2014 Israel/Gaza conflict: electric boogaloo

[Witchyjoshy]

I really hope this leads both Israel and Palestine to ask "what the hell are we doing"?

I find it amusing (and more than a bit horrifying) that you think Palestine holds equal blame in this matter.  Especially after everything you just read.

What about all the rockets they've been firing into Israel?  I agree, that doesn't justify the slaughter of innocent people, but do you really expect them to just ignore it?

Do you really expect me to take you seriously when you think home made bottle rockets are equivalent to bombs, bulldozers, and real, professionally made rockets?

Do you really expect me to give them equivalent blame when the bloodshed at the hands of the IDF is ten, twenty times more than the bloodshed at the hands of the Palestinian people?

I will place blame where it is due, and 80% of the blame goes to Israel right now.

[Ultimate Paragon]

I really hope this leads both Israel and Palestine to ask "what the hell are we doing"?

I find it amusing (and more than a bit horrifying) that you think Palestine holds equal blame in this matter.  Especially after everything you just read.

What about all the rockets they've been firing into Israel?  I agree, that doesn't justify the slaughter of innocent people, but do you really expect them to just ignore it?

Do you really expect me to take you seriously when you think home made bottle rockets are equivalent to bombs, bulldozers, and real, professionally made rockets?

Do you really expect me to give them equivalent blame when the bloodshed at the hands of the IDF is ten, twenty times more than the bloodshed at the hands of the Palestinian people?

I will place blame where it is due, and 80% of the blame goes to Israel right now.

Ah yes, because inferior equipment means you have a moral high ground.

[Ironchew]

If you keep people in a cage and continue to fragment and shrink the boundaries of that cage, they will fight back with whatever weapons they have.

It is highly disingenuous to paint this conflict as anything other than a continuation of Israeli occupation and brutalization. The improvised rockets fired into Israel are an all-too-convenient pretext for this continued slaughter since Netanyahu and co. are not held accountable for their war crimes.

[Ultimate Paragon]

If you keep people in a cage and continue to fragment and shrink the boundaries of that cage, they will fight back with whatever weapons they have.

It is highly disingenuous to paint this conflict as anything other than a continuation of Israeli occupation and brutalization. The improvised rockets fired into Israel are an all-too-convenient pretext for this continued slaughter since Netanyahu and co. are not held accountable for their war crimes.

If that were true, then the assault would have begun months ago.

[Witchyjoshy]

If you keep people in a cage and continue to fragment and shrink the boundaries of that cage, they will fight back with whatever weapons they have.

It is highly disingenuous to paint this conflict as anything other than a continuation of Israeli occupation and brutalization. The improvised rockets fired into Israel are an all-too-convenient pretext for this continued slaughter since Netanyahu and co. are not held accountable for their war crimes.

If that were true, then the assault would have begun months ago.

Israel has all the time in the world.  Palestine doesn't.

"Months ago" is meaningless.

[Ultimate Paragon]

If you keep people in a cage and continue to fragment and shrink the boundaries of that cage, they will fight back with whatever weapons they have.

It is highly disingenuous to paint this conflict as anything other than a continuation of Israeli occupation and brutalization. The improvised rockets fired into Israel are an all-too-convenient pretext for this continued slaughter since Netanyahu and co. are not held accountable for their war crimes.

If that were true, then the assault would have begun months ago.

Israel has all the time in the world.  Palestine doesn't.

"Months ago" is meaningless.

If you don't support Hamas, then why are you acting like you do?

[MadCatTLX]

There's a story circulating that 3 little boys were playing on the beach and were killed...deliberately.  The gunners on artillery used to murder them bracketed them to get a better shot.

Ironbite-tell me again how this is justified?

You know the most insane part is that this whole thin was witnessed by several international journalists, one of who was kicking the ball around with the boys just minutes before.

[Witchyjoshy]

If you keep people in a cage and continue to fragment and shrink the boundaries of that cage, they will fight back with whatever weapons they have.

It is highly disingenuous to paint this conflict as anything other than a continuation of Israeli occupation and brutalization. The improvised rockets fired into Israel are an all-too-convenient pretext for this continued slaughter since Netanyahu and co. are not held accountable for their war crimes.

If that were true, then the assault would have begun months ago.

Israel has all the time in the world.  Palestine doesn't.

"Months ago" is meaningless.

If you don't support Hamas, then why are you acting like you do?

Oh look, MORE false equivalency by Ultimate Paragon.

I don't support Hamas.  I do, however, support an oppressed people.  A people who have been driven out of their homes.  A people who have been killed.  The children who have been intentionally targetted and slaughtered.

To claim that they are equavalent to Israel in their blame is to blame them for being oppressed.  And that, to me, is anathema to basic human dignity.  YOU are anathema to basic human dignity.

[Ironchew]

If you don't support Hamas, then why are you acting like you do?

oboy herewego...

UP, did you just pull the false dichotomy fallacy on us? I support the freedom of the occupied Palestinian territories to trade and travel outside their borders and possibly gain statehood -- or better yet, get rid of the whole Jewish/Muslim theocracy nonsense and turn Israel and Palestine into one secular state where all people are appropriately represented. How you spin that into supporting Hamas is only indicative of your desperation in losing this obscene debate.

[Ultimate Paragon]

If you keep people in a cage and continue to fragment and shrink the boundaries of that cage, they will fight back with whatever weapons they have.

It is highly disingenuous to paint this conflict as anything other than a continuation of Israeli occupation and brutalization. The improvised rockets fired into Israel are an all-too-convenient pretext for this continued slaughter since Netanyahu and co. are not held accountable for their war crimes.

If that were true, then the assault would have begun months ago.

