FSTDT Forums
Community => Religion and Philosophy => Topic started by: The Prophet Mohammed (PBUM) on July 09, 2012, 08:48:51 am
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http://english.ahram.org.eg/News/47144.aspx
If it's not bad enough already, listen to this account of her "adultery":
[Provincial Governor Basir] Salangi said two Taliban commanders were sexually involved with the woman in Parwan, either through rape or romantically, and decided to torture her and then kill her to settle a dispute between the two of them.
There's a video of the incident on the page, of particular note is how the mob cheers joyfully when the defenceless woman is shot dead at point-blank range.
Makes you proud to be human, don't it?
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...oh god I was looking for a way to start my week as pissed off as my mother.
Ironbite-fucking Bush.
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Absolutely awful.
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I think the part that bothers me the most is that incidents like this are so common that they barely faze me anymore. :(
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I think the part that bugs me is that despite both men actually wanting her, they choose to kill her instead. How messed up must you be to kill the person you like?
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I think the part that bothers me the most is that incidents like this are so common that they barely faze me anymore. :(
Agreed.
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I think the part that bothers me the most is that incidents like this are so common that they barely faze me anymore. :(
Same.
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I think the part that bugs me is that despite both men actually wanting her, they choose to kill her instead. How messed up must you be to kill the person you like?
They didn't view her as a person, though. They viewed her as a toy. A toy they each wanted to have exclusive rights to. And the "toy" got blamed for it :-/
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One day, I hope the women snap & put these weak little excuses for males in their place!
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Aren't there any REAL men in these societies who speak out for women? Are there any good men? Why wont they & the women join forces & fight back?
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Unfortunately you don't have to be any type of real man to wield a gun.
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Unfortunately you don't have to be any type of real man to wield a gun.
I found an article of REAL AFGHANI MEN who are working to liberate women.
http://www.womensviewsonnews.org/2011/12/male-feminists-fight-for-womens-rights-in-afghanistan/
This article (and variations) is on the net. There are real men who are fighting against the tide of weak little pansy males who oppress men's complete equal...THE WOMAN.
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But nuff said about underestimating the stronger female sex....
Neither sex is inherently "stronger", and the assumption that men are weaker overall than women really isn't any better than painting women as delicate little flowers who swoon over every little thing.
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This person is fucking awesome. And I got to meet her in person. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malalai_Joya)
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Campaigning for human rights for Afghan women seems hopelessly ambitious. At this rate, the best they can ever hope for is animal rights. :-\
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But nuff said about underestimating the stronger female sex....
Neither sex is inherently "stronger", and the assumption that men are weaker overall than women really isn't any better than painting women as delicate little flowers who swoon over every little thing.
I was angry when I wrote that. I'll remove it ASAP! I always write stupid stuff. I'm frustrated. Perhaps it's best to just help all of Afghanistan's female population to get the heck out of there! Misogyny is so entrenched in that culture. Guys had those attitudes even during Afghanistan's more "Modern" period in the mid-20th Century. Apart from a few true real men like the guys in that article I posted, Afghani males are sexist bastards.
If the system won't change, no matter what you do, it's best to get the hell out! Those Afghan guys DON'T DESERVE these ladies!
A lot of Afghan women are actually leaving Afghanistan. On the downside, it's a "brain-drain" since these gals are the mostly the educated young ones....but on the upside, they're getting out! Now, if they & others can only find a way to get their less fortunate sisters out. There should be something like the Underground Railroad to rescue Afghanistan's female population.
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Now, extend that to the rest of the Middle East, and perhaps China...hell, if any society doesn't value you because of arbitrary shit like gender and orientation, you should be given free pass to leave that society, free from any repercussions. Doubly so if you're an actual oppressed minority, not an "oppressed minority" like some crazy-ass Christians think they are.
If your government wants to oppress you, then your government doesn't deserve to have you as a citizen.
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So where exactly do you intend to move the entire female population of the Middle East, Africa, almost all of Asia (sans perhaps Japan and Hong Kong), possibly Latin America and possibly certain parts of Europe? We're talking around two billion people at the very least, and as you're no doubt aware, houses don't build and service themselves.
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We can cull the 2 billion figure down significantly if we just take the hot ones.
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I would not object to that idea.
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I admit that idea was unrealistic. I wrote that out of, I dunno, frustration & stupidity. I think those few guys in that article I posted had the right idea. Have men educate men. Much of the problem of these places is lack of education. A lot of these guys who treat women like cattle are just doing that because it's their culture & that's all they know. I doubt that EVERY SINGLE man in these societies are inherently psychopathic. In order for these societies to grow & prosper, these guys need to be taught. Folks who know better need to teach the boys to respect & honor women & girls as equals, partners & human beings.
These crazy abuses of women are not really due to religion, but due to cultural & tribal custom that has been assumed to be part of the religion. Believe it or not, with a few exceptions, Islam is actually rather pro-woman in places. In real Islam, a woman or girl can get an education, file for divorce, own property, speak her mind, etc. In fact Islamic history actually has some examples of strong women (some who fought alongside Mohammed). Granted, some ideas are old fashioned (gender roles, two women's testimony worth one man's, etc.) but Mohammed's ideas about women were "fair for it's day" as TV Tropes would put it.
