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Community => Politics and Government => Topic started by: Nemo on November 04, 2014, 10:40:36 am

Title: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Nemo on November 04, 2014, 10:40:36 am
Since nobody else started one, I figured I would. This morning I work up, made myself a nice big fancy breakfast, and then headed to the polls to do my part (I don't work until 2:30). I'm not going to call any races just yet, however, I did notice that many of the state offices would be going to Republicans running unopposed. John Oliver had a segment on that trend on Sunday night, if you haven't seen it yet.

In any case, I suspect we'll be getting some Republican victories. History is on their side: midterm elections of a Democratic President. The real question is 2016. If the economy is doing well by then, the Democrats might be able to pull off a win, even though it would be hard.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 04, 2014, 12:18:26 pm
If the Republicans win in 2014, the economy won't be doing well in 2016, of that I guarantee you.

That said, I don't think the Democrats can pull through with this one. We're just gonna have to buckle down for a long period of trying to impeach the President over and over again, interspersed with attempts to repeal Obamacare that will be vetoed over and over.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Random Gal on November 04, 2014, 12:26:51 pm
I voted for Mark Warner and Suzanne Patrick, both of the Democrats running in my district.

Warner's an incumbent former governor, very well-liked, and his opponent, Ed Gillespie, is a douchebag corporate sellout who was the head lobbyist for Enron back in the day, so I think Warner's senate seat isn't going anywhere.

On the other hand, Patrick's opponent, Scott Rigell, is an incumbent with a lot more money to spend and has been maintaining a "bipartisan" appearance while actually trying to grind things to a halt until the Affordable Care Act is repealed, so I doubt she's going to oust him.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Id82 on November 04, 2014, 12:36:16 pm
Congress simply disgusts me. It's all a fucking game to them. They don't fucking care about the people or even care about passing legislation, all they want to do is get re-elected and get more money from corporations. They do nothing to make the president look bad, and then when they take power they do all they can to get the president to veto to make him look bad. All the american people see is the president and blame him for all of the problems, and completely ignore the fact that it is congress that makes laws, it's congress that makes the budget, it's congress that adjusts the debt. The only time a president can even get anything remotely accomplished is in his first four years if he can get past the filibuster.
The whole thing fucking frustrates me.
And of course people acknowledge that congress is the problem, but re elect all the same assholes into office because "It's not my congressman."
We need term limits on senators and representatives. Maybe then instead of worrying about being re elected they would actually try and do something.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ironchew on November 04, 2014, 12:45:43 pm
If the Republicans win in 2014, the economy won't be doing well in 2016, of that I guarantee you.

That said, I don't think the Democrats can pull through with this one. We're just gonna have to buckle down for a long period of trying to impeach the President over and over again, interspersed with attempts to repeal Obamacare that will be vetoed over and over.

The irony here is that Republicans can turn this to their advantage in 2016. They'll start passing budgets with ACA-repealing legislation inside and it will be very easy to accuse the Obama administration of obstructing a functioning legislative branch. If the Obama administration capitulates to Republicans on lots of issues (and we know they will), Democrats will alienate their base even further. Perhaps the worst-case scenario leading up to 2016 would be if we had a majority Republican Senate/House and the Democratic presidential candidate is a Republican-lite like Clinton. Republican-lites almost always lose to the genuine article and I would expect a Republican-majority legislature to sail through on anti-Obama sentiment.

We need term limits on senators and representatives. Maybe then instead of worrying about being re elected they would actually try and do something.

Unless we get money out of politics first I fear this will make the situation worse. The genuinely good legislators will be predictably shuffled out and huge corporations would have an easier time bankrolling campaigns between candidates with no legislative record.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Barbarella on November 04, 2014, 12:46:11 pm
If the GOP gets victories. Lets hope it's not vast. It's still too early to call.

I voted.

Something's gotta give, soon. Something's gonna break. The new Progressive Movement is just starting. The Left will rise again. It just takes time.

Remember, most folks voting the wingnuts in are old people. They'll die soon, then the Dems will start winning again.

No matter what happens, remember, we the Progressives are winning the culture war. The future belongs to us. If the wingnuts take charge, we will not comply. The wingnuts will not go far long.

Even if the GOP wins a few more seats. It isn't over! PROGRESSIVES WILL WIN THE WAR!

The future is OURS!
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 04, 2014, 12:59:12 pm
Ye gods, I wish I could have SpukiKitty's optimism. Unfortunately, I'm thinking by 2018 the Republican Theocracy will be in full effect.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ironchew on November 04, 2014, 12:59:39 pm
Remember, most folks voting the wingnuts in are old people. They'll die soon, then the Dems will start winning again.

No matter what happens, remember, we the Progressives are winning the culture war. The future belongs to us. If the wingnuts take charge, we will not comply. The wingnuts will not go far long.

A poll done recently by the Harvard Institute of Politics (http://www.iop.harvard.edu/likely-millennial-voters-grabs-upcoming-midterm-elections-harvard-youth-poll-finds) says their sample of 18-to-29-year-olds who would "definitely vote" in the midterms are 51% in approval of the GOP gaining control of the legislature while only 47% want Democrats to be in charge.

Much as I would like what Spuki says to be true, the generations before us were saying the same thing. I don't think the Baby Boomers as a whole became more conservative as they got older, but the tiny elite that funds politicians certainly gets richer as they get older.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Barbarella on November 04, 2014, 01:06:35 pm
Remember, most folks voting the wingnuts in are old people. They'll die soon, then the Dems will start winning again.

No matter what happens, remember, we the Progressives are winning the culture war. The future belongs to us. If the wingnuts take charge, we will not comply. The wingnuts will not go far long.

A poll done recently by the Harvard Institute of Politics (http://www.iop.harvard.edu/likely-millennial-voters-grabs-upcoming-midterm-elections-harvard-youth-poll-finds) says their sample of 18-to-29-year-olds who would "definitely vote" in the midterms are 51% in approval of the GOP gaining control of the legislature while only 47% want Democrats to be in charge.

Much as I would like what Spuki says to be true, the generations before us were saying the same thing. I don't think the Baby Boomers as a whole became more conservative as they got older, but the tiny elite that funds politicians certainly gets richer as they get older.

Ding-Dong, You're WRONG!
http://themillenniallegacy.com/the-millennial-generation/progressive/

Millenials being overwhelmingly GOP/Teabaggers is hilarious! Nice try Irontroll. Fuck off!
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 04, 2014, 01:13:01 pm
Spuki, are... are you okay?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Barbarella on November 04, 2014, 01:14:31 pm
Spuki, are... are you okay?

I changed my message.

I'm so sick of Irontroll. I wish he'd just shut up & quit picking on me.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ironchew on November 04, 2014, 01:15:12 pm
Right. They probably polled a group of rich spoiled white kids rather than REAL AMERICAN youths of all demographics.

They published their methodology and they specifically stated that their sample included those inside and outside the undergraduate/college graduate population for a more random cover.

I should also mention that 51% being majority approval is slightly misleading because the poll had a margin of error of +/- 2.6% at 95% confidence.

Sorry, shit-troll...but I'm right and you are wrong!

Millenials for the GOP....That's a LAUGH! HA HA HAAA!

Can you tell knock knock jokes, too LYING IRONTROLL SHIT SUCKER FUCKOFF?

If you want to throw down in Flame & Burn, I'll grab my popcorn.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Barbarella on November 04, 2014, 01:16:14 pm
http://themillenniallegacy.com/the-millennial-generation/progressive/

Today's youth are Progressive, Irontroll.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Nemo on November 04, 2014, 01:23:03 pm
I actually agree that on social issues, progressives dominate among the younger generation. That is true, and has always been true. It is also true that many will become more conservative as they get older. But the good news is this: not all of them do, and they don't go all the way back.

I have a friend at my second job who was homeschooled. I've never made the mistake of talking to him about religion, but I imagine he is a conservative Christian. I mentioned to him one time that I had recently gotten into DnD, something that was anathema to religious conservatives a generation ago. He smiled and said "awesome". Gay rights are another issue. I came from a very conservative small town, and I am shocked at just how many people I went to school with are progressive on that issue.

I suspect that the reason progressives are doing so well on social issues even when we're struggling in other areas is because of the Internet. Social conservatism depends on othering, which is difficult in the Internet age. When I was in church, I learned that Wiccans were more or less Satanists. It was the Internet which allowed me to realize what Wiccans actually are.

Now, I will agree that on economics, we are kind of moving to the right. One of my favorite coworkers is from the UK (he got married to a girl I went to high school with), and he has often told me "you guys need better healthcare". I often explain to him how American history was different than the history of various European nations, and how that shaped our political ideology. Of course, even in Europe, you see some far right figures rising up and wanting to privatize their health care systems. The truth is, there is no final goal of civilization. You get waxing and waning. You get a back and forth political process. If any progressives are ever feeling depressed about the course of America, just read Rapture Ready or any far right blog to see that the other side feels the same way.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 04, 2014, 01:23:55 pm
And unfortunately, a rightward lean on economics makes sure everyone (with the exception of the 1%) suffers.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Barbarella on November 04, 2014, 01:24:37 pm
You know what? Since this entire board is full of the Pessimistic...the weak & stupid and inferior.....a bunch of pus-bags who'll throw in the towel and mistake the light at the end of the tunnel for a train, I will leave this shit-bag nihilist fuckoff webboard!

