Author Topic: Libertarian surprisingly ok with slavery.  (Read 293 times)

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Offline Askold

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Libertarian surprisingly ok with slavery.
« on: February 18, 2017, 11:17:08 am »
http://m.startribune.com/lewis-book-offers-provocative-analysis-on-slavery-and-civil-rights/369306761/

This coming from the same people who think that taxation is slavery/theft and claiming to promote "freedom" is kinda weird doublethink. Or possibly cognitive dissonance.

His point seems to be that as long as he is not a slaveor actively enslaving others he has no right to interfere with other people owning slaves...

No matter what happens, no matter what my last words may end up being, I want everyone to claim that they were:
"If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine."
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Offline Sigmaleph

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Re: Libertarian surprisingly ok with slavery.
« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2017, 08:19:14 pm »
I think he was trying to make a reduction ad absurdum, saying that the logic people use to defend same-sex marriage would generalise to defending slavery. Would have to read it in context to be sure.

(either way he's wrong, of course, just wrong about different things)
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Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

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Re: Libertarian surprisingly ok with slavery.
« Reply #2 on: February 18, 2017, 09:50:17 pm »
http://m.startribune.com/lewis-book-offers-provocative-analysis-on-slavery-and-civil-rights/369306761/

This coming from the same people who think that taxation is slavery/theft and claiming to promote "freedom" is kinda weird doublethink. Or possibly cognitive dissonance.

His point seems to be that as long as he is not a slaveor actively enslaving others he has no right to interfere with other people owning slaves...

When he says "slavery doesn't affect me" there's an unspoken racial narrative here. Slavery "doesn't affect him" because he's not part of the historically enslaved population of North America and the people who owned slaves are part of the same ethnic group as he is. If there was any possibility of "slavery affecting him" in terms of him being kidnapped and sold on the auction block you can bet your arse he'd be against it!
« Last Edit: February 18, 2017, 09:51:55 pm by Tolpuddle Martyr »

Offline Askold

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Re: Libertarian surprisingly ok with slavery.
« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2017, 03:50:10 pm »
I think he was trying to make a reduction ad absurdum, saying that the logic people use to defend same-sex marriage would generalise to defending slavery. Would have to read it in context to be sure.

(either way he's wrong, of course, just wrong about different things)

So if that was a hyperbole/metaphor/something about the same-sex marriage... Does that mean that he opposes same-sex marriage and implies that it causes harm to people and/or takes away their rights? Because if it is a take on the "gay marriage does not affect you if you aren't going to get into a same-sex marriage so don't complain" then it really does miss the point.
No matter what happens, no matter what my last words may end up being, I want everyone to claim that they were:
"If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine."
Aww, you guys rock. :)  I feel the love... and the pitchforks and torches.  Tingly!

Offline Sigmaleph

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Re: Libertarian surprisingly ok with slavery.
« Reply #4 on: February 19, 2017, 08:09:24 pm »
I think he was trying to make a reduction ad absurdum, saying that the logic people use to defend same-sex marriage would generalise to defending slavery. Would have to read it in context to be sure.

(either way he's wrong, of course, just wrong about different things)

So if that was a hyperbole/metaphor/something about the same-sex marriage... Does that mean that he opposes same-sex marriage and implies that it causes harm to people and/or takes away their rights? Because if it is a take on the "gay marriage does not affect you if you aren't going to get into a same-sex marriage so don't complain" then it really does miss the point.

He opposes same-sex marriage and thinks that the fact that it doesn't affect people except those in it is not a defence. Also something about how society should get a say in the lives of people?

which, like, also terrible failure at being a libertarian.
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Offline davedan

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Re: Libertarian surprisingly ok with slavery.
« Reply #5 on: February 19, 2017, 08:25:09 pm »
I haven't seen many libertarians who weren't complete and utter failures at being libertarians

Offline Sigmaleph

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Re: Libertarian surprisingly ok with slavery.
« Reply #6 on: February 19, 2017, 09:10:00 pm »
I've met a few! it is in fact possible to succeed at being a libertarian

(same-sex marriage is the easiest test to make, as it happens. If their opinion is 'duh, of course it should have the same legal status as opposite-sex marriage' you might have found a genuine person who cares about people being free to make choices. If not, you found a garden-variety conservative who thinks small government is a convenient flag to wave)
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Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

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Re: Libertarian surprisingly ok with slavery.
« Reply #7 on: February 19, 2017, 09:21:29 pm »
I've met a few! it is in fact possible to succeed at being a libertarian
Can you lobby those few to tell the other idiots who call themselves libertarians online how it's done?

Offline davedan

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Re: Libertarian surprisingly ok with slavery.
« Reply #8 on: February 19, 2017, 09:55:17 pm »
I've met a few! it is in fact possible to succeed at being a libertarian

(same-sex marriage is the easiest test to make, as it happens. If their opinion is 'duh, of course it should have the same legal status as opposite-sex marriage' you might have found a genuine person who cares about people being free to make choices. If not, you found a garden-variety conservative who thinks small government is a convenient flag to wave)

I've seen too many libertarians who had authoritarian tendencies, eg against gay marriage, pro-war on drugs. And were anti-immigration as well.