Author Topic: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit  (Read 1115 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Art Vandelay

  • Greatest Person to Ever Grace this Shitty Forum
  • The Beast
  • *****
  • Posts: 8823
  • Gender: Male
  • Check Your Privilege
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #30 on: September 04, 2017, 03:49:48 am »
If you debate an idea, you imply it is worth considering, worth debating. If you allow rallies where chants of "Jews will not replace us" are shouted, you imply that it is an okay opinion to have, and thereby normalize it. If you normalize it, people will stop being horrified at it. The edges near to it will gravitate towards it. And they will recruit more nazis. They will grow their ranks. And then we have WW2 era germany all over again. Nip. It. In. The. Fucking. Bud.
You can't do that. We live in a society where everyone has free speech. This is a very good thing. While you do have to put up with right wingers (or "nazis", as I guess they're totally a German supremacist political party from the 30's and 40's) and other people whose opinions you don't like saying whatever it is they want to say, it also means you and those you agree with can say whatever the fuck you want, regardless of who else is offended.

Besides, silencing people does not "nip it in the bud", so to speak. If anything, it validates their views far more than debunking them ever could. Especially nowadays, when the internet is a thing.

Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

  • The Beast
  • *****
  • Posts: 2440
  • Have you got thumbs? SHOW ME YOUR FUCKING THUMBS!
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #31 on: September 04, 2017, 04:19:21 am »
Wasn't that Conty's argument? That Nazis are restricted to original German NSDAP members from the early 20th century? Ignore those guys with "gas the Jews" memes. They're just channers...or something...
Also, I think people are saying that violence against Nazis is done primarily as an argument against speech-as opposed to a defensive measure against people who want you dead!

Offline Art Vandelay

  • Greatest Person to Ever Grace this Shitty Forum
  • The Beast
  • *****
  • Posts: 8823
  • Gender: Male
  • Check Your Privilege
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #32 on: September 04, 2017, 05:36:08 am »
I don't know, I must've missed that one.

In any case though, I'm not saying they should be ignored just because they're not the same people as actual Nazis. That's kind of a non-sequitor, and it's not as though Nazis have a monopoly on genocide and fascism in the first place. It just annoys me equating modern day wingnuts with Nazis in the same way that referring to earphones as "headphones" or saying "irregardless" gets on my tits.

Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

  • The Beast
  • *****
  • Posts: 2440
  • Have you got thumbs? SHOW ME YOUR FUCKING THUMBS!
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #33 on: September 04, 2017, 05:56:53 am »
Hey Art, the owner of this website is not a member of the NSDAP.

(click to show/hide)
Also, wasn't around in the thirties or the forties.

This fella with the skateboard shield.
(click to show/hide)
Also not an NSDAP card holder.

And these fellas chanting "Jews will not replace us" and surrounding counter protesters, to respectfully exchange viewpoints for sure...
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4uwyctYy0s" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4uwyctYy0s</a>
...were never ever members of the Depression or WWII era Nazi parties, SS, brownshirts or Wehrmacht.

Nothing to worry about, right?
« Last Edit: September 04, 2017, 06:02:28 am by Tolpuddle Martyr »

Offline Art Vandelay

  • Greatest Person to Ever Grace this Shitty Forum
  • The Beast
  • *****
  • Posts: 8823
  • Gender: Male
  • Check Your Privilege
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #34 on: September 04, 2017, 06:11:34 am »
I don't know, I must've missed that one.

In any case though, I'm not saying they should be ignored just because they're not the same people as actual Nazis. That's kind of a non-sequitor, and it's not as though Nazis have a monopoly on genocide and fascism in the first place. It just annoys me equating modern day wingnuts with Nazis in the same way that referring to earphones as "headphones" or saying "irregardless" gets on my tits.

Le sigh

Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

  • The Beast
  • *****
  • Posts: 2440
  • Have you got thumbs? SHOW ME YOUR FUCKING THUMBS!
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #35 on: September 04, 2017, 06:25:28 am »
Fair enough, so what's the cut off for worrying about the kinds of dangers the Nazis posed?
Clearly it isn't just your run of the mill fanatic, because a fanatic brony probably isn't that scary.
However someone who does want entire categories of people exterminated might not be a Nazi exactly but...is that kind of Nazi enough to at least warrant a raised eyebrow or two?

Offline Art Vandelay

  • Greatest Person to Ever Grace this Shitty Forum
  • The Beast
  • *****
  • Posts: 8823
  • Gender: Male
  • Check Your Privilege
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #36 on: September 04, 2017, 06:31:17 am »
However someone who does want entire categories of people exterminated might not be a Nazi exactly but...is that kind of Nazi enough to at least warrant a raised eyebrow or two?
Obviously it warrants a raised eyebrow or two regardless of what you call it. As I've been trying to say, "not a Nazi" does not mean "not a concern". They're two completely separate issues.

Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

  • The Beast
  • *****
  • Posts: 2440
  • Have you got thumbs? SHOW ME YOUR FUCKING THUMBS!
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #37 on: September 04, 2017, 06:47:58 am »
Whatever they're calling themselves. Murderous fuckers are murderous fuckers and self defence is entirely justified against what they do!

Offline RavynousHunter

  • Master Thief
  • The Beast
  • *****
  • Posts: 7275
  • Gender: Male
  • Got the moves like Viktor.
    • My Twitter
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #38 on: September 04, 2017, 04:45:56 pm »
If it goose-steps like a Nazi, wears jackboots like a Nazi, and salutes like a Nazi...
Quote from: Mikasa Ackerman
If I win, I live.  If I lose, I die.  Unless I fight, I cannot win.

Offline Lana Reverse

  • Pope
  • ****
  • Posts: 391
  • Gender: Female
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #39 on: September 04, 2017, 05:50:39 pm »
If it goose-steps like a Nazi, wears jackboots like a Nazi, and salutes like a Nazi...

Then it still deserves the same civil liberties granted to anybody else. While I won't defend Nazi ideas, I will defend their right to make their ideas known.

When Richard Spencer got punched, I felt no sympathy for him. He's a racist prick, no matter how much he tries to couch his ideas in "nonviolence" (as if you can have the ethnic cleansing he advocates without violence). Still, that doesn't mean I approved of the punching. I believe that people should be able to express their ideas, no matter how repugnant they are. Unpopular speech has to be protected precisely because it's unpopular. It wasn't that long ago that the very idea of LGBT rights was deeply unpopular in mainstream America.

Or let's look at it pragmatically. What, exactly, did punching Spencer accomplish? Aside from raising his profile?
I also pissed in an old woman's sauce pan when I was a child. Have you?

Offline dpareja

  • The Beast
  • *****
  • Posts: 3663
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #40 on: September 04, 2017, 06:04:33 pm »
Whatever they're calling themselves. Murderous fuckers are murderous fuckers and self defence is entirely justified against what they do!

Self-defence, certainly.
Quote from: Jordan Duram
It doesn't concern you, Sister, that kind of absolutist view of the universe? Right and wrong determined solely by a single all-knowing, all powerful being whose judgment cannot be questioned and in whose name the most horrendous acts can be sanctioned without appeal?

Offline Lana Reverse

  • Pope
  • ****
  • Posts: 391
  • Gender: Female
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #41 on: September 04, 2017, 07:35:31 pm »
Whatever they're calling themselves. Murderous fuckers are murderous fuckers and self defence is entirely justified against what they do!

Self-defence, certainly.

Yeah, I have no problem with people defending themselves from attacks by these tools. Attacking first is an entirely different matter.
I also pissed in an old woman's sauce pan when I was a child. Have you?

Online Eiki-mun

  • der Löwe aus Mitternacht
  • The Beast
  • *****
  • Posts: 1291
  • Gender: Male
  • On the fields of Breitenfeld.
    • Main Personal Blog
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #42 on: September 04, 2017, 08:09:08 pm »
Or let's look at it pragmatically. What, exactly, did punching Spencer accomplish? Aside from raising his profile?

Catharsis. So much catharsis.
There is no plague more evil and vile to watch spread than the plague that is the Von Habsburg dynasty.

Offline lord gibbon

  • That Weird Guy in the Corner
  • The Beast
  • *****
  • Posts: 845
  • Gender: Male
  • living trivia machine
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #43 on: September 04, 2017, 08:11:52 pm »
Or let's look at it pragmatically. What, exactly, did punching Spencer accomplish? Aside from raising his profile?

Catharsis. So much catharsis.
Also, it scared a lot of the fascists into hiding for a time. They NEED a public platform to spread their ideas, and they won't get it if they're too scared to go out.
Excuse me, sir, do you have a minute to talk about your lord and savior, Hannibal Barca?

Quote from: Seneca
Religion is regarded by the common man as true, by the wise man as false, and by the powerful man as useful
Yeah, if the pagans are so smart, why did Jesus invade Pagan-land on the back of a dragon and kill them all!

Offline Lana Reverse

  • Pope
  • ****
  • Posts: 391
  • Gender: Female
Re: Utterly legitimate and non farcical "antifa manual" found on Reddit
« Reply #44 on: September 04, 2017, 09:05:08 pm »
Or let's look at it pragmatically. What, exactly, did punching Spencer accomplish? Aside from raising his profile?

Catharsis. So much catharsis.
Also, it scared a lot of the fascists into hiding for a time. They NEED a public platform to spread their ideas, and they won't get it if they're too scared to go out.

I hope you don't mind me asking you for a source.
I also pissed in an old woman's sauce pan when I was a child. Have you?