Author Topic: Michigan man "stands his ground"  (Read 2554 times)

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wrightway

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Michigan man "stands his ground"
« on: January 26, 2014, 07:38:53 pm »
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2014/01/15/22314634-renisha-mcbride-shooting-trial-set-for-june?lite

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Attorneys for Wafer argued during a preliminary examination in December before Dearborn Heights Judge David Turfe that the airport maintenance worker who cares for his elderly mother was afraid for his life that morning.

McBride had a blood alcohol level nearly three times the legal limit for driving in Michigan when she died and had crashed a car hours before, according to witnesses who testified for prosecutors at the preliminary examination.

A woman who reported the crash testified, however, that McBride appeared confused and injured, but not combative. Turfe said

http://gawker.com/once-again-a-black-person-is-shot-and-killed-while-loo-1459780870

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Michigan's self-defense act, which bears a resemblance to Florida's infamous stand-your-ground law, says that an individual "may use deadly force against another individual anywhere he or she has the legal right to be with no duty to retreat" as long as that person "honestly and reasonably" believes deadly force is necessary to prevent imminent death, great bodily harm, or sexual assault.

So, a young black woman gets into a car accident and knocks on a stranger's door looking for help. The middle aged white guy who opens the door shoots her in the head and then claims self defense. I don't know if I want to know what the hell is wrong with people now.

Offline kefkaownsall

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Re: Michigan man "stands his ground"
« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2014, 07:44:13 pm »
next time they bring up the victiims blood alcohol or whatever bring up the fucking perps record
I noticed Trayvon's pot got more attention then Zimmerman's dubious domestic abuse recrdd

Offline Cloud3514

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Re: Michigan man "stands his ground"
« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2014, 09:18:02 pm »
next time they bring up the victiims blood alcohol or whatever bring up the fucking perps record
I noticed Trayvon's pot got more attention then Zimmerman's dubious domestic abuse recrdd

Of course you're also talking about people who decided without any sort of evidence that Martin deserved to die because he was allegedly going to make drugs with the Skittles and iced tea he bought, despite such a claim being both irrelevant and completely absurd.
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Offline chitoryu12

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Re: Michigan man "stands his ground"
« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2014, 11:57:51 pm »
next time they bring up the victiims blood alcohol or whatever bring up the fucking perps record
I noticed Trayvon's pot got more attention then Zimmerman's dubious domestic abuse recrdd

Of course you're also talking about people who decided without any sort of evidence that Martin deserved to die because he was allegedly going to make drugs with the Skittles and iced tea he bought, despite such a claim being both irrelevant and completely absurd.

My current plan is to shoot everyone coming out of Home Depot with fertilizer and claim self-defense.
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Offline The Right Honourable Mlle Antéchrist

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Re: Michigan man "stands his ground"
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2014, 12:15:50 am »
"Stand Your Ground" is starting to look like the "Gay Panic" defence, except for racists.
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Offline Captain Jack Harkness

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Re: Michigan man "stands his ground"
« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2014, 12:31:21 am »
"Stand Your Ground" is starting to look like the "Gay Panic" defence, except for racists.

Eh, wasn't that theater shooting against a white guy - or am I remembering incorrectly?  I mean maybe that's an exception and not a rule, but then again I can only think of three examples - this included - where stand your ground has been invoked or discussed.  So unless I'm missing something, I'm not sure how it's necessarily racism.

If anything, I'd think it was more a sign of paranoia/trigger-happy behavior among some of the more unhinged members of the gun owning community.  And yes, I realize that in trying to provide an alternate explanation I'm injecting my own assumptions about motive.  Of course, the alternate explanation doesn't make it any more right,

Also, I had to look up "gay panic defense."  It's just as bizarre as it sounds.
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Offline The Right Honourable Mlle Antéchrist

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Re: Michigan man "stands his ground"
« Reply #6 on: January 27, 2014, 01:08:08 am »
To be more clear, it's not necessarily the actual "stand your ground" law so much as the mindset behind it: If you feel the slightest bit threatened, even if the individual isn't brandishing a weapon or attacking you, you're justified in using deadly force against them. There have been a frightening number of cases where unarmed black people -- particularly black men -- were killed (often by police) in the US, yet the courts found that there was sufficient grounds to dismiss or reduce charges based on the shooters claiming the individual "looked suspicious", "looked like a thug", and so on. As individual cases, it's impossible to prove that race is a factor, but once a pattern starts to form... well, if becomes obvious that looking "suspicious" and "like a thug" frequently involves being black.