YOU ARE ALL DISEASED YOU INFERIOR PESSIMIST TOWEL-THROWERS WHO REFUSE TO FIGHT AND RETAIN HOPE! YOU ARE CHILDREN OF THE LOSERS! SORRY SWEETIES! BUT THERE IS A HIGHER POWER! THERE IS A NEW AGE! THIS IS THE DWAPARA YUGA! THE LEFT WILL RISE AGAIN AND THE SUPERIOR NEVER GIVE UP HOPE AND ALWAYS SEE THE SILVER LINING! THE WORLD BELONGS TO THE LEFT! MOTHER GAIA REIGNS! THE MEEK WILL INHERIT THE EARTH & EVIL WILL BE PUNISHED!!! WE ARE IN THE AGE OF AQUARIUS AND THERE ISN'T NOTHING YOU CAN DO ABOUT IT YOU SONS & DAUGHTERS OF SHIT!!!

I'm sticking with the FSTDTs webpage because the folks on the FQAs site are shit!

GOODBYE, WORTHLESS WEAK PESSIMISTS WHO'LL RATHER GIVE UP, ROLL UP & DIE!!! I REFUSE YOUR PSYCHIC VAMPIRISM!!!!!

WHY DON'T YOU ALL JUST F-F-F-FAAAADE AWAAAAYYY!!!!

SO LONG, LOSERS!!!!
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: mellenORL on November 04, 2014, 01:28:06 pm
<cringes> K. Have a better day, Spuki.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 04, 2014, 01:33:54 pm
Jesus Christ on a stick.

Is... is this normal?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Nemo on November 04, 2014, 01:34:00 pm
Well, while I admit that I don't necessarily agree with everything you just said Spuki, I do agree that sometimes I am a bit more pessimist than I should be.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Id82 on November 04, 2014, 01:38:57 pm
.........wow.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ironchew on November 04, 2014, 01:40:25 pm
(http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/288/648/776.gif)
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Id82 on November 04, 2014, 01:42:15 pm
That's one for the main page.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: dpareja on November 04, 2014, 02:03:21 pm
...now that's a ragequit.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: RavynousHunter on November 04, 2014, 02:15:28 pm
...The FUCK?!  Somebody hack Spuki's account or somethin, because that seems a tad OOC, even for her.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 04, 2014, 02:27:45 pm
You know what? Since this entire board is full of the Pessimistic...the weak & stupid and inferior.....a bunch of pus-bags who'll throw in the towel and mistake the light at the end of the tunnel for a train, I will leave this shit-bag nihilist fuckoff webboard!

YOU ARE ALL DISEASED YOU INFERIOR PESSIMIST TOWEL-THROWERS WHO REFUSE TO FIGHT AND RETAIN HOPE! YOU ARE CHILDREN OF THE LOSERS! SORRY SWEETIES! BUT THERE IS A HIGHER POWER! THERE IS A NEW AGE! THIS IS THE DWAPARA YUGA! THE LEFT WILL RISE AGAIN AND THE SUPERIOR NEVER GIVE UP HOPE AND ALWAYS SEE THE SILVER LINING! THE WORLD BELONGS TO THE LEFT! MOTHER GAIA REIGNS! THE MEEK WILL INHERIT THE EARTH & EVIL WILL BE PUNISHED!!! WE ARE IN THE AGE OF AQUARIUS AND THERE ISN'T NOTHING YOU CAN DO ABOUT IT YOU SONS & DAUGHTERS OF SHIT!!!

I'm sticking with the FSTDTs webpage because the folks on the FQAs site are shit!

GOODBYE, WORTHLESS WEAK PESSIMISTS WHO'LL RATHER GIVE UP, ROLL UP & DIE!!! I REFUSE YOUR PSYCHIC VAMPIRISM!!!!!

WHY DON'T YOU ALL JUST F-F-F-FAAAADE AWAAAAYYY!!!!

SO LONG, LOSERS!!!!

Are you okay, Spuki?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Dakota Bob on November 04, 2014, 02:30:05 pm
Is this real life?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Random Gal on November 04, 2014, 02:45:08 pm
Ummmmmmmmmm.......................ok?

How is it that I avoid forum drama like the plague yet still get called a diseased inferior pessimist towel-thrower? I stayed away from all of those arguments. I apologize for whatever I did do.

And what is a Dwapara Yuga?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Veras on November 04, 2014, 03:25:46 pm
Other than the font size and the fact that she's pointing her rage toward us, rather than toward conservatives, is that post really that different from her typical posts?

Is this real life?

Or is it fantasy?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Vypernight on November 04, 2014, 03:56:19 pm
We voted early, hoping to kick Rick Scott and Pam Bondi out of FL.  I don't remember who represents our district (4 or 5, I can't remember), but he's a Republican, so we both voted for the NPA.  Unfortunately, the GOP are projected to be the majority in FL in this election, which royally screws us over.  Hopefully voters come to their senses today.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: ironbite on November 04, 2014, 04:37:10 pm
And voted for who I hope is gonna win.

Ironbite-if the GOP does get Congress, say goodbye to their chances for 2016's big time elections.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: davedan on November 04, 2014, 04:56:39 pm
How many times has Spuki rage quit now. I have at least 3. Back in 3 weeks, if not sooner.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Witchyjoshy on November 04, 2014, 05:09:16 pm
...

Welp, time for a cider.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Art Vandelay on November 04, 2014, 05:15:09 pm
Spukikitty in a nutshell. When her beliefs and reality disagree, in her mind it's reality that's not only wrong, but has to be e-yelled at until it realises this is "the Age of Aquarias" or whatever other new age woo she's moronic enough to take seriously. Then of course she comes back a few weeks later and the whole cycle begins anew.

I have to say, there are few things more annoying than a new age fundie.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 04, 2014, 05:57:25 pm
Spukikitty in a nutshell. When her beliefs and reality disagree, in her mind it's reality that's not only wrong, but has to be e-yelled at until it realises this is "the Age of Aquarias" or whatever other new age woo she's moronic enough to take seriously. Then of course she comes back a few weeks later and the whole cycle begins anew.

I have to say, there are few things more annoying than a new age fundie.

I'm sorry, did you just call her a fundie?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Witchyjoshy on November 04, 2014, 06:06:39 pm
...Sorry, I actually agree with Art on that.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 04, 2014, 06:07:48 pm
...Sorry, I actually agree with Art on that.

Well, why exactly do you think so?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Art Vandelay on November 04, 2014, 06:13:46 pm
I'm sorry, did you just call her a fundie?
Hmm, let me check.
Spukikitty in a nutshell. When her beliefs and reality disagree, in her mind it's reality that's not only wrong, but has to be e-yelled at until it realises this is "the Age of Aquarias" or whatever other new age woo she's moronic enough to take seriously. Then of course she comes back a few weeks later and the whole cycle begins anew.

I have to say, there are few things more annoying than a new age fundie.
As it turns out, I did in fact call her a fundie. The moar you know.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 04, 2014, 06:40:48 pm
I'm sorry, did you just call her a fundie?
Hmm, let me check.
Spukikitty in a nutshell. When her beliefs and reality disagree, in her mind it's reality that's not only wrong, but has to be e-yelled at until it realises this is "the Age of Aquarias" or whatever other new age woo she's moronic enough to take seriously. Then of course she comes back a few weeks later and the whole cycle begins anew.

I have to say, there are few things more annoying than a new age fundie.
As it turns out, I did in fact call her a fundie. The moar you know.

Well then.  What reason do you have to do so?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Sleepy on November 04, 2014, 07:02:48 pm
I'm fairly confident that Warner will win the seat here in Virginia, given his popularity as governor. He's one of the few politicians you feel like you can genuinely trust.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: ironbite on November 04, 2014, 07:08:01 pm
Ed Glipsie was the lawyer for Enron.  I'm pretty sure he's gonna go down pretty hard because of that.

Barbra Comstock on the other hand is Frank Wolf's girl and I took great pleasure in voting for Faust.

Ironbite-hope he gets in.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Cloud3514 on November 04, 2014, 07:36:15 pm
I fully expect the Republicans to win Kansas. Brownback is (somehow) popular and the Tea Party practically runs the place.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Art Vandelay on November 04, 2014, 07:57:44 pm
Well then.  What reason do you have to do so?
Let's see. She believes in objectively false bullshit and when said objectively false bullshit fails to reflect reality, she just clings to it even harder. That alone qualifies her as a fundie. But not only that, she actually gets angry at people and the world in general for failing to see the light and join the One True Faith. Just look at how Ironchew debunked her claim with an actual study from a real university, and she responds by citing some random fuckwit's blog that's not even relevant to what Ironchew said, labels him a troll then goes on to post a ALL CAPS rant in obnoxiously big font about how it's the "Age of Aquarius" or "Dwamaparga Yugara" or whatever bollocks and then ragequits because we all had the audacity to not toe the manic progressive party line. She may have different religion and politics, but she thinks and behaves exactly like the loons over on Rapture Ready.

Besides, do you not recall how she actually tried to murder conservatives with magic spells? That just says it all.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Veras on November 04, 2014, 07:59:20 pm
I'm sorry, did you just call her a fundie?
Hmm, let me check.
Spukikitty in a nutshell. When her beliefs and reality disagree, in her mind it's reality that's not only wrong, but has to be e-yelled at until it realises this is "the Age of Aquarias" or whatever other new age woo she's moronic enough to take seriously. Then of course she comes back a few weeks later and the whole cycle begins anew.

I have to say, there are few things more annoying than a new age fundie.
As it turns out, I did in fact call her a fundie. The moar you know.

Well then.  What reason do you have to do so?