Israel has all the time in the world.  Palestine doesn't.

"Months ago" is meaningless.

If you don't support Hamas, then why are you acting like you do?

Oh look, MORE false equivalency by Ultimate Paragon.

I don't support Hamas.  I do, however, support an oppressed people.  A people who have been driven out of their homes.  A people who have been killed.  The children who have been intentionally targetted and slaughtered.

To claim that they are equavalent to Israel in their blame is to blame them for being oppressed.  And that, to me, is anathema to basic human dignity.  YOU are anathema to basic human dignity.

I know you don't support Hamas.  I was merely asking why you go so far to defend them, while simultaneously criticizing Israel to the point of borderline demonization. 

I agree, this is contemptible.  And I'm not blaming them for being oppressed.  What I am doing is blaming Hamas for its role in this tragedy.  If they hadn't performed their military coup in Gaza, none of this would have happened.  Essentially, they created a problem so that they could solve it.

Oh, and now you've stooped to personal attacks.  Classy.  Well, congratulations.  You've just been reported.

[Witchyjoshy]

Oh please, like you're one to talk about personal attacks.

Also, none of this wouldn't have happened if Israel hadn't fucking invaded Palestine.

You can try to blame Hamas and Palestine all you want, but Israel shares most of the fucking blame in this.

I will believe Hamas and Palestine are equivalent to Israel when Hamas starts bulldozing Israeli homes, driving the Israeli people into a corner, launching military grade bombs at their hospitals, their homes, etc.

Honestly, right now, the IDF is three times as much the terrorists as Hamas is.

[Ultimate Paragon]

Oh please, like you're one to talk about personal attacks.

Also, none of this wouldn't have happened if Israel hadn't fucking invaded Palestine.

You can try to blame Hamas and Palestine all you want, but Israel shares most of the fucking blame in this.

I will believe Hamas and Palestine are equivalent to Israel when Hamas starts bulldozing Israeli homes, driving the Israeli people into a corner, launching military grade bombs at their hospitals, their homes, etc.

Honestly, right now, the IDF is three times as much the terrorists as Hamas is.

Um, Palestinians have done some monstrous things.  Ever hear of the Coastal Road Massacre?

I agree, the Palestinian people as a whole should not have to suffer.  However, Hamas's role in this tragedy should not be ignored or whitewashed.

[Witchyjoshy]

Oh please, like you're one to talk about personal attacks.

Also, none of this wouldn't have happened if Israel hadn't fucking invaded Palestine.

You can try to blame Hamas and Palestine all you want, but Israel shares most of the fucking blame in this.

I will believe Hamas and Palestine are equivalent to Israel when Hamas starts bulldozing Israeli homes, driving the Israeli people into a corner, launching military grade bombs at their hospitals, their homes, etc.

Honestly, right now, the IDF is three times as much the terrorists as Hamas is.

Um, Palestinians have done some monstrous things.  Ever hear of the Coastal Road Massacre?

The Coastal Road massacre of 1978 was an attack involving the hijacking of a bus on Israel's Coastal Highway in which 38 Israeli civilians, including 13 children, were killed, and 71 were wounded

A drop in the bucket compared to what Israel's currently, at this very moment, doing to Palestine.

[Ultimate Paragon]

Oh please, like you're one to talk about personal attacks.

Also, none of this wouldn't have happened if Israel hadn't fucking invaded Palestine.

You can try to blame Hamas and Palestine all you want, but Israel shares most of the fucking blame in this.

I will believe Hamas and Palestine are equivalent to Israel when Hamas starts bulldozing Israeli homes, driving the Israeli people into a corner, launching military grade bombs at their hospitals, their homes, etc.

Honestly, right now, the IDF is three times as much the terrorists as Hamas is.

Um, Palestinians have done some monstrous things.  Ever hear of the Coastal Road Massacre?

The Coastal Road massacre of 1978 was an attack involving the hijacking of a bus on Israel's Coastal Highway in which 38 Israeli civilians, including 13 children, were killed, and 71 were wounded

A drop in the bucket compared to what Israel's currently, at this very moment, doing to Palestine.

Why are you treating this like a numbers game?

[Witchyjoshy]

Oh please, like you're one to talk about personal attacks.

Also, none of this wouldn't have happened if Israel hadn't fucking invaded Palestine.

You can try to blame Hamas and Palestine all you want, but Israel shares most of the fucking blame in this.

I will believe Hamas and Palestine are equivalent to Israel when Hamas starts bulldozing Israeli homes, driving the Israeli people into a corner, launching military grade bombs at their hospitals, their homes, etc.

Honestly, right now, the IDF is three times as much the terrorists as Hamas is.

Um, Palestinians have done some monstrous things.  Ever hear of the Coastal Road Massacre?

The Coastal Road massacre of 1978 was an attack involving the hijacking of a bus on Israel's Coastal Highway in which 38 Israeli civilians, including 13 children, were killed, and 71 were wounded

A drop in the bucket compared to what Israel's currently, at this very moment, doing to Palestine.

Why are you treating this like a numbers game?

Is that the best defense you've got to my argument?  Deflecting won't save you from reality.

Then ignoring the numbers (which is a terrible thing to do), the level of atrocity happening to the Palestinean people is easily FAR worse than what happened in that massacre.  Their home are bulldozed, they've been quarantined (and I've yet to see any actual evidence that the quarantine has lifted), their children are being intentionally targetted and killed...

If Hamas had been doing what Israel's been doing, you wouldn't be defending their actions, you would be crying about how they're dirty terrorists.

All I'm doing is what you refuse to do - scrutinize Israel's actions and decry their actions as terrorism, which they fit every single qualifer for and then some.