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire. Deuteronomy 18:10
Again, thou shalt say to the children of Israel, Whosoever he be of the children of Israel, or of the strangers that sojourn in Israel, that giveth any of his seed unto Molech; he shall surely be put to death: the people of the land shall stone him with stones. Leviticus 20:2

Yahweh loves his human sacrifices, just doesn't like it if you do it for anybody else!

2. They are saying that everyone’s a sinner and the wages of sin is death, meaning that God is justified in killing anyone including the Canaanites.

Which only makes sense to cowards and authoritarians, to the rest of us any moral system worthy of it's name is consistent and applies to all.

1. This is what Exodus 22:29 means. It does not mean sacrificing Firstborn sons. https://www.str.org/blog/god-didn’t-command-child-sacrifice#.W8T4zRYpDYU

2. The Bible does not say that God approved of Jephthah sacrificing his daughter. Wikipedia says this.
Quote
Unlike other instances of burnt offerings that were in fact in line with Mosaic law, there is no divine acknowledgement of this offering.

Some writers have observed that the Israelites of the time were decidedly barbarous; that Mosaic law (which forbade human sacrifice) was at this time widely disrespected; and that there are several other examples of rash vows to God with similarly terrible consequences.[10] Of course, the barbarism of the Israelites says nothing about why the God of the Bible would accept a child sacrifice. David Janzen argued that the story was an integral part of the Deuteronomist picture of moral decline through adoption of non-Israelitic practices such as child sacrifice.[11] Solomon Landers believed that the absence of express judgement implies that the sacrifice was not acceptable to God, notwithstanding the fact that the sacrifice nevertheless happened.[12] The Book of Judges has been seen as teaching a cycle of pride associated with rejection of God's law and subsequent suffering of the people.

3. The other people sacrificed were God’s and Israel’s enemies.

4. God’s moral system is consistent and applies to all. We are all sinners which is why he sent his son to sacrifice himself for us.
93
Preaching and Worship / Re: More proof that Christianity is true.
« Last post by Tolpuddle Martyr on October 15, 2018, 03:54:20 pm »
1. Well the Canaanites performed human sacrifice so it is a good thing that God ordered them killed, so that the Israelites would not convert to their wicked religion.
Quote
Does God approve of human sacrifice?
Yes.
God told Abraham to sacrifice his son Isaac as a burnt offering.

And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of. Genesis 22:2

He commanded the Israelites to give him their firstborn sons.

Thou shalt not delay to offer the first of thy ripe fruits, and of thy liquors: the firstborn of thy sons shalt thou give unto me. Exodus 22:29
He said that every "devoted thing ... both of man and beast ... shall surely be put to death."

No devoted thing, that a man shall devote unto the LORD of all that he hath, both of man and beast ... shall be sold or redeemed: every devoted thing is most holy unto the LORD. None devoted, which shall be devoted of men, shall be redeemed; but shall surely be put to death. Leviticus 27:28-29
Moses commanded his officers to kill every Midianite male and non-virgin female, but to keep the virgin females alive for themselves -- except for one in a thousand which were to be given to God. After examining the females, the soldiers found 32,000 virgins, 32 of which were God's "booty". Sixteen of these were sacrificed to God as a "heave offering."

And Moses was wroth with the officers ... which came from the battle. And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive? ... Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.
...
And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying, Take the sum of the prey that was taken, both of man and of beast ... And divide the prey into two parts; between them that took the war upon them, who went out to battle, and between all the congregation: And levy a tribute unto the Lord ... one soul of five hundred, both of the persons, and of the beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep: Take it of their half, and give it unto Eleazar the priest, for an heave offering of the Lord. ... And Moses and Eleazar the priest did as the Lord commanded Moses. And the booty ... was ... thirty and two thousand persons in all, of women that had not known man by lying with him ... of which the LORD's tribute was thirty and two persons. Numbers 31:25-40

The Spirit of the Lord inspired Jephthah to to sacrifice to God whatever came out to greet him when he returned from slaughtering the Ammonites. When his daughter came out to greet him, Jephthah kept his promise to God by killing her as a burnt offering.