Oh yeah, she's a fundie.  I consider myself very far left, even by the standard of this board, but I cannot wrap my head around the viciousness with which she attacks conservatives.  I disagree with them as much as anybody.  I consider many, if not most, of their ideas and beliefs to be outright repugnant.  She, on the other hand, portrays the people themselves to be repugnant.  And that's not just the wingnuts like Andrew Schafley and Ken Hamm, it is any person who happens to lean to the right.  That's not okay.  Go look at any one of the ignorant, misguided, sickeningly idealistic threads that she starts, and flip the words conservative and progressive.  Any of those posts would make fstdt in a heartbeat.  The post that she just made approaches savagesusie like levels of insanity, just on the other side.

For fuck's sake, she actually used the phrase, "the Left will rise again."  She unironically paraphrased an insane neoconfederate line that absolutely nobody takes seriously to chide the rest of us for not taking her seriously.

Let's compare her behavior to Rationalwiki's characteristics of fundamentalists (http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Fundamentalism#Characteristics_of_fundamentalists)

Quote
1.  Religious idealism is the basis for personal and communal identity;

If not religious idealism, then certainly political idealism describes her.  Then again, the random Hindu phrases that she threw into that post makes me wonder if it isn't both.

Quote
2.  Fundamentalists understand truth to be revealed and unified;

Progressivism isn't a political viewpoint to her, it is TRUTH.

Quote
3.  It is intentionally scandalous (outsiders cannot understand it and will always be outsiders);

Go to any of the random, idealistic threads that she starts and pay attention to how she casts conservatives (or "regressives" or "frummers" or "teahadists" or whatever the hell she calls them) as the scary other.  As the enemy, rather than as people with whom we happen to disagree.

Quote
4.  Fundamentalists envision themselves as part of a cosmic struggle;

She starts an us vs. them cosmic struggle thread every few weeks.  "We can take back this country!  Americans are progressive!  We just need to do this thing!"

Quote
5.  They seize on historical moments and reinterpret them in light of this cosmic struggle;

I would say that claiming that the United States is a progressive country would be a pretty solid example of this, but maybe I'm overreaching there.

Quote
6.  They demonize their opposition and are reactionary;

I don't think I could write a better description of her than this sentence.

Quote
7.  Fundamentalists are selective in what parts of their tradition and heritage they stress;
8.  They are primarily led by a narrow demographic (e.g. white males);
9.  They envy modernist cultural hegemony and try to overturn the distribution of power;

These three don't really apply to her.

Quote
10.  Their logic is so different from normal logic, they cannot be argued with.

In this very thread, when it was suggested that perhaps the millennial generation was not quite as progressive as she was assuming, her response was to freak out and effectively scream that she was right and the other guy was wrong.

Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Alehksunos on November 04, 2014, 08:43:37 pm
Voted for Wendy Davis and Lettica Van de Putte. Now that the polls are closed I am sure the Texas state is still as red as it has been for the last 20 years and we're confirmed 100% hopeless for anything wonderful. In other words, we've tried and we've failed.

(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n290/CSL1/Total%20Trash/emot-smith_zpsaa1863db.gif)
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ironchew on November 04, 2014, 09:29:52 pm
Voted for Wendy Davis and Lettica Van de Putte. Now that the polls are closed I am sure the Texas state is still as red as it has been for the last 20 years and we're confirmed 100% hopeless for anything wonderful. In other words, we've tried and we've failed.

(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n290/CSL1/Total%20Trash/emot-smith_zpsaa1863db.gif)

You guys must be doing something right if the Texas GOP is scared enough to pass voter suppression laws. They won't be able to hold the demographic shift for much longer...
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Sigmaleph on November 04, 2014, 10:26:57 pm
<Spuki rant snipped for length>

Y'know, every single time you post one of your rants on spirituality and the age of aquarius and whatnot, I am tempted to reply and actually argue the point. I then decide to let it go because it would pointless antagonising and I generally like you as a poster, so why pick a fight.

But it gets hard to hold my tongue when your reaction to disagreement is to call the forum at large: weak, stupid, inferior, pus-bags, worthless, sons and daughters of shit, children of losers, shitbag nihilists, and who knows what else because I lost track.

It's not that it offends me. Words on a screen and all that. It's that clearly whatever measure of respect and desire for civility I hold towards you is not reciprocated. Given the tone you have set, I'm not going to bother with that anymore.

You're wrong. You're wrong about spirituality, but you already knew we disagree on that. You're wrong about progressives being a superior breed of person and conservatives being dumb lazy idiots and I'm running out of polite ways to try to show you that. The reason you are always confused as to why progressives don't win is because of your tribalistic thinking where your ingroup is always right and the outgroup is always wrong.

Many progressives are lazy, dumb, ignorant, or selfish. Many conservatives are honest, clever, educated and kind. They are not intrinsically evil. They happened to end up in the side opposite you mostly by accident of birth*, and because of the way politics works, their position seems reasonable to them as yours seems to you. Are they wrong on many things? Absolutely. So are progressives.

Reality tells you, over and over again, that it's not enough to boldly declare "We are right! We are better!" and expect a victory to come out. Your reaction to that is to say "But we are right! How could we not win?", every time. And when someone tries to argue some nuance, to point out why things don't quite work like that, you get mad and insult them for being pessimists. That's not how you get progress (You also don't get progress through invoking magic and new age fluff, but that's tangential to the point)

I'm not sure if you've decided to quit for good. I hope you haven't. If you are still here and reading this, chill for a bit and decide how you want to continue this conversation, if at all. Fair warning, don't expect respect for your views if you are are unwilling to grant it to others'.


*and if you think where you were born and who your parents are does not influence your politics, well, that's a whole other argument we need to have.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: clockworkgirl21 on November 04, 2014, 10:43:59 pm
Hoping now we can just talk about the election...

It seems as though Republicans will grab the Senate, as predicted.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 04, 2014, 10:49:32 pm
Now to see what they'll do with it.

I expect an impeachment notice by January 21st.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: ironbite on November 04, 2014, 11:02:48 pm
They don't have the votes to convict.

Ironbite-Majority does not equal conviction.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 04, 2014, 11:06:08 pm
They're going to do it anyway, even if they can't convict. Tea party nutjobs.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Nemo on November 04, 2014, 11:08:11 pm
Voted for Wendy Davis and Lettica Van de Putte. Now that the polls are closed I am sure the Texas state is still as red as it has been for the last 20 years and we're confirmed 100% hopeless for anything wonderful. In other words, we've tried and we've failed.

(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n290/CSL1/Total%20Trash/emot-smith_zpsaa1863db.gif)

You guys must be doing something right if the Texas GOP is scared enough to pass voter suppression laws. They won't be able to hold the demographic shift for much longer...
Keep in mind that the voter suppression isn't necessarily a deliberate goal of "stop voter fraud" laws. One of the biggest issues that the Republicans have right now is Tea Party candidates who sincerely believe the Fox News propaganda. You never want to have people representing you who believe your questionable propaganda and talking points. And right now, many Republican voters are terrified that the Democrats are (somehow) stealing elections.

(click to show/hide)

On a tangent, a friend of mine at work (I don't know his leanings) noted my sticker for having voted and said he refused because he didn't like the candidates. Specifically, he noted that the person running for county commissioner (held the job for years, running unopposed) is a freaking lunatic. My friend's father apparently works for the county government and has far too much.... personal insight into this, apparently. And to think, a few weeks ago I was shooting for a job there.

Quote
They're going to do it anyway, even if they can't convict. Tea party nutjobs.
Oh yeah. Like I said: the Tea Party believes their own propaganda, in this case, the idea that President Obama has somehow committed some high crime or misdemeanor. Ironically, I would agree that he has sorta done so by signing the NDAA 2012, as well as various other "war on terror" measures, but even if you could legally impeach him for that, Congress would also have to impeach itself for approving of all that stuff.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: ironbite on November 04, 2014, 11:10:25 pm
Yeah and it'll be the death knell of the Republican party as a whole as the Tea Party nutjobs see that the people they put in Congress can't get the scary brown person out of the White House.  Seriously impeachment is suicide as there is nothing, absolutely nothing, they can impeach him over and it'll stick.  Thanks the Patriot Act, Obama's Teflon.  And when the GOP does this insanely stupid thing and it fails, the Tea Party won't blame the Democrats.  I mean, they're a minority after all.  They'll go after the GOP because they're not Conservative enough.  Sarah Palin will ride that wave like she does her husband's dick, thinking she's a shoe in for a nomination for President.  But all it'll do is split the party.  And Bob's your Uncle, Hiliary's President, Congress goes Blue, and the GOP is in ruins.

Ironbite-2016 can't come fast enough.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 04, 2014, 11:17:41 pm
Yeah and it'll be the death knell of the Republican party as a whole as the Tea Party nutjobs see that the people they put in Congress can't get the scary brown person out of the White House.  Seriously impeachment is suicide as there is nothing, absolutely nothing, they can impeach him over and it'll stick.  Thanks the Patriot Act, Obama's Teflon.  And when the GOP does this insanely stupid thing and it fails, the Tea Party won't blame the Democrats.  I mean, they're a minority after all.  They'll go after the GOP because they're not Conservative enough.  Sarah Palin will ride that wave like she does her husband's dick, thinking she's a shoe in for a nomination for President.  But all it'll do is split the party.  And Bob's your Uncle, Hiliary's President, Congress goes Blue, and the GOP is in ruins.

Ironbite-2016 can't come fast enough.

