Author Topic: The Just World Fallacy  (Read 4093 times)

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Offline Shane for Wax

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The Just World Fallacy
« on: September 13, 2013, 04:41:19 pm »
“Psychologists have found that people’s belief in a just world helps explain how they react to innocent victims of negative life circumstances. People become cognitively frustrated when presented with stories of victims who suffer through little fault of their own. They can deal with this frustration in two ways: they can conclude that the world is an unjust place, or they can decide that the victim is somehow to blame. Most people reconcile their psychological distress by blaming the victim. Even when we know that suffering is undeserved, it is psychologically easier to blame the victim rather than give up the idea that the world is basically fair.”

And, coincidentally, that mindset doesn't sound fair either.

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Offline Askold

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Re: The Just World Fallacy
« Reply #1 on: September 13, 2013, 05:12:02 pm »
Well that theory would certainly explain a lot.
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Offline Her3tiK

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Re: The Just World Fallacy
« Reply #2 on: September 13, 2013, 07:21:14 pm »
This is why I dislike the idea of karma. There is simply too much out there that contradicts the notion of some great balancing force out there somewhere. That, and how incredibly anthropocentric, arrogant, selfish, and petty a notion it is.
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Offline Witchyjoshy

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Re: The Just World Fallacy
« Reply #3 on: September 13, 2013, 08:58:24 pm »
This is why I dislike the idea of karma. There is simply too much out there that contradicts the notion of some great balancing force out there somewhere. That, and how incredibly anthropocentric, arrogant, selfish, and petty a notion it is.

As one of the resident neopagans, I'm giving you a hardy "hear hear!" for this.

Karma in the neopagan sense is bullshit.  Karma in the Indian sense feels like one of those things that was invented to keep the castes in check.
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Offline Ghoti

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Re: The Just World Fallacy
« Reply #4 on: September 13, 2013, 09:30:03 pm »
I once worked with a stoner douchebro who insisted that no aid whatsoever should be given to the less fortunate, because it would "disrupt their karma". His reasoning? If someone has a crime committed against them, they must have committed that crime in a past life. His example was "If someone is raped, they were a rapist in a past life."
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Offline Shane for Wax

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Re: The Just World Fallacy
« Reply #5 on: September 13, 2013, 10:37:30 pm »
I still believe in the rule of three. Just not very hard.

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Offline Barbarella

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Re: The Just World Fallacy
« Reply #6 on: September 14, 2013, 02:22:57 am »
I believe in Karma in a way but I also feel that much of it is reaped in the afterlife. If you get away with bad stuff while alive, you'll pay for it when you die.

Concerning the Laws of Karma & Reciprocity, there's so many variables involved. Different levels, different types.

Who knows?!



Offline JohnE

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Re: The Just World Fallacy
« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2013, 01:13:45 pm »
Ironically, belief in a just world makes the world less just, as someone who believes that is less inclined to actively seek justice and fairness. If you convince yourself that bad things only happen to people who deserve it, you're not likely to recognize and do something about those times when bad things happen to people through little or no fault of their own. If you believe that bad people will be punished and god people rewarded in the afterlife, then you're less motivated to seek to punish evil or reward goodness in this life.

Offline Her3tiK

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Re: The Just World Fallacy
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2013, 01:48:03 pm »
Ironically, belief in a just world makes the world less just, as someone who believes that is less inclined to actively seek justice and fairness. If you convince yourself that bad things only happen to people who deserve it, you're not likely to recognize and do something about those times when bad things happen to people through little or no fault of their own. If you believe that bad people will be punished and god people rewarded in the afterlife, then you're less motivated to seek to punish evil or reward goodness in this life.
Hence the thread about my mother... >.>
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Offline The Right Honourable Mlle Antéchrist

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Re: The Just World Fallacy
« Reply #9 on: September 14, 2013, 01:54:55 pm »
I find it super offensive when people say that "everything happens for a reason" or "god has a plan for you" whenever something shitty happens. It's just so dismissive of a person's suffering.
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Offline Witchyjoshy

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Re: The Just World Fallacy
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2013, 02:00:46 pm »
I find it super offensive when people say that "everything happens for a reason" or "god has a plan for you" whenever something shitty happens. It's just so dismissive of a person's suffering.

Not to mention it's basically saying "God is micromanaging your life and making you suffer for a reason we can't comprehend."

To which the sane reaction would be "Why would I want to worship a God like that?"
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Offline The Right Honourable Mlle Antéchrist

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Re: The Just World Fallacy
« Reply #11 on: September 14, 2013, 02:07:47 pm »
I find it super offensive when people say that "everything happens for a reason" or "god has a plan for you" whenever something shitty happens. It's just so dismissive of a person's suffering.

Not to mention it's basically saying "God is micromanaging your life and making you suffer for a reason we can't comprehend."

To which the sane reaction would be "Why would I want to worship a God like that?"

That too. Call me crazy, but I don't find the idea of being a pawn in a grand scheme all that comforting, particularly if it means that I'm going to have to suffer in order for an asshole god to achieve his goals.
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Offline mellenORL

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Re: The Just World Fallacy
« Reply #12 on: September 14, 2013, 03:31:49 pm »
The world functions like a machine, both natural and human constructs and energy are on the whole pretty chaotic and "meaningless" viewed on that grand scale. On the personal scale though, when bad things happen to good people, you can see that chaos at work on the personal scale, and that the chaos can be put into order by timely action on the part of the bystanders performing real aid. It's how we react as individuals that makes us human versus Humane.

Here's an example of just acting "human" when a bad thing happened to a good person;
http://jtotheizzoe.wordpress.com/2010/11/17/bill-nye-and-the-bystander-effect/

How many of those people were raised in religious households? Did it make any difference whether anyone there had beliefs or not? Lack of action and lack of willingness to stand out from the crowd and respond physically to the emergency was the problem. People reacted, but only within their own minds and they only responded with useless chatter. A flock of somehow mindless humanity, basically. If a person there had prayed for Nye, would that have helped any more than tweeting?

If people really do want to find "meaning" within their lives, they are more likely to find it through actions, not prayer or meditation or writing or chattering or updating their FB status or w/e. It's amazing how much time and energy people waste on lip service to their belief systems, and how that detracts from the doing of things that need to be done ever happening.
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Offline kefkaownsall

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Re: The Just World Fallacy
« Reply #13 on: September 14, 2013, 05:54:48 pm »
I once worked with a stoner douchebro who insisted that no aid whatsoever should be given to the less fortunate, because it would "disrupt their karma". His reasoning? If someone has a crime committed against them, they must have committed that crime in a past life. His example was "If someone is raped, they were a rapist in a past life."
Guess what I did as soon as I could leave that job?
That sounds a lot like fundie Hinduism

Offline Ghoti

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Re: The Just World Fallacy
« Reply #14 on: September 14, 2013, 08:33:33 pm »
It probably was. Note that the guy was white as Wonder Bread.
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