Then the Spirit of the LORD came upon Jephthah ... And Jephthah vowed a vow unto the LORD, and said, If thou shalt without fail deliver the children of Ammon into mine hands, Then it shall be, that whatsoever cometh forth of the doors of my house to meet me, when I return in peace from the children of Ammon, shall surely be the LORD's, and I will offer it up for a burnt offering. So Jephthah passed over unto the children of Ammon to fight against them; and the LORD delivered them into his hands.... And Jephthah came to Mizpeh unto his house, and, behold, his daughter came out to meet him with timbrels and with dances: and she was his only child.... And it came to pass, when he saw her, that he rent his clothes, and said, Alas, my daughter! thou hast brought me very low, and thou art one of them that trouble me: for I have opened my mouth unto the LORD, and I cannot go back. And she said unto him, My father, if thou hast opened thy mouth unto the LORD, do to me according to that which hath proceeded out of thy mouth.... And it came to pass at the end of two months, that she returned unto her father, who did with her according to his vow which he had vowed. Judges 11:29-40
God sent a famine is sent on David's kingdom for three years. When David asked God why, God answered: "It is for Saul, and his bloody house, because he slew the Gibeonites." To appease God and end the famine that was caused by his predecessor (Saul), David agreed to have two of Saul's sons and five of his grandsons killed and hung up "unto the Lord." God stopped the famine after they were killed and hung up for him.

Then there was a famine in the days of David three years, year after year; and David enquired of the LORD. And the LORD answered, It is for Saul, and for his bloody house, because he slew the Gibeonites.... The king took the two sons of Rizpah the daughter of Aiah, whom she bare unto Saul, Armoni and Mephibosheth; and the five sons of Michal the daughter of Saul ... And he delivered them into the hands of the Gibeonites, and they hanged them in the hill before the LORD....And after that God was intreated for the land. 2 Samuel 21:1, 8-14
Josiah "did that which was right in the eyes of the Lord" when he killed "all the priests of the high places" and burnt their bones upon their altars.

And, behold, there came a man of God out of Judah by the word of the LORD ... And he cried against the altar in the word of the LORD, and said, O altar, altar, thus saith the LORD; Behold, a child shall be born unto the house of David, Josiah by name; and upon thee shall he offer the priests of the high places that burn incense upon thee, and men's bones shall be burnt upon thee. 1 Kings 13:1-2
Josiah ... slew all the priests of the high places that were there upon the altars, and burned men's bones upon them. 2 Kings 23:20

Josiah ... did that which was right in the eyes of the Lord ... And he burnt the bones of the priests upon their altars. 2 Chronicles 34:1-5

Jesus was the ultimate human sacrifice, redeeming us all with his precious blood.
(Now God doesn't have to torture us all after we die, since he tortured Jesus to death as a substitute for us.)

Christ our passover is sacrificed for us. 1 Corinthians 5:7
Ye were not redeemed with corruptible things ... But with the precious blood of Christ. 1 Peter 1:18-19

For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh: How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God ... that by means of death ... they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance. For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator ... and without shedding of blood is no remission. Hebrews 9:13-22

We are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. Hebrews 10:10

No.
At least God doesn't want us to sacrifice our children for any other god. That would be evil in the sight of the Lord.
And thou shalt not let any of thy seed pass through the fire to Molech, neither shalt thou profane the name of thy God: I am the LORD. Leviticus 18:21
Every abomination to the LORD, which he hateth, have they done unto their gods; for even their sons and their daughters they have burnt in the fire to their gods. Deuteronomy 12:31

He [Manasseh] made his son pass through the fire, and ... wrought much wickedness in the sight of the LORD. 2 Kings 21:6

If we sacrifice our children to another god, we must be stoned to death.
There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire. Deuteronomy 18:10
Again, thou shalt say to the children of Israel, Whosoever he be of the children of Israel, or of the strangers that sojourn in Israel, that giveth any of his seed unto Molech; he shall surely be put to death: the people of the land shall stone him with stones. Leviticus 20:2

Yahweh loves his human sacrifices, just doesn't like it if you do it for anybody else!

2. They are saying that everyone’s a sinner and the wages of sin is death, meaning that God is justified in killing anyone including the Canaanites.

