Author Topic: The most important announcement on this thread.  (Read 1485 times)

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Offline Art Vandelay

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #30 on: September 03, 2018, 12:18:07 am »
And here I thought the whole "headmate" fad was well and truly over.

Offline niam2023

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #31 on: September 03, 2018, 12:30:48 am »
Remember that one Tumblr girl who thought she shat out one of her headmates and wanted to get help finding it?
Living Life, Lifting, Waiting for Summer

Offline Art Vandelay

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #32 on: September 03, 2018, 12:45:25 am »
Damn, I almost spat chips all over my screen. Ah, that was truly ridiculous.

Come to think of it, maybe that's what all of this is really about. Every time Jake takes a shit, he curls out one of his parallel universe selves, and he can only get a new one when he finds another True Heir. So he has to keep digging them up in order to stay topped up. Recently, he probably got explosive diarrhoea from some bad Mexican food, which is why he's been going through so many True Heirs as of late.

Offline Askold

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #33 on: September 03, 2018, 03:00:58 am »
If Jacob is really all about lineage then he should be Orthodox Christian. Western bits of the Roman empire fell and the Byzantine became the only successor to Rome.

And Tsarist Russia inherited the the throne of Rome next and being the last remnant of Tsarist Russia the autonomous Republic of Finland was the last remaining bastion of Rome.
No matter what happens, no matter what my last words may end up being, I want everyone to claim that they were:
"If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine."
Aww, you guys rock. :)  I feel the love... and the pitchforks and torches.  Tingly!

Offline Jacob Harrison

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #34 on: September 03, 2018, 11:35:20 am »
If Jacob is really all about lineage then he should be Orthodox Christian. Western bits of the Roman empire fell and the Byzantine became the only successor to Rome.

And Tsarist Russia inherited the the throne of Rome next and being the last remnant of Tsarist Russia the autonomous Republic of Finland was the last remaining bastion of Rome.

The Byzantine Empire was only the successor of the Eastern Roman Empire since the Empire got divided. The Catholic Church was only the successor of the Western Empire.

Offline Jacob Harrison

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #35 on: September 03, 2018, 11:36:58 am »
The pagan conquerors still for the most part allowed Christians religious freedom and Christianity still flourished. Being a remnant of the Roman Empire made the Church the successor. And Church approval legitimizes mostly former pagan conquers because since they are legitimized, legitimacy is then based on who their legitimate successors are..
Well then, if the approval of the church trumps lineage, then every king up to Henry VIII has been legitimate, as their coronations were presided over and therefore obviously approved by the church. If church approval is good enough to legitimise pagans, then surely it's more than enough to legitimise actual Catholics, right?

I never said tha approval of the Church trumps lineage. I said that it legitimizes pagans and that further legitimacy comes from the lineage of the legitimized pagans.
But it does Trump lineage because by your own admission it means that the current, formerly pagan rulers and not the descendants of the previous government are the "true rulers".

The Catholic Church was the successor of the Western Roman Empire so the rulers were legitimized by the successors of the previous government.

Offline Askold

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #36 on: September 03, 2018, 12:54:07 pm »
If Jacob is really all about lineage then he should be Orthodox Christian. Western bits of the Roman empire fell and the Byzantine became the only successor to Rome.

And Tsarist Russia inherited the the throne of Rome next and being the last remnant of Tsarist Russia the autonomous Republic of Finland was the last remaining bastion of Rome.

The Byzantine Empire was only the successor of the Eastern Roman Empire since the Empire got divided. The Catholic Church was only the successor of the Western Empire.
The Byzantine Empire was the legitimate successor to the Roman Empire. By denying this you prove that you don't really care about succession or who is the rightful heir. The way you handle this situation is what my people refer as "the same way as the devil reads the bible."
No matter what happens, no matter what my last words may end up being, I want everyone to claim that they were:
"If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine."
Aww, you guys rock. :)  I feel the love... and the pitchforks and torches.  Tingly!

Offline Jacob Harrison

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #37 on: September 03, 2018, 01:57:59 pm »
If Jacob is really all about lineage then he should be Orthodox Christian. Western bits of the Roman empire fell and the Byzantine became the only successor to Rome.

And Tsarist Russia inherited the the throne of Rome next and being the last remnant of Tsarist Russia the autonomous Republic of Finland was the last remaining bastion of Rome.

The Byzantine Empire was only the successor of the Eastern Roman Empire since the Empire got divided. The Catholic Church was only the successor of the Western Empire.
The Byzantine Empire was the legitimate successor to the Roman Empire. By denying this you prove that you don't really care about succession or who is the rightful heir. The way you handle this situation is what my people refer as "the same way as the devil reads the bible."

As I said, the Empire got divided so it is the successor of the Eastern part not the Western part.

Offline Askold

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #38 on: September 03, 2018, 02:11:07 pm »
The western bits collapsed and Byzantine Empire became the sole rightful successor. By denying this you are simply proving that you don't care about the right of inheritance.
No matter what happens, no matter what my last words may end up being, I want everyone to claim that they were:
"If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine."
Aww, you guys rock. :)  I feel the love... and the pitchforks and torches.  Tingly!

