Steubenville Verdict is in...

[niam2023]

It does not matter to me what the many, in terms of the town, need. Their entire football team was complicit, they were silent supporters, and not a one has condemned the actions of his team mates.

If Steubenville loses its football team, it loses its football team. Silent supporters need to be punished too.

Society needs to be taught, too, that your throw and whatever average does not make you exempt from crimes. We need to punish more of our young football players for drinking while being underage, for doing what they usually do. They must be taught they CANNOT do what they usually do.

[dpareja]

It does not matter to me what the many, in terms of the town, need. Their entire football team was complicit, they were silent supporters, and not a one has condemned the actions of his team mates.

If Steubenville loses its football team, it loses its football team. Silent supporters need to be punished too.

Society needs to be taught, too, that your throw and whatever average does not make you exempt from crimes. We need to punish more of our young football players for drinking while being underage, for doing what they usually do. They must be taught they CANNOT do what they usually do.

So while I agree in principle that being good at sports shouldn't make you somehow exempt from criminal punishment, would this apply equally to every underage person caught drinking? It seems just as unfair to punish the sports stars disproportionately harshly as it does to punish them disproportionately lightly.

[Scotsgit]

It does not matter to me what the many, in terms of the town, need. Their entire football team was complicit, they were silent supporters, and not a one has condemned the actions of his team mates.

If Steubenville loses its football team, it loses its football team. Silent supporters need to be punished too.

Society needs to be taught, too, that your throw and whatever average does not make you exempt from crimes. We need to punish more of our young football players for drinking while being underage, for doing what they usually do. They must be taught they CANNOT do what they usually do.

So while I agree in principle that being good at sports shouldn't make you somehow exempt from criminal punishment, would this apply equally to every underage person caught drinking? It seems just as unfair to punish the sports stars disproportionately harshly as it does to punish them disproportionately lightly.

I don't see underage drinking anywhere near as serious as rape.  As someone once said "Let the punishment fit the crime".  If that means a harsher sentence for these two, so be it.

[dpareja]

It does not matter to me what the many, in terms of the town, need. Their entire football team was complicit, they were silent supporters, and not a one has condemned the actions of his team mates.

If Steubenville loses its football team, it loses its football team. Silent supporters need to be punished too.

Society needs to be taught, too, that your throw and whatever average does not make you exempt from crimes. We need to punish more of our young football players for drinking while being underage, for doing what they usually do. They must be taught they CANNOT do what they usually do.

So while I agree in principle that being good at sports shouldn't make you somehow exempt from criminal punishment, would this apply equally to every underage person caught drinking? It seems just as unfair to punish the sports stars disproportionately harshly as it does to punish them disproportionately lightly.

I don't see underage drinking anywhere near as serious as rape.  As someone once said "Let the punishment fit the crime".  If that means a harsher sentence for these two, so be it.

That's not what I'm asking: should underage drinking by sports stars be itself punished more harshly than underage drinking by others (assuming everything else is equal)?

[Captain Jack Harkness]

It does not matter to me what the many, in terms of the town, need. Their entire football team was complicit, they were silent supporters, and not a one has condemned the actions of his team mates.

If Steubenville loses its football team, it loses its football team. Silent supporters need to be punished too.

Society needs to be taught, too, that your throw and whatever average does not make you exempt from crimes. We need to punish more of our young football players for drinking while being underage, for doing what they usually do. They must be taught they CANNOT do what they usually do.

So while I agree in principle that being good at sports shouldn't make you somehow exempt from criminal punishment, would this apply equally to every underage person caught drinking? It seems just as unfair to punish the sports stars disproportionately harshly as it does to punish them disproportionately lightly.

I don't see underage drinking anywhere near as serious as rape.  As someone once said "Let the punishment fit the crime".  If that means a harsher sentence for these two, so be it.

That's not what I'm asking: should underage drinking by sports stars be itself punished more harshly than underage drinking by others (assuming everything else is equal)?

Nope, but that's not even applicable here.

The point is that these people need to be taken off their pedestals and treated like anyone else.

[clockworkgirl21]

I don't think underage drinking should even be a crime (I know, then it wouldn't be underage, but whatever).

This case is pretty black and white, I think. There is no "he said she said" and the boys even plead guilty. There is no reason to defend their actions whether the girl was drunk or not.