It may not be intentional on the part of the court or even the shooter (all too often, people make assumptions based on race without being aware that they're doing it), but extremely broad definitions of self-defence make the world a much more dangerous place for minorities, and allow too many bigots to get away with barely a slap on the wrist. Guy just claims that the person made them feel threatened, and presto, no major repercussions -- or, in other words, a subtler version of the gay panic defence, but for bigots of all stripes.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2014, 01:09:47 am by The Right Honourable Mlle Antéchrist »
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Re: Michigan man "stands his ground"
« Reply #7 on: January 27, 2014, 01:16:12 am »
Fair enough.
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wrightway

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Re: Michigan man "stands his ground"
« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2014, 02:13:44 am »
To be more clear, it's not necessarily the actual "stand your ground" law so much as the mindset behind it: If you feel the slightest bit threatened, even if the individual isn't brandishing a weapon or attacking you, you're justified in using deadly force against them. There have been a frightening number of cases where unarmed black people -- particularly black men -- were killed (often by police) in the US, yet the courts found that there was sufficient grounds to dismiss or reduce charges based on the shooters claiming the individual "looked suspicious", "looked like a thug", and so on. As individual cases, it's impossible to prove that race is a factor, but once a pattern starts to form... well, if becomes obvious that looking "suspicious" and "like a thug" frequently involves being black.



Are you talking about the case down in Charleston where the police shot an unarmed black man who had just been in a car accident?

Edit because bright me put the question in the quotes.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2014, 02:18:03 am by Wrightway »

Offline The Illusive Man

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Re: Michigan man "stands his ground"
« Reply #9 on: January 27, 2014, 02:16:00 am »
"Stand Your Ground" is starting to look like the "Gay Panic" defence, except for racists.

To be more clear, it's not necessarily the actual "stand your ground" law so much as the mindset behind it: If you feel the slightest bit threatened, even if the individual isn't brandishing a weapon or attacking you, you're justified in using deadly force against them. There have been a frightening number of cases where unarmed black people -- particularly black men -- were killed (often by police) in the US, yet the courts found that there was sufficient grounds to dismiss or reduce charges based on the shooters claiming the individual "looked suspicious", "looked like a thug", and so on. As individual cases, it's impossible to prove that race is a factor, but once a pattern starts to form... well, if becomes obvious that looking "suspicious" and "like a thug" frequently involves being black.

It may not be intentional on the part of the court or even the shooter (all too often, people make assumptions based on race without being aware that they're doing it), but extremely broad definitions of self-defence make the world a much more dangerous place for minorities, and allow too many bigots to get away with barely a slap on the wrist. Guy just claims that the person made them feel threatened, and presto, no major repercussions -- or, in other words, a subtler version of the gay panic defence, but for bigots of all stripes.

Bingo! I have seen this crap all too many times. The TL:DR version is a racist belief that black people are inherently violent thus always a threat while white people are passive victims. They usually summarize it as “around blacks never relax”, utter garbage.
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Offline Lt. Fred

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Re: Michigan man "stands his ground"
« Reply #10 on: January 27, 2014, 03:26:07 am »
Stand your ground, after all, can't be used by African-Americans.
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Offline chitoryu12

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Re: Michigan man "stands his ground"
« Reply #11 on: January 27, 2014, 10:36:18 am »
My boss is especially fearful of blacks; our workplace is in Sanford, just a few miles from where Trayvon Martin was murdered. He's a sixty-something redneck from Alabama, a blue collar worker who eventually came to own a business. He's downright paranoid of black and Hispanic people; he once went on a rant going "You see what kind of things ride their bikes around here at night?" He refuses to let anyone stay in the office after dark because he's legit afraid that a black guy is going to break into the office.

For the record, we did have a break-in about a year ago. Until very recently, he and his wife have been insistent that it was a bunch of black or Hispanic thugs looking for drug money. Guess what? It was a guy stealing the answer sheets to some exams (the office is a crane and forklift operator/inspector certification institute) and selling them to his employees to let them cheat through the tests.
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Offline Old Viking

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Re: Michigan man "stands his ground"
« Reply #12 on: January 27, 2014, 02:06:38 pm »
Do any of you happen to have that Skittles and iced tea recipe?
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Offline mellenORL

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Re: Michigan man "stands his ground"
« Reply #13 on: January 27, 2014, 02:18:07 pm »
Add any 'scrip cough medicine with codeine. Kids in the eighties just used to chug Robitussin DM by itself. Eww.
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Offline chitoryu12

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Re: Michigan man "stands his ground"
« Reply #14 on: January 27, 2014, 06:39:09 pm »
Yeah, the only active parts of the brew are the prescription drugs you stuff in them. You just add stuff like tea, grape juice, and candy to try and mask the flavor of chugging straight cold medicine.
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