The Trial of George Zimmerman

[chitoryu12]

Except he wouldn't have been in that situation if he hadn't chased Martin down. And if I understand it right, Martin had no obligation to retreat and was perfectly within his rights to defend himself. Regardless of who threw the first punch, if it was Martin, I still think Zimmerman should have been held responsible for putting Martin in a position where he thought he had to attack Zimmerman to protect himself. I doubt Martin went out that night looking for a fight, unlike Zimmerman.

It is a doubled edged sword.  Martin did have the right to stand his ground, but it is reasonable to think a person who feared for their live would go to safety if he had a chance.  This was brought up in the case of the women who got 20 years for firing at her husband.  The prosecution brought up the fact that she passed multiply ways to escape while on her way to get her gun.

The problem is that by its very nature, Stand Your Ground says that you do NOT have a duty to retreat before fighting back. As long as Martin could have reasonably feared for his life, he didn't have to run at all. Suggesting that he may have been in legitimate fear of his life from the guy following him in a truck when he was alone at night (who then got out of his truck to try and continue following him) means that Stand Your Ground would have applied if they bothered to use it in Martin's case. Which they didn't.

[m52nickerson]

The problem is that by its very nature, Stand Your Ground says that you do NOT have a duty to retreat before fighting back. As long as Martin could have reasonably feared for his life, he didn't have to run at all. Suggesting that he may have been in legitimate fear of his life from the guy following him in a truck when he was alone at night (who then got out of his truck to try and continue following him) means that Stand Your Ground would have applied if they bothered to use it in Martin's case. Which they didn't.

I understand what the laws says, but you can still argue that a person who truly feared for their life would try and get to a safe place as fast as possible.  The state did argue that Martin was the person in fear for his life, but there was no evidence to prove that.  Since it was Zimmerman on trial it is he who get the benefit of doubt.

The state simply had no evidence to support a self defense claim for Martin, that is why it did not apply.

[Shane for Wax]

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2013/07/20/new-accusations-against-zimmerman-jurors-as-sheriffs-office-admits-it-allowed-unsupervised-access/

Jurors watched television and movies, exercised at the hotel fitness center, and spent weekends being visited by family and friends.

Wait... WHAT!??!?! How the FUCK, Florida?

[Sleepy]

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2013/07/20/new-accusations-against-zimmerman-jurors-as-sheriffs-office-admits-it-allowed-unsupervised-access/

Jurors watched television and movies, exercised at the hotel fitness center, and spent weekends being visited by family and friends.

Wait... WHAT!??!?! How the FUCK, Florida?

There's been an awful lot of shady stuff with this case. And whatever happened to that witness who appeared in court before he actually testified? I thought that was illegal, but I haven't heard about any consequences. Forgive me if that was posted a few pages back, it's hard to read every post in this thread.

[Shane for Wax]

There has been. And I didn't hear about the witness.

[Sleepy]

Here's the article on it. Haven't heard any updates.

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/07/09/19382248-prosecution-zimmerman-witness-may-have-shown-up-too-early?lite

[ironbite]

.....oh no.  Can you say mistrial?

[Witchyjoshy]

Someone probably could, but the question is would it have any effect?

[Shane for Wax]

Here's the article on it. Haven't heard any updates.

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/07/09/19382248-prosecution-zimmerman-witness-may-have-shown-up-too-early?lite

"Editor's note: George Zimmerman has sued NBC Universal for defamation. The company strongly denies the allegation." My favorite lines in that whole article, tbh. Thanks, NBC, you made me smirk.

And thanks, Sleepy, for the link. Much appreciated.

As for a mistrial, I sincerely hope they move for one.

[Auri-El]

How does that work, though? If a mistrial is declared after he was acquitted, does the verdict get thrown out, or is he protected under double jeopardy?

[Clochette]

Someone probably could, but the question is would it have any effect?

Zimmerman can't be tried again, right? That would be double jeopardy.

[m52nickerson]

Since it is the states screw up I don't think Zimmerman can get retried.

[PosthumanHeresy]

Obama's speech was awesome.

The right wing reaction is harsh but unsurprising.

Anyways, I had a thought. Assuming Trayvon actually attacked Zimmerman, could Stand Your Ground apply for his case?

Legally, yes, because he thought his life was threatened. In reality? No. He's black.

Legally, no.  If assuming Martin attacked Zimmerman, Martin would not have been covered as he would have been in the process of committing a felony.  That is unless you could show that Zimmerman threatened Martin to the point Martin feared for his life.

No, unless you could show that Martin felt his life was threatened, whether that threat was real or not.

[m52nickerson]

Obama's speech was awesome.

The right wing reaction is harsh but unsurprising.

Anyways, I had a thought. Assuming Trayvon actually attacked Zimmerman, could Stand Your Ground apply for his case?

Legally, yes, because he thought his life was threatened. In reality? No. He's black.

Legally, no.  If assuming Martin attacked Zimmerman, Martin would not have been covered as he would have been in the process of committing a felony.  That is unless you could show that Zimmerman threatened Martin to the point Martin feared for his life.

No, unless you could show that Martin felt his life was threatened, whether that threat was real or not.

Yes, you are correct.  Zimmerman would have have had to actually threatened Martin.  There was just no way for the state to show Martin feared for his life. 

[Witchyjoshy]

They pulled it out of their ass for Zimmerman, and he was the one who had the fucking gun.

The court could've reasonably proven Martin's innocence... assuming they didn't crucify him for being a black kid.