Can you say "Pyrrhic Victory"?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Nemo on November 04, 2014, 11:18:14 pm
Yeah and it'll be the death knell of the Republican party as a whole as the Tea Party nutjobs see that the people they put in Congress can't get the scary brown person out of the White House.  Seriously impeachment is suicide as there is nothing, absolutely nothing, they can impeach him over and it'll stick.  Thanks the Patriot Act, Obama's Teflon.  And when the GOP does this insanely stupid thing and it fails, the Tea Party won't blame the Democrats.  I mean, they're a minority after all.  They'll go after the GOP because they're not Conservative enough.  Sarah Palin will ride that wave like she does her husband's dick, thinking she's a shoe in for a nomination for President.  But all it'll do is split the party.  And Bob's your Uncle, Hiliary's President, Congress goes Blue, and the GOP is in ruins.

Ironbite-2016 can't come fast enough.
Meh, President Obama didn't sign the Patriot Act, but he chose to extend it. He chose to sign the NDAA. He chose to continue the "War on Terror". His rhetoric is a vast improvement over President Bush, but that's about it.

That said, the Tea Party probably wouldn't be all that opposed to any measures which prosecute foreign sounding people, and I doubt they understand why the NDAA and war on terror is unconstitutional, if they understand that such things are problematic at all. As for 2016, don't brag about how great things are for us and how terrible they are for the Republican Party until Hillary Clinton is actually being sworn in. It all comes down to voter turnout. It is rare for a party to hold the White House for more than eight years, so the Democrats need to run someone who can get people excited to vote. But I honestly don't care too much about 2016. I'm worried about 2020. If the Democrats can win that year (a stretch regardless of how 2016 goes), they can finally undo some of the Republican gerrymandering. What the GOP did to the Democratic districts in my own state of Ohio is almost comedic.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: ironbite on November 04, 2014, 11:18:41 pm
-Spunki having a stroke-

Only explanation I have.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Veras on November 04, 2014, 11:19:44 pm
They're going to do it anyway, even if they can't convict. Tea party nutjobs.

That would be the best thing that could possibly happen for Obama's legacy and the Democratic Party in general.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Sylvana on November 05, 2014, 12:41:27 am
Meh, President Obama didn't sign the Patriot Act, but he chose to extend it. He chose to sign the NDAA. He chose to continue the "War on Terror". His rhetoric is a vast improvement over President Bush, but that's about it.

That said, the Tea Party probably wouldn't be all that opposed to any measures which prosecute foreign sounding people, and I doubt they understand why the NDAA and war on terror is unconstitutional, if they understand that such things are problematic at all. As for 2016, don't brag about how great things are for us and how terrible they are for the Republican Party until Hillary Clinton is actually being sworn in. It all comes down to voter turnout. It is rare for a party to hold the White House for more than eight years, so the Democrats need to run someone who can get people excited to vote. But I honestly don't care too much about 2016. I'm worried about 2020. If the Democrats can win that year (a stretch regardless of how 2016 goes), they can finally undo some of the Republican gerrymandering. What the GOP did to the Democratic districts in my own state of Ohio is almost comedic.

I strongly suspect voter turnout will be low, especially for democrats. Obama basically abused the democratic support base by being more of a republican than Bush was, even after his whole campaign of change. In many ways this has made a lot of people who were hoping for the corrupt moneyed up politics to change to give up and realize that they really only get to choose between red corporates or blue corporates.

As for that gerrymandering, I wouldn't hold your breath, the democrats are weak willed in general and will either leave the districts as is because they honestly dont care, or back down when republicans challenge them about fixing the districts.

Obama did a lot of damage over these last 8 years to the democratic brand, while despite the craziness of the tea party the republican image has remained pretty constant. In some ways the crazy racist homophobic bigoted nut job tea partiers are preferable because as true believers they are at least honest, albeit regressive.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: dpareja on November 05, 2014, 12:52:11 am
I'm worried about 2020. If the Democrats can win that year (a stretch regardless of how 2016 goes), they can finally undo some of the Republican gerrymandering. What the GOP did to the Democratic districts in my own state of Ohio is almost comedic.

The thing is, it's not Congress that a party has to win to set Congressional districts, it's the state legislatures. And the districts for the state legislatures are set by those same state legislatures.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: mythbuster43 on November 05, 2014, 01:15:05 am
I'm happy that my home state of Oregon at least is an oasis from the Red Sea of Fear & Ignorance that's been sweeping over the nation thanks to the combination of an angry, uninformed voter base, the influence of money in politics becoming unlimited, and the demagoguery of the GOP and their sycophants in talk radio, Wingnut blogs, and Fox News. That, and the Democrats spinelessness And inability to stand for something. Even before the 2010 midterms, when the Democrats controlled all three sectors of government, they couldn't get much done because of the obstructionism of the minority GOP. Face it, they're complete cowards who are far to afraid of republicans for their own good.

They can't expect "let's curl up in a ball and hope the GOP nutballs self destruct" to be a working strategy.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Witchyjoshy on November 05, 2014, 01:20:17 am
As my mother put it, "Democrats couldn't keep hold of their dicks if they had superglued them to their hands."
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: mythbuster43 on November 05, 2014, 01:22:18 am
As my mother put it, "Democrats couldn't keep hold of their dicks if they had superglued them to their hands."

Harsh, but true. They are as much to blame as the Koch brothers for the election of obstructionist partisan pro-gridlock Republicans by a country tired of partisanship and gridlock.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: mythbuster43 on November 05, 2014, 01:31:53 am
Although even given all of this information, I can't fathom how the voters of Maine were ignorant enough to reelect Paul LePage, an incumbent who has done literally nothing except rant about the outdated and irrelevant demons of "welfare fraud," talk shit about unions, spread wild conspiracy theories about Obama's "war on whites" and climate change being a fraud, and just generally being a disgrace to the state. He's proven himself to be a demagogue with no leadership abilities whatsoever. Even Rick Perry is a better governor than LePage.

Unless rural Maine can be described as a chunk of Mississippi that broke off, I'm stumped by this.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Witchyjoshy on November 05, 2014, 03:27:19 am
Simple:

People are gullible idiots.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: niam2023 on November 05, 2014, 04:43:04 am
-Spuki having a neurotic fit-

...Damn that reads like a psychotic break in progress.

Has SpukiKitty gone on these kinds of...episodes...often? I mean, it sounds serious. Age of Aquarius? Dwapara Yuga? What the heck is all of this New Age woo?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Vypernight on November 05, 2014, 04:44:26 am
And . . . with Scott, Bondi, and Crenshaw (among other R's) still in office, FL continues to remain in the stone age.  I believe though that, with so many people voting NPA, that the Dems shot themselves in the foot by backing Crist.  Whether he was sincere or not, too many people did not trust him, even if they hate Scott.  And it was just enough to sway votes in Scott's favor.

Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Sleepy on November 05, 2014, 07:17:10 am
I checked Virginia results this morning and Warner barely won. Whew, that was terrifying.

Since the GOP has Senate control now, I suspect we'll see more of the same old getting absolutely nothing done. Good job, America.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: ironbite on November 05, 2014, 07:19:23 am
Yeah Warner won.  Barely and there will be a recount but he won.

Ironbite-shame about Comstock getting in.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Dakota Bob on November 05, 2014, 08:16:35 am
Given the choice between Republican-lite and Republican, is it a surprise people decided to go full Republican?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Random Gal on November 05, 2014, 09:47:35 am
As far as I can tell, the only Democrats who won in Virginia were incumbents. And don't think Warner's seat is completely safe; the margin of victory was narrow enough to potentially allow a recount.

Regarding the choice between Republican and Republican-lite, I will remind you that the "Republican-lite" Bill Clinton managed to beat Republicans twice. Not that he managed to avoid government shutdowns and impeachment threats by being a centrist, mind you.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 05, 2014, 09:52:39 am
As far as I can tell, the only Democrats who won in Virginia were incumbents. And don't think Warner's seat is completely safe; the margin of victory was narrow enough to potentially allow a recount.

Regarding the choice between Republican and Republican-lite, I will remind you that the "Republican-lite" Bill Clinton managed to beat Republicans twice. Not that he managed to avoid government shutdowns and impeachment threats by being a centrist, mind you.

True, but one has to remember the fact that Bush and Dole both also had to contend with Ross Perot.  On the other hand, I think his influence has been overestimated.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Nemo on November 05, 2014, 11:04:33 am
As far as I can tell, the only Democrats who won in Virginia were incumbents. And don't think Warner's seat is completely safe; the margin of victory was narrow enough to potentially allow a recount.

Regarding the choice between Republican and Republican-lite, I will remind you that the "Republican-lite" Bill Clinton managed to beat Republicans twice. Not that he managed to avoid government shutdowns and impeachment threats by being a centrist, mind you.

True, but one has to remember the fact that Bush and Dole both also had to contend with Ross Perot.  On the other hand, I think his influence has been overestimated.
I suspect that Ross Perot is, if not the reason, at least an explanation, of why the Republicans are further from center. Conservatives proved with Perot that they would be willing to split the vote and screw their party if that's what it took to make the Republicans more ideologically pure. American progressives, by contrast, can get easily excited, but don't often stay committed to making change. Look at the Occupy Wall Street, the Coffee Party, etc.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ironchew on November 05, 2014, 12:42:21 pm
Conservatives proved with Perot that they would be willing to split the vote and screw their party if that's what it took to make the Republicans more ideologically pure.

Pretty much exactly what I've been saying progressives need to do. If they voted en masse outside the Democratic party and made them lose a few high-profile elections, the Democrats would come crawling to their platform.