Offline Svata

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #39 on: September 03, 2018, 04:39:41 pm »
Jacob. Wanna know a secret? It's in the spoiler below to protect those that don't wanna know. Cause it's a secret.


(click to show/hide)
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Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #40 on: September 03, 2018, 05:07:46 pm »
If Jacob is really all about lineage then he should be Orthodox Christian. Western bits of the Roman empire fell and the Byzantine became the only successor to Rome.

And Tsarist Russia inherited the the throne of Rome next and being the last remnant of Tsarist Russia the autonomous Republic of Finland was the last remaining bastion of Rome.

The Byzantine Empire was only the successor of the Eastern Roman Empire since the Empire got divided. The Catholic Church was only the successor of the Western Empire.
The Byzantine Empire was the legitimate successor to the Roman Empire. By denying this you prove that you don't really care about succession or who is the rightful heir. The way you handle this situation is what my people refer as "the same way as the devil reads the bible."

As I said, the Empire got divided so it is the successor of the Eastern part not the Western part.
The 'western part' was splintered, looted and overtaken by invaders, so much so that later emperors abandoned Rome and set up shop in Ravenna. When the "last emperor" Romulus Augustulus, a guy entirely dependent on his foreign patron King  Odoacer, was deposed in 476 there wasn't much of a "western empire" left to defend. The Goths ate it, and no I don't mean New Romantics who dress like vampires.

Offline Jacob Harrison

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #41 on: September 03, 2018, 06:10:52 pm »
If Jacob is really all about lineage then he should be Orthodox Christian. Western bits of the Roman empire fell and the Byzantine became the only successor to Rome.

And Tsarist Russia inherited the the throne of Rome next and being the last remnant of Tsarist Russia the autonomous Republic of Finland was the last remaining bastion of Rome.

The Byzantine Empire was only the successor of the Eastern Roman Empire since the Empire got divided. The Catholic Church was only the successor of the Western Empire.
The Byzantine Empire was the legitimate successor to the Roman Empire. By denying this you prove that you don't really care about succession or who is the rightful heir. The way you handle this situation is what my people refer as "the same way as the devil reads the bible."

As I said, the Empire got divided so it is the successor of the Eastern part not the Western part.
The 'western part' was splintered, looted and overtaken by invaders, so much so that later emperors abandoned Rome and set up shop in Ravenna. When the "last emperor" Romulus Augustulus, a guy entirely dependent on his foreign patron King  Odoacer, was deposed in 476 there wasn't much of a "western empire" left to defend. The Goths ate it, and no I don't mean New Romantics who dress like vampires.

And the Catholic Church was left as a remnant.

Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #42 on: September 03, 2018, 06:23:04 pm »
You are completely ignoring Askold's point, deliberately one presumes. Your fixation on lineages is dependent on familial lines, the RCC did not have a familial line of succession but the Byzantine empire did.

Offline Art Vandelay

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #43 on: September 03, 2018, 07:14:36 pm »
The pagan conquerors still for the most part allowed Christians religious freedom and Christianity still flourished. Being a remnant of the Roman Empire made the Church the successor. And Church approval legitimizes mostly former pagan conquers because since they are legitimized, legitimacy is then based on who their legitimate successors are..
Well then, if the approval of the church trumps lineage, then every king up to Henry VIII has been legitimate, as their coronations were presided over and therefore obviously approved by the church. If church approval is good enough to legitimise pagans, then surely it's more than enough to legitimise actual Catholics, right?

I never said tha approval of the Church trumps lineage. I said that it legitimizes pagans and that further legitimacy comes from the lineage of the legitimized pagans.
But it does Trump lineage because by your own admission it means that the current, formerly pagan rulers and not the descendants of the previous government are the "true rulers".

The Catholic Church was the successor of the Western Roman Empire so the rulers were legitimized by the successors of the previous government.

Remnant they may be, but that does not mean they have the authority to legitimise one dynasty over another. If they do, then your search for a True Heir is moot because the Church happily coronated kings of different lineages, and later on failed to even try to challenge the Anglican Church doing the exact same thing. So either the Church does have the authority to legitimise previously illegitimate rulers, in which case Elizabeth II is the True Monarch of England, or it does not, in which case the direct descendent of Flavius Honorius Augustus as per the relevant succession laws is the one and only True Heir to not only England, but the entire rest of the former Western Roman Empire.

You can't have it both ways, Jakington.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2018, 07:54:27 pm by Art Vandelay »

Offline Jacob Harrison

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Re: The most important announcement on this thread.
« Reply #44 on: September 03, 2018, 08:10:29 pm »
You are completely ignoring Askold's point, deliberately one presumes. Your fixation on lineages is dependent on familial lines, the RCC did not have a familial line of succession but the Byzantine empire did.

They were hereditary successors of those who were given the Eastern half of the Empire when it was divided, as they were not given the Western half. The Roman Empire has dynasties but wasn’t strictly hereditary as there were multiple dynasties. Therefore he RCC is the successor of the Western half.