Since these folks use religion as an excuse to be uber-misogynists, terrorists or whatever, we need some good, open-minded scholars who know what the religion really teaches to come in & set the record straight.
Education is the supreme weapon against hate, prejudice & tyranny.
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Technically that could apply to all religions. Religions tend to start fairly progressive to attract more followers and become more conservative as people realize that, while telling people that they are equal is all well and good, it means you don't have power over people. Case in point: megachurch preachers blatantly ignoring both the "give up all your possessions" and "love thy neighbor" parts of the Bible.
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Technically that could apply to all religions. Religions tend to start fairly progressive to attract more followers and become more conservative as people realize that, while telling people that they are equal is all well and good, it means you don't have power over people. Case in point: megachurch preachers blatantly ignoring both the "give up all your possessions" and "love thy neighbor" parts of the Bible.
But what if the Religious person is not interested in "power over the people" & genuinely cares about the spiritual and ethical? I agree that folks add to religion to get power & be stupid but some people genuinely believe in the more noble stuff. I believe that religion & faith are not inherently bad or good, rather the folks involved make it bad or good. I don't deny that the various scriptures of various faiths have a lot of garbage in them & that the dogmatic and corrupt hang on to the garbage parts.
You appear to be from the school of thought that all religion & spirituality is bad. I, being a spiritual person, however, believe that religion is flawed & often perverted by tyrannical people. Organized religion tends to get that a lot. It gets too organized, dogmatic, restrictive, cruel, dumb & a lot of hot air. I agree that religion has been a HUGE factor in why this planets a mess. I also agree that the most secular countries tend to be the most Progressive & stable. However, I also agree that, when practiced right, religion & spirituality can be a positive force. That said, I agree that religion is unnecessary & I also believe in separating the spiritual from the religious.
It would be unrealistic and stupid to just barge into these societies and go "YO! BE AN ATHEIST!" because not everyone perceives their reality that way. Some folks are inherently spiritual & see the spiritual as something as real as math, language, senses, light, etc. even if it's intangible. It's better to reform the religious faiths & focus on the good stuff than to just ban it all. I sure as heck don't want to be FORCED to be a strict Anti-Theist Materialist Atheist. That's not who I am.
Let people believe & perceive as they see fit, provided it isn't destructive or stupid. DEEDS NOT CREEDS/NON-CREEDS.
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Technically that could apply to all religions. Religions tend to start fairly progressive to attract more followers and become more conservative as people realize that, while telling people that they are equal is all well and good, it means you don't have power over people. Case in point: megachurch preachers blatantly ignoring both the "give up all your possessions" and "love thy neighbor" parts of the Bible.
But what if the Religious person is not interested in "power over the people" & genuinely cares about the spiritual and ethical?
Then likely they will not rise in power in their religion.
I agree that folks add to religion to get power & be stupid but some people genuinely believe in the more noble stuff.
Sure. It just happens that those people tend not to be the ones in charge.
I believe that religion & faith are not inherently bad or good, rather the folks involved make it bad or good.
Yeah, because humans are human and humans are inherently flawed.
I don't deny that the various scriptures of various faiths have a lot of garbage in them & that the dogmatic and corrupt hang on to the garbage parts.
Yeah. Emphasis on "corrupt." That's exactly what I'm saying.
You appear to be from the school of thought that all religion & spirituality is bad.
That's funny, because I've never expressed or held that belief. How did you get "all beliefs are bad" from "religions become corrupt over time due to people seeking power"?
I, being a spiritual person, however, believe that religion is flawed & often perverted by tyrannical people. Organized religion tends to get that a lot. It gets too organized, dogmatic, restrictive, cruel, dumb & a lot of hot air.
Which is exactly what I said.
I agree that religion has been a HUGE factor in why this planets a mess. I also agree that the most secular countries tend to be the most Progressive & stable. However, I also agree that, when practiced right, religion & spirituality can be a positive force.
I never said otherwise.
That said, I agree that religion is unnecessary & I also believe in separating the spiritual from the religious.
I never said that religion was unnecessary. Why are you putting words in my mouth?
It would be unrealistic and stupid to just barge into these societies and go "YO! BE AN ATHEIST!" because not everyone perceives their reality that way. Some folks are inherently spiritual & see the spiritual as something as real as math, language, senses, light, etc. even if it's intangible. It's better to reform the religious faiths & focus on the good stuff than to just ban it all. I sure as heck don't want to be FORCED to be a strict Anti-Theist Materialist Atheist. That's not who I am.
When did I ever say anything of the sort? I'm not even an atheist, I'm a deist. I think that there may be some sort of higher power, but, if it exists, it's beyond our comprehension and doesn't affect us in our daily lives, and even if we do, in fact, are being watched and cared for by a loving god, a truly loving god would never let death or hatred be waged in its name. So you are assuming a shit-ton of shit.
