The great Finnish crusaders bravely defended marriage

[kefkaownsall]

http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2013/03/01/finland-parliamentary-committee-narrowly-rejects-equal-marriage-bill/
Vittu nämä homofobiset paskiaiset which according to google is fuck you homophobic bastards.

[Scotsgit]

Sheesh, I thought Scandinavian countries were more liberated than that.

[Dynamic Dragon]

Sheesh, I thought Scandinavian countries were more liberated than that.

This is a country that allied with Nazi Germany to further its imperialist ambitions in Russia.  Are you really surprised?

[kefkaownsall]

I thought it was they didnt like the Soviets and allied with Hitler then changed sides.
To be fair they then during the Cold War were proud allies of Nato and Moscow

[Dynamic Dragon]

I thought it was they didnt like the Soviets and allied with Hitler then changed sides.
To be fair they then during the Cold War were proud allies of Nato and Moscow

That's the "official" version.  In reality, Mannerheim had plans for a "Greater Finland".

[kefkaownsall]

Hmm.  Gotta go look that up.  Since that was crazy you guys were lucky to only lose a tiny part and that was only because you had White Death.

[Dynamic Dragon]

To be fair, though, the Finns never collaborated with Nazi persecution policies, unlike, say, Mussolini.  Moreover, the Soviet Union wasn't exactly a sympathetic target.

[Askold]

a) The Committee rejected the bill because it did not get enough votes. Usually you need 100 votes from the parlament to get a bill going but since they only got 75 or so they tried to pass it through the committee. (The Committee does have homophobes who would have voted against it anyway though.)

b) A petition has been started now and if they get enough votes the parlament might start making the law anyway.

c)Sorry about this, but I read a lot of history particularly wars which include our wars: In 1939 During the winter war we got help offers from the Brits & French and Germans. When the French prime minister send his personal promise of 50'000 french soldiers coming to help us we actually stopped our peace negotiations with the USSR (We were actually very close to making a peace agreement that both would agree to.) Then it turned out that the offer was not approved by the french goverment, the prime ministers re-election campaign relied on his plan and he was afraid that the war would end too soon... And it turned out that the help would only come if Norway and Sweden let the armies march trhough, which they did not approve.

So, we just let go of our best chance for peace with decent offer because a politician wanted to use the good PR from helping Finland to get more votes. And the war went on for few months. Then the Germans come and offer to help us get some payback...

Many people have claimed that Finland was basically a stick in the river, helplessly just going with the flow of history, this theory is a bit too simplified although you have to admit that a small country trapped between fighting superpowers hasn't got that many choices to make. It is true that Mannerheim and many other Finns wanted to build "Great Finland" and during the 1920's some volunteer forces had been fighting in Soviet Karelia trying to start an uprising there to unite them with Finland. When we got a chance to take back what was lost and maybe some more many were eager to take the chance. (Our eventual fight against the Germans was a part of the peace agreement with USSR. Basically a betrayal in the hopes that we might save some of Finland. If it would have looked like we need help to drive off the Germans, the red army would have come to "help" although no one believed that they would have left afterwards.)

As for the Nazies and their persecution... When they asked our president if we wanted their help with our "Jew problem" he answered that we have no problem with the jew, in fact 1000 of their young men were fighting in our military and they were just like any other finns. In fact the only field synagogue in the eastern front was in the Finnish jewish battalion. Which was stationed next to german troops. And they enjoyed watching the germans gringe when they saw the synagogue, which had by funny coincidence been placed right next to the nearest germans.  (Units were formed from communities so that the people in them would know each other and work together better than strangers, that is why most of the jews served in one battalion.)

Another funny story: Several Finnish Jews were offered the iron cross. They all refused.

[kefkaownsall]

Still doesn't make it right   Also would the law allow gay adoptions

[Dakota Bob]

I believe gay couples in civil partnerships are allowed to adopt here.

Sheesh, I thought Scandinavian countries were more liberated than that.

This is a country that allied with Nazi Germany to further its imperialist ambitions in Russia.  Are you really surprised?

It's true, we are all nazis. Also, we have a moonbase.

[Askold]

Still doesn't make it right  

The alliance with the nazies or the gender-neutral-marriage-law thing?

Also would the law allow gay adoptions

I assume that this was a question: Yes. At the moment the only differences with a marriage and "registered union" (the separate but almost equal version for the gay couples) are adoption rights and the ability to automatically get the last name of the spouse.

For those who support gender-neutral marriage the adoption thing seems to be the biggest deal (If one person in the couple has a child, in a married couple the other person can get a shared custody through "internal adoption" for same sex couples this is not an option.) Those against it usually have their biggest problem with calling it a "marriage."

[kefkaownsall]

Both and sorry I see some polls that have more people approving marriage then adoption

[Scotsgit]

Both and sorry I see some polls that have more people approving marriage then adoption

The Finns weren't fans of the Nazis, but they weren't fans of the Soviets either:  At the end of the day, the Soviets had decided that much of the Baltic states belonged to them, without so much as consulting the people who lived there.  Hitler and Stalin had, with the signing of the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact, divided up most of Europe between them:  the Baltic states were forced into the USSR, the other side became part of 'Greater Germany'.  The Finns were left isolated from the other countries who could have helped (Britain was fighting a war on various fronts, France was in disarray and the other allied countries were taking their cues from those two) and after the bitter fighting of the Winter War, there was no way that the Finns would have allied with the Soviets against anyone. The alliance with Germany was the only hope they had left of retaining any part of their sovereignty.

[Dynamic Dragon]

Both and sorry I see some polls that have more people approving marriage then adoption

The Finns weren't fans of the Nazis, but they weren't fans of the Soviets either:  At the end of the day, the Soviets had decided that much of the Baltic states belonged to them, without so much as consulting the people who lived there.  Hitler and Stalin had, with the signing of the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact, divided up most of Europe between them:  the Baltic states were forced into the USSR, the other side became part of 'Greater Germany'.  The Finns were left isolated from the other countries who could have helped (Britain was fighting a war on various fronts, France was in disarray and the other allied countries were taking their cues from those two) and after the bitter fighting of the Winter War, there was no way that the Finns would have allied with the Soviets against anyone. The alliance with Germany was the only hope they had left of retaining any part of their sovereignty.

True, but that doesn't mean there weren't ulterior motives.

[Scotsgit]

Both and sorry I see some polls that have more people approving marriage then adoption

The Finns weren't fans of the Nazis, but they weren't fans of the Soviets either:  At the end of the day, the Soviets had decided that much of the Baltic states belonged to them, without so much as consulting the people who lived there.  Hitler and Stalin had, with the signing of the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact, divided up most of Europe between them:  the Baltic states were forced into the USSR, the other side became part of 'Greater Germany'.  The Finns were left isolated from the other countries who could have helped (Britain was fighting a war on various fronts, France was in disarray and the other allied countries were taking their cues from those two) and after the bitter fighting of the Winter War, there was no way that the Finns would have allied with the Soviets against anyone. The alliance with Germany was the only hope they had left of retaining any part of their sovereignty.

True, but that doesn't mean there weren't ulterior motives.

But was Finland in any state to gain them?