American progressives, by contrast, can get easily excited, but don't often stay committed to making change. Look at the Occupy Wall Street, the Coffee Party, etc.

You can't ignore the fact that police brutalize left-wing protesters as often as possible while leaving right-wing protests alone. Cliven Bundy and his pals were able to aim guns at federal officials and they got off scot-free, but OWS regularly got faces full of pepper spray and mass arrests for standing around.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: SpaceProg on November 05, 2014, 12:56:46 pm
Well'p,  GA's still red as blood and probably will be forever.  And now, I go on with my life because both sides suck and politicians lie.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Random Gal on November 05, 2014, 01:04:51 pm
Conservatives proved with Perot that they would be willing to split the vote and screw their party if that's what it took to make the Republicans more ideologically pure.

Pretty much exactly what I've been saying progressives need to do. If they voted en masse outside the Democratic party and made them lose a few high-profile elections, the Democrats would come crawling to their platform.

That did happen once when Nader ran in 2000, but I don't recall it getting the Democrats to be more progressive or anything.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ironchew on November 05, 2014, 01:44:47 pm
Conservatives proved with Perot that they would be willing to split the vote and screw their party if that's what it took to make the Republicans more ideologically pure.

Pretty much exactly what I've been saying progressives need to do. If they voted en masse outside the Democratic party and made them lose a few high-profile elections, the Democrats would come crawling to their platform.

That did happen once when Nader ran in 2000, but I don't recall it getting the Democrats to be more progressive or anything.

That's because not enough progressives did it. If Bush had won a landslide election in 2000 because of a split vote between Gore and Nader, Democrats would've started paying attention.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Witchyjoshy on November 05, 2014, 02:09:47 pm
Conservatives proved with Perot that they would be willing to split the vote and screw their party if that's what it took to make the Republicans more ideologically pure.

Pretty much exactly what I've been saying progressives need to do. If they voted en masse outside the Democratic party and made them lose a few high-profile elections, the Democrats would come crawling to their platform.

En masse where?  I can't think of a single party that I would actually give enough of a damn to vote for instead of the democratic party.  The ones that seem best are quite pretentious.

Either way, I will say this: The pendulum may have swung in the Republicans' favor way too early.  They've just bought enough rope to hang themselves, and this may cost them in the 2016 election.

The only thing you can count on the public to do is be fickle.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: mythbuster43 on November 05, 2014, 03:06:03 pm
Conservatives proved with Perot that they would be willing to split the vote and screw their party if that's what it took to make the Republicans more ideologically pure.

Pretty much exactly what I've been saying progressives need to do. If they voted en masse outside the Democratic party and made them lose a few high-profile elections, the Democrats would come crawling to their platform.

En masse where?  I can't think of a single party that I would actually give enough of a damn to vote for instead of the democratic party.  The ones that seem best are quite pretentious.

Either way, I will say this: The pendulum may have swung in the Republicans' favor way too early.  They've just bought enough rope to hang themselves, and this may cost them in the 2016 election.

The only thing you can count on the public to do is be fickle.

It's easier to win a state than it is to win a country.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 05, 2014, 04:12:20 pm
So, how long until the Republicans try to repeal Obamacare and Obama vetoes it?

I give it 5 hours. With a side bet that by the first of February, they'll have tried to repeal minimum wage laws.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: mythbuster43 on November 05, 2014, 04:28:36 pm
So, how long until the Republicans try to repeal Obamacare and Obama vetoes it?

I give it 5 hours. With a side bet that by the first of February, they'll have tried to repeal minimum wage laws.

Congress can only do that with the federal minimum wage laws. The state minimum wage laws are decided by state governments.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 05, 2014, 04:34:46 pm
Well, yes, that's what I meant. Obviously the federal congress won't get rid of state minimum wage laws.

That's what state congresses are for.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Old Viking on November 05, 2014, 04:36:43 pm
Stay calm, all.  Here is your assignment.  Come back to me one year from today and tell me what's different about society and the economy.  (Hint: nothing.)
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 05, 2014, 04:38:16 pm
Stay calm, all.  Here is your assignment.  Come back to me one year from today and tell me what's different about society and the economy.  (Hint: nothing.)

Yeah, most likely, all that'll happen is more gridlock and more anger in Congress.  Maybe somebody will get beaten with a cane again.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 05, 2014, 04:45:09 pm
It's hard to remain optimistic when I read Townhall.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Witchyjoshy on November 05, 2014, 05:07:03 pm
Stay calm, all.  Here is your assignment.  Come back to me one year from today and tell me what's different about society and the economy.  (Hint: nothing.)


Actually, yeah, that's a fair point.

You know how Republicans have been stonewalling Democratic attempts at progress (and sometimes regress)?

Guess who is also capable of doing that right now.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Cerim Treascair on November 05, 2014, 05:27:45 pm
Stay calm, all.  Here is your assignment.  Come back to me one year from today and tell me what's different about society and the economy.  (Hint: nothing.)


Actually, yeah, that's a fair point.

You know how Republicans have been stonewalling Democratic attempts at progress (and sometimes regress)?

Guess who is also capable of doing that right now.

On the one hand, the cynical side of me says that'll never fucking happen because they're spineless.

The optimist in me is giggling in anticipation of the GOP getting a taste of their own medicine.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Witchyjoshy on November 05, 2014, 05:30:35 pm
Stay calm, all.  Here is your assignment.  Come back to me one year from today and tell me what's different about society and the economy.  (Hint: nothing.)


Actually, yeah, that's a fair point.

You know how Republicans have been stonewalling Democratic attempts at progress (and sometimes regress)?

Guess who is also capable of doing that right now.

On the one hand, the cynical side of me says that'll never fucking happen because they're spineless.

The optimist in me is giggling in anticipation of the GOP getting a taste of their own medicine.

Democrats love their stonewalling tactics almost as much as the Republicans do.  It's basically a political pastime.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: niam2023 on November 05, 2014, 05:34:30 pm
I still remember Alison Grimes and her pro-coal thing.

I cannot stand anyone who would stand by those creatures who want to destroy the world just to reap a profit.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Veras on November 05, 2014, 06:14:22 pm
Stay calm, all.  Here is your assignment.  Come back to me one year from today and tell me what's different about society and the economy.  (Hint: nothing.)

Yeah, most likely, all that'll happen is more gridlock and more anger in Congress.  Maybe somebody will get beaten with a cane again.

There is actually pretty good research showing that it is easier to govern when congress is controlled by one party than when it is split, even when the president is of a different party. Basically, since 2008 the Republicans have done nothing but throw spitballs from the back of the class. Now they will be expected to actually govern if they hope to be taken seriously in 2016. They are going to be forced to come to the negotiating table, I'm sure with a great deal of kicking and screaming from the Tea Party.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ironchew on November 05, 2014, 06:18:54 pm
Stay calm, all.  Here is your assignment.  Come back to me one year from today and tell me what's different about society and the economy.  (Hint: nothing.)


Actually, yeah, that's a fair point.

You know how Republicans have been stonewalling Democratic attempts at progress (and sometimes regress)?

Guess who is also capable of doing that right now.

That's a possibility. It's perhaps even the most likely outcome.

But I just can't shake the idea of Obama "compromising" with the Republicans and signing their attempts to, say, cut Social Security and steamroll through the Keystone XL pipeline. He agrees with 98% of everything the GOP wants anyway; he just wants the excuse of "the Republicans made me do it."
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Witchyjoshy on November 05, 2014, 06:25:26 pm
Stay calm, all.  Here is your assignment.  Come back to me one year from today and tell me what's different about society and the economy.  (Hint: nothing.)


Actually, yeah, that's a fair point.

You know how Republicans have been stonewalling Democratic attempts at progress (and sometimes regress)?

Guess who is also capable of doing that right now.

That's a possibility. It's perhaps even the most likely outcome.

But I just can't shake the idea of Obama "compromising" with the Republicans and signing their attempts to, say, cut Social Security and steamroll through the Keystone XL pipeline. He agrees with 98% of everything the GOP wants anyway; he just wants the excuse of "the Republicans made me do it."

The funny thing is that, even if he does this, they'll still label him a radical commie liberal hippie nazi facist.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 05, 2014, 06:58:29 pm
Obama has no reason to compromise. After six years of this crap, he knows this. One can only hope that he actually will stand his ground, and not do whatever they say.

But then, that's a pretty dumb hope. He's been caving to them for years. Remember NDAA?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: SpaceProg on November 05, 2014, 08:51:48 pm
Stay calm, all.  Here is your assignment.  Come back to me one year from today and tell me what's different about society and the economy.  (Hint: nothing.)


Agreed.  Thou art wise, Old Viking.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Second Coming of Madman on November 05, 2014, 10:58:37 pm
On the bright side, Rafael won't support Mitch for Majority Leader. So, the predicted establishment and Tea Party infighting may indeed happen.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Lt. Fred on November 06, 2014, 12:03:53 am
They're going to do it anyway, even if they can't convict. Tea party nutjobs.

They'll run an impeachment and then blame Obama for it for not being bipartisan enough.

As far as I can tell, the only Democrats who won in Virginia were incumbents. And don't think Warner's seat is completely safe; the margin of victory was narrow enough to potentially allow a recount.

Regarding the choice between Republican and Republican-lite, I will remind you that the "Republican-lite" Bill Clinton managed to beat Republicans twice. Not that he managed to avoid government shutdowns and impeachment threats by being a centrist, mind you.

