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Author Topic: Worst of Social Justice  (Read 1548962 times)

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Offline Ultimate Paragon

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8430 on: March 24, 2016, 12:41:32 pm »
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A good guy, a non-violent guy, a totally innocent guy would not have these kinds of charges placed against him. Period. Full stop.#Ghomeshi
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Offline Canadian Mojo

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8431 on: March 24, 2016, 03:55:21 pm »
Quote from: Ultimate Paragon on March 24, 2016, 12:41:32 pm
Quote
A good guy, a non-violent guy, a totally innocent guy would not have these kinds of charges placed against him. Period. Full stop.#Ghomeshi

The old adage where there's smoke there's fire running headlong into the presumption of innocence. I guess in some ways it is an unfortunate byproduct of a justice system that is trusted by it's people because there is an assumption that it would only act if there was compelling evidence to do so. It sucks but a widespread distrust of the justice system would probably be much worse.

Out of curiosity, are you hunting for Canadian justice issues or is Ghomeshi big enough to be international news?

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Offline Ultimate Paragon

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8432 on: March 24, 2016, 04:30:26 pm »
Quote from: Canadian Mojo on March 24, 2016, 03:55:21 pm
Quote from: Ultimate Paragon on March 24, 2016, 12:41:32 pm
Quote
A good guy, a non-violent guy, a totally innocent guy would not have these kinds of charges placed against him. Period. Full stop.#Ghomeshi

The old adage where there's smoke there's fire running headlong into the presumption of innocence. I guess in some ways it is an unfortunate byproduct of a justice system that is trusted by it's people because there is an assumption that it would only act if there was compelling evidence to do so. It sucks but a widespread distrust of the justice system would probably be much worse.

Out of curiosity, are you hunting for Canadian justice issues or is Ghomeshi big enough to be international news?

The latter.  I wouldn't say it's that big, but it's definitely been covered by the American media.
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Offline mellenORL

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8433 on: March 24, 2016, 04:38:09 pm »
And all five charges against him were dismissed today.
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I sympathize completely. However, to use against us. Let me ask you a troll. On the one who pulled it. But here's the question: where do I think it might as well have stepped out of all people would cling to a layman.

Offline Eiki-mun

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8434 on: March 24, 2016, 04:46:38 pm »
Quote from: mellenORL on March 24, 2016, 04:38:09 pm
And all five charges against him were dismissed today.

Well, I guess that's that then. From the stories I read, it sounds like the people accusing him couldn't put together a convincing story. Specifically this one:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-35893813

In particular, this pair of paragraphs:

Quote
"Each complainant was less than full, frank and forthcoming in the information they provided to the media, to the police, to Crown counsel and to this Court," Justice William Horkins wrote in his judgement.

"The evidence of each complainant suffered not just from inconsistencies and questionable behaviour, but was tainted by outright deception," he said.

"At the end of this trial, a reasonable doubt exists because it is impossible to determine, with any acceptable degree of certainty or comfort, what is true and what is false."

It sounds to me like, while the possibility certainly exists that he assaulted these women, there was a reasonable doubt. And we don't convict on "well it sounds like it".
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Offline dpareja

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8435 on: March 24, 2016, 05:11:01 pm »
He's still going to be facing another charge in a separate trial in June:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/jian-ghomeshi-sexual-assault-trial-ruling-1.3505446
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Offline Dakota Bob

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8436 on: March 24, 2016, 05:54:30 pm »
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Even Then

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8437 on: March 24, 2016, 06:39:11 pm »
"there are problems with misogyny, racism and transphobia in LGBT circles"

okay, good, with you so fa-

"and the solution is to exclude white cis gay men"

???
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Offline mellenORL

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8438 on: March 24, 2016, 07:23:03 pm »
"The National Union of Students’ LGBT Campaign has passed a motion calling for the abolition of representatives for gay men – because they “don’t face oppression” in the LGBT community." Actually, they are facing oppression in the LGBT community. By you peeps. And they face oppression pretty much everywhere else still, too. I swear, there must be a mental virus plaguing the compassion and comprehension centers of these peoples' brains.
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Offline Askold

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8439 on: March 25, 2016, 01:30:10 am »
...Aaand the comments are full of people arguing whether or not trans-women are women or not.
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Quote from: sandman on May 30, 2012, 08:27:43 am
No matter what happens, no matter what my last words may end up being, I want everyone to claim that they were:
"If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine."
Quote from: SpaceProg on November 30, 2012, 10:21:56 pm
Aww, you guys rock. :)  I feel the love... and the pitchforks and torches.  Tingly!

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8440 on: March 25, 2016, 04:32:14 am »
Given that "LGBT" is basically a bunch of very different groups all lumped together solely because they're not straight or cis, it's not surprising in the least that there's a bit of internal friction. If anything, I'm surprised that there isn't a hell of a lot more of it.
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Offline Sigmaleph

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8441 on: March 25, 2016, 11:55:52 am »
Quote from: Art Vandelay on March 25, 2016, 04:32:14 am
Given that "LGBT" is basically a bunch of very different groups all lumped together solely because they're not straight or cis, it's not surprising in the least that there's a bit of internal friction. If anything, I'm surprised that there isn't a hell of a lot more of it.

There is a shitload of internal friction though. There's the 'gay men aren't really oppressed' shit, there's biphobic "if you choose to be in a het relationship you're betraying the cause!", there's "Drop the T"

And that's just from the four most accepted letters. Arguments about LGBTQ vs LGBTI vs LGBTQIA vs whatever else, does kink belong, does poly belong, do straight HIV+ people belong...

Coalition building is hard. I'm convinced we are better off fighting together against our common enemies, but that doesn't mean we'll get along wonderfully.
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Offline Ultimate Paragon

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8442 on: March 25, 2016, 12:01:59 pm »
Obligatory:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHHitXxH-us" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHHitXxH-us</a>
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Offline Askold

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8443 on: March 25, 2016, 12:38:00 pm »
There's morons like Dan Savage who look out only for themselves... If Dan was straight he would be a typical conservative who looks out only for white heterosexual men (possibly with a religious touch) since he is gay he looks out for white homosexual men and is ready to throw everyone else under the bus if it helps him.

TERFs and whatnot...

UP's link is quite appropriate.

It is kinda sad that "lets make things equally good for everyone" (or just "lets be nice to everyone") is a really difficult concept and it is easier to get support for "lets make things better for US ...and barely tolerate other groups."
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Quote from: sandman on May 30, 2012, 08:27:43 am
No matter what happens, no matter what my last words may end up being, I want everyone to claim that they were:
"If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine."
Quote from: SpaceProg on November 30, 2012, 10:21:56 pm
Aww, you guys rock. :)  I feel the love... and the pitchforks and torches.  Tingly!

Offline Ultimate Paragon

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Re: Worst of Social Justice
« Reply #8444 on: March 26, 2016, 02:24:35 pm »
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