Which only makes sense to cowards and authoritarians, to the rest of us any moral system worthy of it's name is consistent and applies to all.
94
Preaching and Worship / Re: More proof that Christianity is true.
« Last post by Eiki-mun on October 15, 2018, 03:51:54 pm »
And that's quite frankly horrifying. Anyone and everyone can be killed in the name of God, because it's justified because they're sinners. That's one hell of a good reason not to subscribe to a belief system like that.
95
Preaching and Worship / Re: More proof that Christianity is true.
« Last post by Jacob Harrison on October 15, 2018, 12:16:45 pm »
Quote
When our thoughts or feelings bristle under God’s Word, He is right and we wrong.
Yeah, I'm sure. Go on then, this should be good.
Quote
There are at least two reasons why God did this. The first is evidenced in what came to pass when Israel did not obey God in this command. God wanted the land cleared of all temptations to His people to turn from Him, His worship and His law. The Canaanites were a threat to the purity of God’s people. He had set them apart, consecrated them, adopted them. In giving this order, He was protecting them.
Oh, well isn't that classy. Ethnic cleansing so God's personal cheer squad wouldn't be tainted by new ideas. Presumably, ideas such as not worshipping the cruel and abusive father in the sky. No, I'm sure it's actually a good thing.
Quote
Of course one might understand this motive, and still be horrified. These Canaanites were not mere abstractions, but real people. Is it not still rather cruel to kill them all simply for seeking to protect the moral purity of Israel? Perhaps, were that God’s only motive. The second reason God commanded them all to be put to death is because they were all, every man, woman and child of them, sinners. And the wages of sin is death.
Oh, okay. Fair enough. No, really. It's not like he's an all powerful deity who made up these rules in the first place or anything. He had to do it, honest injuns. It's not that he wanted to commit genocide so that his personal sycophants wouldn't get any ideas about not stroking his ego. He had no choice, his hands were tied, truly.
Quote
In short, God did this for the same reason He does all that He does, for the good of His people, and for His own glory.
Gotta validate that massive ego, even if it means genocide. Totally reasonable, I'm sure. I guess it's totally different when Idi Amin does it.
1. Well the Canaanites performed human sacrifice so it is a good thing that God ordered them killed, so that the Israelites would not convert to their wicked religion.
2. They are saying that everyone’s a sinner and the wages of sin is death, meaning that God is justified in killing anyone including the Canaanites.
96
Preaching and Worship / Re: More proof that Christianity is true.
« Last post by Art Vandelay on October 15, 2018, 12:05:38 pm »
Quote
When our thoughts or feelings bristle under God’s Word, He is right and we wrong.
Yeah, I'm sure. Go on then, this should be good.
Quote
There are at least two reasons why God did this. The first is evidenced in what came to pass when Israel did not obey God in this command. God wanted the land cleared of all temptations to His people to turn from Him, His worship and His law. The Canaanites were a threat to the purity of God’s people. He had set them apart, consecrated them, adopted them. In giving this order, He was protecting them.
Oh, well isn't that classy. Ethnic cleansing so God's personal cheer squad wouldn't be tainted by new ideas. Presumably, ideas such as not worshipping the cruel and abusive father in the sky. No, I'm sure it's actually a good thing.
Quote
Of course one might understand this motive, and still be horrified. These Canaanites were not mere abstractions, but real people. Is it not still rather cruel to kill them all simply for seeking to protect the moral purity of Israel? Perhaps, were that God’s only motive. The second reason God commanded them all to be put to death is because they were all, every man, woman and child of them, sinners. And the wages of sin is death.
Oh, okay. Fair enough. No, really. It's not like he's an all powerful deity who made up these rules in the first place or anything. He had to do it, honest injuns. It's not that he wanted to commit genocide so that his personal sycophants wouldn't get any ideas about not stroking his ego. He had no choice, his hands were tied, truly.
Quote
In short, God did this for the same reason He does all that He does, for the good of His people, and for His own glory.
Gotta validate that massive ego, even if it means genocide. Totally reasonable, I'm sure. I guess it's totally different when Idi Amin does it.
97
Preaching and Worship / Re: More proof that Christianity is true.
« Last post by Jacob Harrison on October 15, 2018, 11:45:35 am »
Like that makes a difference, you just made clear God's the abortionist in chief but it's ok because reasons, reasons including "collateral damage of massacres, no biggie."
Not to mention, unless God's not actually all powerful, "collateral damage" is only a thing because he chooses it to be a thing.

https://www.ligonier.org/blog/why-did-god-command-children-israel-kill-every-man-woman-and-child-promised-land/
98
Society and History / Re: Incels General Thread
« Last post by Askold on October 15, 2018, 09:21:45 am »
Samus Aran is a MGTOW????

The fuck?

That's the clone of her I think? Or some sort of evil version created by [technobabble] rather than Samus.

Yeah: http://metroid.wikia.com/wiki/Dark_Samus

Not a clone or even a hybrid if I read that right. It's an alien lifeform that for reasons chooses to imitate the appearance of Samus in her power armour. Still referred to as "she" in the wiki but I'm not sure whether it has a gender or what kind of genders alien horrors like that even have.
99
Society and History / Re: Incels General Thread
« Last post by Tolpuddle Martyr on October 15, 2018, 08:34:33 am »
Samus Aran is a MGTOW????

The fuck?
100
Society and History / Re: Incels General Thread
« Last post by Askold on October 15, 2018, 07:22:05 am »
I know that some manga made him a bit arrogant.
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