True, but one has to remember the fact that Bush and Dole both also had to contend with Ross Perot.  On the other hand, I think his influence has been overestimated.
I suspect that Ross Perot is, if not the reason, at least an explanation, of why the Republicans are further from center. Conservatives proved with Perot that they would be willing to split the vote and screw their party if that's what it took to make the Republicans more ideologically pure. American progressives, by contrast, can get easily excited, but don't often stay committed to making change. Look at the Occupy Wall Street, the Coffee Party, etc.

American Democrats are very committed to change. The DCCC has been pushing the party to the right for nearly a generation, at great electoral cost (obviously, they always blame actual Democrats for their losses. This is nonsense, but it's convenient, so it's believed). What is the point of politics? Is the point to colour the map blue, or is it to change things? If the point is to reform policy, you can accept short-term losses in the interests of turning the Democrats into Republicans. Actual Democrats have to be willing to lose a few elections in order to fight this war within the party. Above all, nothing will change without a party willing to be the party of change.

That means you need to wipe out the Blue Dogs. Exterminate them. Any survivors need to be cowed by much more powerful party discipline. You run on policies X, Y and Z and if you vote against them anywhere, ever, you're immediately out of the party, as are your children and their children. We will punish you severely for disloyalty. This is the only party system worth talking about. The Republicans already have it, which is why they win.

Edit to explain: imagine politics as a bit of a contract. A party wins office promising some policies X, Y and Z. You re-elect them if they provide those policies, and you get rid of them if they don't. In that way you can control the political process. But what happens if it's the system that prevents them from achieving what they said they would achieve? Remember 2008? Obama and the Democrats storm into office promising a bunch of things. Those things don't happen; Obama broke his promise. Why? Because the system wouldn't let him (Democratic traitors and the filibuster were the problem). That isn't democratic; you didn't get what you paid for. Americans overwhelmingly voted for X, Y and Z and didn't get them. The system needs to be changed so you can. That means very strong party loyalty first of all.

More on this later.

Stay calm, all.  Here is your assignment.  Come back to me one year from today and tell me what's different about society and the economy.  (Hint: nothing.)

Yeah, most likely, all that'll happen is more gridlock and more anger in Congress.  Maybe somebody will get beaten with a cane again.

There is actually pretty good research showing that it is easier to govern when congress is controlled by one party than when it is split, even when the president is of a different party. Basically, since 2008 the Republicans have done nothing but throw spitballs from the back of the class. Now they will be expected to actually govern if they hope to be taken seriously in 2016. They are going to be forced to come to the negotiating table, I'm sure with a great deal of kicking and screaming from the Tea Party.

If there's one thing the last six years have proven, it's that Congress never takes the blame. The American people will always blame the President for anything that happens in Federal Government. For six years Republicans have been deliberately blocking legislation they agree with in order to create political and economic chaos in the hope Obama will get the blame. He got the blame.

This means two things: the current Congressional system is broken. You have a defacto parliamentary system where accountability flows hierarchically downwards. The President is, in practice, accountable for anything Congress does. But the president doesn't have any authority over Congress' behaviour. Responsibility without authority is not sustainable. The system can't work.

Secondly, Democrats need to maximise their position within this system. They HAVE to behave like the Republicans have when a Republican is elected President. They MUST. If the Democrats allow the Republicans to pass a single piece of legislation, however mild, the next time they're in office, American Democracy has ended. Elections no longer matter. It doesn't matter what the public wants, they'll get whatever the Republicans tell them they'll get. If the Democrats win five elections to the Republicans one, it won't matter. In their one term the Republicans will swing politics an inch to the right and the Democrats will just do nothing.

On the other hand, if the system becomes total gridlock, Republicans will accept institutional change to reflect the new parliamentary politics. This will return a democratic system.

Stay calm, all.  Here is your assignment.  Come back to me one year from today and tell me what's different about society and the economy.  (Hint: nothing.)


Actually, yeah, that's a fair point.

You know how Republicans have been stonewalling Democratic attempts at progress (and sometimes regress)?

Guess who is also capable of doing that right now.

On the one hand, the cynical side of me says that'll never fucking happen because they're spineless.

The optimist in me is giggling in anticipation of the GOP getting a taste of their own medicine.

Democrats love their stonewalling tactics almost as much as the Republicans do.  It's basically a political pastime.

Nonsense. The Republicans  are a thousand times worse than the Democrats and it's silly to pretend otherwise.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Witchyjoshy on November 06, 2014, 12:44:40 am
Fred, sometimes I like you, but today is not one of those days.

Let's face it, the democrats... sorry, the democratic party, since you blow up whenever anyone says the former, is made up of politicians.  Politicians that will do whatever it takes to get ahead.  They have been quite heavy with the filibustering in the past, and heaven help us, they will continue to filibuster.

However, I did say "almost."  They have an unfortunate tendency to lose their spines at the worst opportunity.  Such as when Obama spent the first years of his presidency catering to the Republican base, or the fact that "blue dog democrats" even exist.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Lt. Fred on November 06, 2014, 12:56:14 am
Fred, sometimes I like you, but today is not one of those days.

Let's face it, the democrats... sorry, the democratic party, since you blow up whenever anyone says the former, is made up of politicians.  Politicians that will do whatever it takes to get ahead.  They have been quite heavy with the filibustering in the past, and heaven help us, they will continue to filibuster.

However, I did say "almost."  They have an unfortunate tendency to lose their spines at the worst opportunity.  Such as when Obama spent the first years of his presidency catering to the Republican base, or the fact that "blue dog democrats" even exist.

How did the Democrats behave under Bush? Bush was an extremely radical President, so we should expect even more obstructionism from the Democrats than from Republicans under Republican-lite Obama. Did the Democrats filibuster literally every single bill for eight years?

(http://www.motherjones.com/files/filibuster-dead-01_0.jpg)


(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A89egjwCYAAEYZO.png:large)

Nope!

To be fair, obstructionism as a tactic is a new phenomenon. Even Newt Gingritch didn't - Newt Gingritch! - didn't try to lock up all politics in order to create economic chaos he could blame on the President. Or rather, he tried it once, got burned, and never tried it again. Nobody has ever abused the filibuster system systematically like has happened over the last six years before. The public wanted hope and change in 2008 and they didn't get it because the Republicans were able to abuse the system

My point is this: in a two party system it is inevitable that someday control of the executive will switch parties. On that day, if the Democrats do not block literally everything that President does, democracy is finished. Voting will not matter.

Quote
Let's face it, the democrats... sorry, the democratic party, since you blow up whenever anyone says the former, is made up of politicians.

Just to address this point: call them "The Democrats" all you like, so long as you don't call them the "Democrat Party", which is a misspelling.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Canadian Mojo on November 06, 2014, 10:35:22 am
The cute part of this Republican 'victory' is that it may well be the victory that costs them the war.

Steamrolling and obstructing the democrats at every turn is remarkably easy, but now they are in a position of accountability with a bunch of uncompromising radicals in their ranks. If they swing hard to the right to accommodate the tea party, they loose the center and loose power. If they don't swing to the right they splinter the party and loose power through vote splitting.

It's all actually very reminiscent of Canada's demise of the Progressive Conservative party. They fragmented when the Reform Party was formed and split the vote which allowed the Liberals to sneak up the middle. It wasn't until the two parties were re-consolidated under a new banner that they were able to come back to power.

Granted, we have a douche bag Conservative as a prime minister at the moment, so it may seem like the bastards won, but this is some pretty old politics (20+ years) playing out their final notes here. The Republicans are going through this now with a demographic clock counting down to midnight very quickly. For your sakes, I hope they don't have enough time.
 
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: mellenORL on November 06, 2014, 11:21:55 am
The GOP and tea party campaigners fully understand exactly how fucking stupid and lazy the general population here is now. That's how they win office. They just come up with a few easily remembered shouting points (Benghazi!), no matter how non-factual they are, and stick to them forever. Governor Scott just got re-elected here in Florida by repeating that former Gov. Crist personally "Lost 800,000 Jobs!" over and over - the 2007 worldwide financial meltdown notwithstanding, because seven years to voters here might as well be in "dog years"; it's completely forgotten within the mists of history stupidity.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Nemo on November 06, 2014, 11:27:42 am
Here's some good news everyone. In 2010, the Tea Party swept into power, upsetting numerous Democrats everywhere. Now, this wasn't wholly unexpected, as the party in power often suffers as midterms. But there was also a mandate involved; the Tea Party message of "cut spending" was able to resonate with many people, whether we admit it or not. The day after the election though, I read an editorial, can't remember where, by a Tea Partier talking about how "we must not forget the other important issues, like morality". Right there, on that last word, that is where I said to myself: that's it. That is how the Tea Party is going to fuck themselves in 2012.

And guess what? I was right. Two years after being elected on a wave of populist fiscal conservatism, the Tea Party had successfully converted the GOP into the Rape Party. But not a "legitimate" rape, mind you, and it was God's gift anyway. That may well happen again too. It's no secret that the Tea Party is fueled by the Rapture Ready demographic, so here's hoping.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Lt. Fred on November 06, 2014, 03:55:23 pm
The cute part of this Republican 'victory' is that it may well be the victory that costs them the war.

Steamrolling and obstructing the democrats at every turn is remarkably easy, but now they are in a position of accountability with a bunch of uncompromising radicals in their ranks. If they swing hard to the right to accommodate the tea party, they loose the center and loose power. If they don't swing to the right they splinter the party and loose power through vote splitting.