[Askold]

Wait?! Is underage drinking illegal in USA? Usually it is just bying alcohol while minor, or selling alcohol to minors that is illegal. At least in Finland I don't think possession is illegal. (Cops will take it away and notify your parents though.)

That is why parents can give their kids a taste of alcohol so that they can get their first experience to it in a "controlled enviroment" rather than boozing out in some party.

[Distind]

Wait?! Is underage drinking illegal in USA? Usually it is just bying alcohol while minor, or selling alcohol to minors that is illegal. At least in Finland I don't think possession is illegal. (Cops will take it away and notify your parents though.)

That is why parents can give their kids a taste of alcohol so that they can get their first experience to it in a "controlled enviroment" rather than boozing out in some party.

Serving is illegal. There may be some provisions for parents serving, but if you're not the legal guardian I do believe you're quite fucked when the cops show up. Not entirely sure on possession, but I do believe it can get you into some kind of trouble.

[ThunderWulf]

Wait?! Is underage drinking illegal in USA? Usually it is just bying alcohol while minor, or selling alcohol to minors that is illegal. At least in Finland I don't think possession is illegal. (Cops will take it away and notify your parents though.)

That is why parents can give their kids a taste of alcohol so that they can get their first experience to it in a "controlled enviroment" rather than boozing out in some party.

Serving is illegal. There may be some provisions for parents serving, but if you're not the legal guardian I do believe you're quite fucked when the cops show up. Not entirely sure on possession, but I do believe it can get you into some kind of trouble.

Yeah, I do believe that if you're at home and like your dad gives you A beer to drink or something like that, yeah, of course you're not going to get in trouble.  But you can definitely get in trouble if you're even AT a party where there's underage drinking going on, even if you weren't drinking.

[niam2023]

Underage drinking was just a point I made as an example of principle, as one of those small things football players are let do, when they shouldn't be allowed that privilege unless its afforded in the same way to everyone.

The fact is, we give far too much of a pedestal and too much of a free ride to the sports stars. Its time they start losing some of their demi-god status among our society.

It lets them think bullying people is okay, it lets them think they can get away with everything. Its a damn dangerous attitude to have. Because then you get cases like Steubenville, you get cases where football team members bully gay teens into suicide, and you get an entitled culture in the NFL who feels they can do no wrong.

[chitoryu12]

Underage drinking is pretty typical in a high school anyways; it ain't just the football players who get away with it. Very few administrators want to go to the trouble of stamping it out and the cops usually won't get involved unless they're major hardasses or it looks like the party/kids are going to get too out of control, so it tends to slide in most places.

[Canadian Mojo]

AW hell, I just feel like stirring the pot for some reason.

Heroes are held to a higher standard so we should punish them more severely when they fuck up. They are role models for the rest of us and if they can't be an example they should serve as a warning.

[chitoryu12]

AW hell, I just feel like stirring the pot for some reason.

Heroes are held to a higher standard so we should punish them more severely when they fuck up. They are role models for the rest of us and if they can't be an example they should serve as a warning.

So how do you classify a "hero"?

[TheUnknown]

Wait?! Is underage drinking illegal in USA? Usually it is just bying alcohol while minor, or selling alcohol to minors that is illegal. At least in Finland I don't think possession is illegal. (Cops will take it away and notify your parents though.)

That is why parents can give their kids a taste of alcohol so that they can get their first experience to it in a "controlled enviroment" rather than boozing out in some party.

Serving is illegal. There may be some provisions for parents serving, but if you're not the legal guardian I do believe you're quite fucked when the cops show up. Not entirely sure on possession, but I do believe it can get you into some kind of trouble.

It also depends on which state you're living in.  I looked up Indiana, and it's completely illegal here.  In some states, however, minors can drink if supervised by a guardian.

[Canadian Mojo]

AW hell, I just feel like stirring the pot for some reason.

Heroes are held to a higher standard so we should punish them more severely when they fuck up. They are role models for the rest of us and if they can't be an example they should serve as a warning.

So how do you classify a "hero"?

Apparently being able to toss a pointy ball around in a high school league ranks high enough on the ranks of heroes for some towns people to abandon ethics in an attempt to protect them.