Let people believe & perceive as they see fit, provided it isn't destructive or stupid. DEEDS NOT CREEDS/NON-CREEDS.
What exactly are you on?
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Smurfette,
I wouldn't try reason in this instance. I think your last line says it all. I mean you wouldn't try reasoning with the gibbering cat lady asking you for a cutting of your hair would you? Just nod smile and keep walking.
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Smurfette,
I wouldn't try reason in this instance. I think your last line says it all. I mean you wouldn't try reasoning with the gibbering cat lady asking you for a cutting of your hair would you? Just nod smile and keep walking.
Oh come now. This site is dedicated to laughing at asinine shit people say, and when it comes to Spuki here, the things she says are pure gold. When you strike gold, you don't just gather up what you find lying about. You mine up every last nugget you can possibly get your mits on.
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Yeah I don't know. Sometimes it just doesn't seem right depending on who it is and Spuki always strikes me as being rather loosely coiled so to speak.
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She strikes me more as a combination of extremely naive and a greatly inflated opinion of her own intelligence. Don't get me wrong, the nuttiness is very much there, just not the variety of nuttiness that warrants a visit from the nice men in white coats.
That said, it's impossible to accurately decide one way or an other based on nothing but a few posts on the internet. Hell, she could even be a troll for all we know.
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Yeah I always get the nuttiness level is up from Whittakers Peanut slab.
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*sigh* I'm sorry. I admit, I do get nutty a lot. Smurfette Principle, I'm sorry I assumed all that stuff about you. I was wrong. Everybody, you're right, I am a nut. I see a psychologist & psychiatrist because of it. I have elements of ADD, Bi-Polar & OCD. I know I'm unstable. I also loathe trolls as much as you guys. I'm sorry if I sound like a geek sometimes. I often write & say the wrong things. The funny thing is, I feel welcome on the main FSTDT site but I never truly feel welcome here on the Board & it's hard to type the right things without people thinking I'm self-important or a wacko, loser or troll. What can I say? Obviously, most of you are a different crowd. Anon-e-moose, whatever, KittyKaboom and a few others are cool with me & are forgiving when I screw up. I guess I can never be part of your clique. Screw you. I'm going back to the main site. The message board is infested by tools. GOODBYE!
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(http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m9hlb69qMk1qmmz6mo2_1280.jpg)
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*sigh* I'm sorry. I admit, I do get nutty a lot. Smurfette Principle, I'm sorry I assumed all that stuff about you. I was wrong. Everybody, you're right, I am a nut. I see a psychologist & psychiatrist because of it. I have elements of ADD, Bi-Polar & OCD. I know I'm unstable. I also loathe trolls as much as you guys. I'm sorry if I sound like a geek sometimes. I often write & say the wrong things. The funny thing is, I feel welcome on the main FSTDT site but I never truly feel welcome here on the Board & it's hard to type the right things without people thinking I'm self-important or a wacko, loser or troll. What can I say? Obviously, most of you are a different crowd. Anon-e-moose, whatever, KittyKaboom and a few others are cool with me & are forgiving when I screw up. I guess I can never be part of your clique. Screw you. I'm going back to the main site. The message board is infested by tools. GOODBYE!
You know, People would probably be a lot more willing to accept you if you typed like a normal human being and not someone with a tenuous grip on their sanity.
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Well, that's flounce #2. We need to start a countdown calendar or something.
And Spuki, it's not that you have mental illness or that you don't "say the right things." Plenty of people have different views than other people on this site. It's when you flip shit (grammatically and factually incorrect shit) and yell and scream and threaten people that everyone becomes uncomfortable. People are often annoying when they first join the site. You, on the other hand, transcend annoyance into possible troll or Poe levels.
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I don't quite understand how she can apologize for having several outbursts, along with elements of bipolar disorder and instability, and yet blame folks on here for being tools. Plenty of us have varying beliefs. The issue isn't the disagreements, but the psychotic manner in which they're stated (by SpukiKitty).
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Thus, we see the problem inherent in assuming that the FSTDT board and mainpage...societies are one in the same. The atmosphere here is different, the people are different, and a lot of the regulars here aren't even registered on the mainpage, let alone regular commentators. The boards, mainpage, and IRC are all entirely separate entities with very different atmospheres.
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I don't quite understand how she can apologize for having several outbursts, along with elements of bipolar disorder and instability, and yet blame folks on here for being tools. Plenty of us have varying beliefs. The issue isn't the disagreements, but the psychotic manner in which they're stated (by SpukiKitty).
This. It doesn't help that the manner is characteristic of trolls who tend to have the same sort of tone in their posts (Mabus being the most obvious, but that one troll a while back who was supposedly going to tell some forum about how terrible we are is another example). There's a subtle difference in tone between "I am angry, but that's understandable given the utter terribleness that this topic is," and, "I'm angry because you aren't listening to me," and, "I'm angry in an out-of-control, scary way."