Are they, though? Obama's still in the position of accountability, as far as I can tell.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Vypernight on November 06, 2014, 04:32:48 pm
I don't remember my government class 100%, but isn't there something that, if congress tries to pass a bill but the president rejects it, they can somehow bypass him?  Considering the GOP controls both parts of Congress, this wouldn't be difficult, and if it's true, then they can pass and reject anything they want.  Which means they'd have ZERO excuses if things don't imrpove by 2016.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: ironbite on November 06, 2014, 04:36:40 pm
They don't actually have the votes to overturn a veto.

Ironbite-only saving grace right now.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Random Gal on November 06, 2014, 04:37:55 pm
I don't remember my government class 100%, but isn't there something that, if congress tries to pass a bill but the president rejects it, they can somehow bypass him?  Considering the GOP controls both parts of Congress, this wouldn't be difficult, and if it's true, then they can pass and reject anything they want.  Which means they'd have ZERO excuses if things don't imrpove by 2016.

Congress can only override a presidential veto by 2/3 of both the Senate and the House. The Republicans don't have a 2/3 majority in either.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Lt. Fred on November 06, 2014, 04:41:35 pm
I don't remember my government class 100%, but isn't there something that, if congress tries to pass a bill but the president rejects it, they can somehow bypass him?  Considering the GOP controls both parts of Congress, this wouldn't be difficult, and if it's true, then they can pass and reject anything they want.  Which means they'd have ZERO excuses if things don't imrpove by 2016.

If something goes wrong - say, a huge flood or a terrorist group or whatever - the first thing people ask is "what is the president doing". Congress can make that answer "nothing" and then blame him for it.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Id82 on November 06, 2014, 04:42:16 pm
They have to get a super majority vote to bypass a veto. Even though the republicans control the senate, I don't believe they have enough for a 2/3rds super majority vote.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: dpareja on November 06, 2014, 09:01:17 pm
They have to get a super majority vote to bypass a veto. Even though the republicans control the senate, I don't believe they have enough for a 2/3rds super majority vote.

They'd need about 45 Democratic Representatives to defect in the House, and at a bare minimum 13 Democratic Senators (if every outstanding race goes to the Republicans) to defect, in order to override a veto. That's not going to happen.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: mythbuster43 on November 06, 2014, 10:51:40 pm
They have to get a super majority vote to bypass a veto. Even though the republicans control the senate, I don't believe they have enough for a 2/3rds super majority vote.

They'd need about 45 Democratic Representatives to defect in the House, and at a bare minimum 13 Democratic Senators (if every outstanding race goes to the Republicans) to defect, in order to override a veto. That's not going to happen.

It's very rare throughout our history that presidential vetoes are successfully overriden. The most recent that comes to mind is the 80th Congress overriding Harry Truman's veto of a 1947 Right-To-Work law called the Taft-Hartley Act.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: dpareja on November 06, 2014, 11:15:15 pm
They have to get a super majority vote to bypass a veto. Even though the republicans control the senate, I don't believe they have enough for a 2/3rds super majority vote.

They'd need about 45 Democratic Representatives to defect in the House, and at a bare minimum 13 Democratic Senators (if every outstanding race goes to the Republicans) to defect, in order to override a veto. That's not going to happen.

It's very rare throughout our history that presidential vetoes are successfully overriden. The most recent that comes to mind is the 80th Congress overriding Harry Truman's veto of a 1947 Right-To-Work law called the Taft-Hartley Act.

http://legislink.org/us/pl-110-275

Quote
LEGISLATIVE HISTORY--H.R. 6331:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

CONGRESSIONAL RECORD, Vol. 154 (2008):
            June 24, considered and passed House.
            July 9, considered and passed Senate.
WEEKLY COMPILATION OF PRESIDENTIAL DOCUMENTS, Vol. 44 (2008):
            July 15, Presidential veto message.
CONGRESSIONAL RECORD, Vol. 154 (2008):
            July 15, House and Senate overrode veto.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: mythbuster43 on November 07, 2014, 02:00:30 am
Having just looked up the history of vetoes, I know about the override that happened in 2008.

So far in Obama's Presidency, he's only vetoed two bills, the second of which happened four years ago.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: ironbite on November 07, 2014, 04:42:12 pm
Mark Warner is officially declared the winner of his race.  There's a few other races out there that haven't been declared but that's good.

Ironbite-means people aren't over Enron.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ironchew on November 07, 2014, 06:43:22 pm
They have to get a super majority vote to bypass a veto. Even though the republicans control the senate, I don't believe they have enough for a 2/3rds super majority vote.

They'd need about 45 Democratic Representatives to defect in the House, and at a bare minimum 13 Democratic Senators (if every outstanding race goes to the Republicans) to defect, in order to override a veto. That's not going to happen.

Alternatively, they need a sympathetic president that won't veto most of their ideas in the first place. Soon we'll see just how right-wing Obama really is.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: dpareja on November 08, 2014, 02:18:55 am
They have to get a super majority vote to bypass a veto. Even though the republicans control the senate, I don't believe they have enough for a 2/3rds super majority vote.

They'd need about 45 Democratic Representatives to defect in the House, and at a bare minimum 13 Democratic Senators (if every outstanding race goes to the Republicans) to defect, in order to override a veto. That's not going to happen.

Alternatively, they need a sympathetic president that won't veto most of their ideas in the first place. Soon we'll see just how right-wing Obama really is.

Well, the only two bills he has vetoed so far were when the Democratic Party had majorities in both the House and the Senate. (Granted one could argue that that's because nothing worth vetoing was getting passed once Republicans took the House.)
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Beezlebub on November 08, 2014, 03:42:47 am
I hate being an Iowan right now. Despite my best efforts, we've elected Joni "OBAMACARE *Scare chord*" Ernst and Matthew "Those Jews" Ung.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: lord gibbon on November 08, 2014, 04:01:24 am
I'm similarly ashamed of my fellow Coloradans right now, We kicked out Mark Udall, one of the genuinely progressive members of congress, in favor of Cory "Personhood" Gardener.

Also, We now have Gordon Klingenshmit in our state house, but seeing as he's from Colorado Spring's most conservative district, I saw that one coming.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Vypernight on November 09, 2014, 03:16:47 pm
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/07/supreme-court-obamacare-subsidies_n_6122370.html?icid=maing-grid7%7Chtmlws-main-bb%7Cdl1%7Csec3_lnk3%26pLid%3D560465 (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/07/supreme-court-obamacare-subsidies_n_6122370.html?icid=maing-grid7%7Chtmlws-main-bb%7Cdl1%7Csec3_lnk3%26pLid%3D560465)

I was afraid of this.  Instead of using their time to at least pretend to improve things, they'll waste it fighting the ACA again.  i'm still trying to figure out how they got reelected after last year shutting the gov't done over it.  I don't know, maybe they're trying to see how much they can get away with.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: ironbite on November 09, 2014, 04:19:25 pm
I've already said why.

Ironbite-they convinced their voters that their shit don't stink.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 09, 2014, 05:39:39 pm
They won, and they'll probably continue to win, because the American people are uneducated morons.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Beezlebub on November 11, 2014, 12:07:50 am
I'm starting to wonder if elections are rigged by the comedians to ensure that they'll have material for the following years.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Witchyjoshy on November 11, 2014, 12:46:05 am
I'm starting to wonder if elections are rigged by the comedians to ensure that they'll have material for the following years.

What would you even call a government run by comedians?

Comedicracy?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Second Coming of Madman on November 11, 2014, 09:21:33 am
I'm starting to wonder if elections are rigged by the comedians to ensure that they'll have material for the following years.

Damn it, he's onto us.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Canadian Mojo on November 11, 2014, 02:34:34 pm
What would you even call a government run by comedians?

An improvement.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Art Vandelay on November 11, 2014, 06:56:22 pm
I'm starting to wonder if elections are rigged by the comedians to ensure that they'll have material for the following years.

Damn it, he's onto us.

Dane Cook, is that you?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Cerim Treascair on November 11, 2014, 10:18:51 pm
What would you even call a government run by comedians?

An improvement.

'Senator Fluffy' has a nice ring to it, if you ask me.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: RavynousHunter on November 12, 2014, 08:27:16 am
I'd vote for Lewis Black.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Art Vandelay on November 12, 2014, 09:13:06 am
Knowing how these things tend to go, it would probably end just as badly as regular politics. Each election would be between the likes of either Dane Cook or Paulie Shore. Come to think of it, I think we're much better off with things as they are.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: RavynousHunter on November 12, 2014, 10:28:12 am
If he were still alive, I'd suggest we make Moe Howard the President, but alas...
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Igor on November 12, 2014, 10:35:55 am
Rick Mercer for PM!
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: dpareja on November 12, 2014, 12:03:49 pm
Don't forget that Al Franken is a Senator.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Vypernight on November 12, 2014, 03:53:58 pm
They have to get a super majority vote to bypass a veto. Even though the republicans control the senate, I don't believe they have enough for a 2/3rds super majority vote.

They'd need about 45 Democratic Representatives to defect in the House, and at a bare minimum 13 Democratic Senators (if every outstanding race goes to the Republicans) to defect, in order to override a veto. That's not going to happen.

Which means they can screw up everything Obama has done and still blame him.  What are the chances that we could enter yet another recession soon?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Lt. Fred on November 12, 2014, 04:33:49 pm
They have to get a super majority vote to bypass a veto. Even though the republicans control the senate, I don't believe they have enough for a 2/3rds super majority vote.

They'd need about 45 Democratic Representatives to defect in the House, and at a bare minimum 13 Democratic Senators (if every outstanding race goes to the Republicans) to defect, in order to override a veto. That's not going to happen.

Which means they can screw up everything Obama has done and still blame him.  What are the chances that we could enter yet another recession soon?

Depends. The Fed will probably keep cushioning the blow.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Hoplite on November 12, 2014, 07:11:56 pm
Ugh. 4 more years of a batshit-crazy GOP governor.  At least the state House remained Democrat, so that'll keep the state from sinking as far down as it could go in 4 years.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Hoplite on November 12, 2014, 07:16:35 pm
I take it that none of you head about this 65 percent possibility that we'll be in another Republican Recession by the end of 2015? Worth a read anyhow. http://www.newsmax.com/Finance/Predictors-1929-Stock-Market-Crash-Recession-Economy/2014/11/11/id/606657/

Even if it does not happen, and there is a good chance it won't, Republicans are nothing but bad news. You never hear of Republicans recovering this country from depressions and recessions, because they are the cause of them.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: lord gibbon on November 12, 2014, 08:09:02 pm
Just remember, the last time Republicans controlled this many state governments was 1928. Hmmm, anything happen shortly after that?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Askold on November 13, 2014, 01:29:33 am
Just remember, the last time Republicans controlled this many state governments was 1928. Hmmm, anything happen shortly after that?

Yes. Joseph Stalin launched the first five year plan. A British court declared that Canadian women are technically "persons" and therefore allowed to be in the senate. And Martin Luther King was born soon after that.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 13, 2014, 01:34:15 am
Just remember, the last time Republicans controlled this many state governments was 1928. Hmmm, anything happen shortly after that?

Yes. Joseph Stalin launched the first five year plan. A British court declared that Canadian women are technically "persons" and therefore allowed to be in the senate. And Martin Luther King was born soon after that.

Al Capone orchestrated the Saint Valentine's Day Massacre.  Color TV was publicly demonstrated for the first time.  Vatican City became a sovereign state.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Hoplite on November 13, 2014, 08:12:37 am
Black Tuesday, the 1929 Stock Market Crash. It took a World War to get the US out of that Great Depression...
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 13, 2014, 09:26:28 am
Black Tuesday, the 1929 Stock Market Crash. It took a World War to get the US out of that Great Depression...

Of course I knew what you were talking about.  I was just being deliberately obtuse for comedy's sake.  I think Askold was too.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: RavynousHunter on November 13, 2014, 10:12:00 am
You know, I've always had an idea brewing in the back of my head, kind of a game story sort-of based on real world events, where the Next Great War isn't, as most think, individual countries fighting amongst one another, but a massive, global civil war sparked by resentment against megacorporations essentially taking over the world, one dollar at a time.  The fact its at all possible is kinda scary...
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Nemo on November 13, 2014, 10:23:21 am
You know, I've always had an idea brewing in the back of my head, kind of a game story sort-of based on real world events, where the Next Great War isn't, as most think, individual countries fighting amongst one another, but a massive, global civil war sparked by resentment against megacorporations essentially taking over the world, one dollar at a time.  The fact its at all possible is kinda scary...
How is it possible? Who would lead the lower classes? Who would supply them? And why would the lower classes of, say, India, join forces with the lower classes of Pakistan? The traditional Marxist model of people being divided by class more than by national identity is a nice dream, but it I fear it won't be actualized within my own lifetime.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: RavynousHunter on November 13, 2014, 01:01:41 pm
You know, I've always had an idea brewing in the back of my head, kind of a game story sort-of based on real world events, where the Next Great War isn't, as most think, individual countries fighting amongst one another, but a massive, global civil war sparked by resentment against megacorporations essentially taking over the world, one dollar at a time.  The fact its at all possible is kinda scary...
How is it possible? Who would lead the lower classes? Who would supply them? And why would the lower classes of, say, India, join forces with the lower classes of Pakistan? The traditional Marxist model of people being divided by class more than by national identity is a nice dream, but it I fear it won't be actualized within my own lifetime.

Their leader may come from either the proletariat or bourgeoisie, just look at Vladimir Lenin; he was what most would consider bourgeoisie, or at minimum petty bourgeoisie, and yet he lead a rather successful, if violent, revolution of the proletariat.  Black (and/or grey) market suppliers would play an important role in the global revolts, selling munitions to revolutionary guerrillas and supplying them with food and medicine they might not otherwise be able to acquire.  As for one country's proletariat joining another, that would cut fairly evenly along cultural lines: Pakis and Indians might not join one another, but Norwegian and Swedish guerrillas might join together.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Random Gal on November 13, 2014, 01:15:12 pm
Don't forget religion can be another dividing factor. Or possibly a unifying one, but I think it tends to be more divisive at least in developed countries.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: RavynousHunter on November 13, 2014, 01:51:44 pm
Aye, though I tend to group religion in with cultural lines, since the two are almost always interconnected.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: mythbuster43 on November 13, 2014, 03:07:26 pm
I take it that none of you head about this 65 percent possibility that we'll be in another Republican Recession by the end of 2015? Worth a read anyhow. http://www.newsmax.com/Finance/Predictors-1929-Stock-Market-Crash-Recession-Economy/2014/11/11/id/606657/

Even if it does not happen, and there is a good chance it won't, Republicans are nothing but bad news. You never hear of Republicans recovering this country from depressions and recessions, because they are the cause of them.

NewsMax has been saying that "next year the REAL Great Recession will begin" for several years now. That "65% chance" is extracted directly out of some Gold Bug's ass. NewsMax deserves to be taken seriously as much as Glenn Beck.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Vypernight on November 13, 2014, 04:13:50 pm
I take it that none of you head about this 65 percent possibility that we'll be in another Republican Recession by the end of 2015? Worth a read anyhow. http://www.newsmax.com/Finance/Predictors-1929-Stock-Market-Crash-Recession-Economy/2014/11/11/id/606657/

Even if it does not happen, and there is a good chance it won't, Republicans are nothing but bad news. You never hear of Republicans recovering this country from depressions and recessions, because they are the cause of them.

NewsMax has been saying that "next year the REAL Great Recession will begin" for several years now. That "65% chance" is extracted directly out of some Gold Bug's ass. NewsMax deserves to be taken seriously as much as Glenn Beck.

I wonder if the GOP's recent win has made this closer to a reality though.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Hoplite on November 13, 2014, 07:55:54 pm
I take it that none of you head about this 65 percent possibility that we'll be in another Republican Recession by the end of 2015? Worth a read anyhow. http://www.newsmax.com/Finance/Predictors-1929-Stock-Market-Crash-Recession-Economy/2014/11/11/id/606657/

Even if it does not happen, and there is a good chance it won't, Republicans are nothing but bad news. You never hear of Republicans recovering this country from depressions and recessions, because they are the cause of them.

NewsMax has been saying that "next year the REAL Great Recession will begin" for several years now. That "65% chance" is extracted directly out of some Gold Bug's ass. NewsMax deserves to be taken seriously as much as Glenn Beck.

I wonder if the GOP's recent win has made this closer to a reality though.

Higher odds, I would agree. The GOP's economic policies which are anti-Keynesian and counter to Galbraith's economics are a necessary ingredient for causing economic chaos. If I had to give a name to the GOP's economic policy, it would be "instant gratification" or "Ayn Rand Fantasy", which provide instant gratification (lower taxes) at the cost of later economic meltdowns (usually within a few years).

GOPerdammerung is coming. And a Democrat will once again rise up and lead the masses out of it.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Vypernight on November 14, 2014, 04:52:33 am
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/13/john-boehner-government-shutdown_n_6154770.html?icid=maing-grid7%7Chtmlws-main-bb%7Cdl1%7Csec3_lnk3%26pLid%3D563419 (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/13/john-boehner-government-shutdown_n_6154770.html?icid=maing-grid7%7Chtmlws-main-bb%7Cdl1%7Csec3_lnk3%26pLid%3D563419)

So the GOP, back in power, are going to show the country how to run the country correctly . . . by threatening to shutdown the government yet again? 
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Canadian Mojo on November 14, 2014, 09:50:26 am
Quote
...it will destroy the pillars of American Exceptionalism

You know, the sooner you guys get your heads out of your asses about somehow being special and better than the rest of the world the better off you will be because as it stands you are too busy proclaiming "this is AMERICA dammit!" to see what your flaws are, let alone try and fix them.

Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ironchew on November 14, 2014, 10:45:31 am
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/13/john-boehner-government-shutdown_n_6154770.html?icid=maing-grid7%7Chtmlws-main-bb%7Cdl1%7Csec3_lnk3%26pLid%3D563419 (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/13/john-boehner-government-shutdown_n_6154770.html?icid=maing-grid7%7Chtmlws-main-bb%7Cdl1%7Csec3_lnk3%26pLid%3D563419)

So the GOP, back in power, are going to show the country how to run the country correctly . . . by threatening to shutdown the government yet again?

They don't need to shut down anything. All they need to do is attach batshit to funding bills and blame Obama for holding up the budget that Congress passes. It'll be "his fault" the next time the federal government shuts down.

It's from the same playbook, but Democrats will no longer be able to accuse Congress of being obstructionist.
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: ironbite on November 14, 2014, 04:06:50 pm
The GOP knows that Obama won't be running in 2016 right?

Ironbite-right?
Title: Re: 2014 American Midterm Election Thread
Post by: Ironchew on November 14, 2014, 04:19:24 pm
The GOP also knows they have a good chance of winning in 2016 unless Democrats grow a collective backbone. I don't see that happening as long as Democrats continue to accept campaign funding from corporate sponsors with a contrary agenda to their progressive base.