Author Topic: The Atheist should self censor.  (Read 46374 times)

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Offline Rime

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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #150 on: February 27, 2013, 08:11:15 am »
Unskeptical skepticism always make me smile.  It is in essence no different from things that were (and I guess still are) being said about the current US president.  Professing a belief in christianity to aid your chances of election and actually being a christian are not the same thing. 

You'd be wise not to take the words of politicians at face value.

Although you quoted me, used proper sentence structure and grammar, you actually failed to address anything I said.  It was the Christian majority who voted Hitler into power.  It was the Christian majority who blamed the Jews because the Jews managed to stay affluent while many around them struggled in poverty, and it was the Christian majority who gleefully seized their properties, trashed their businesses and loaded them up on trains and sent them off to camps when they could no longer deport them.

EDIT:  I noticed that Katsuro also said the same thing.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2013, 08:14:20 am by Rime »
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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #151 on: February 27, 2013, 08:15:21 am »
Even just skimming over this thread, I can actually feel my brain cells dying. I also have a sneaking suspicion that even a retarded monkey would have the same reaction.

Offline Rabbit of Caerbannog

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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #152 on: February 27, 2013, 10:28:50 am »
The Holocaust was in large part due to the Atheist hatred of Jews and Christians

lol, atheist Jew here. Also, a lot of Nazis - in fact, I'd say most of them - were Christian.

Well obviously you're just a self-hating Jew and don't count! /sarcasm

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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #153 on: February 27, 2013, 10:43:20 am »
Even just skimming over this thread, I can actually feel my brain cells dying. I also have a sneaking suspicion that even a retarded monkey would have the same reaction.

Me too, though I personally had more brain cells die in the thread against heliocentrism. I mean, that shit was disputed plenty of centuries ago.
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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #154 on: February 27, 2013, 10:43:50 am »
Unskeptical skepticism always make me smile.  It is in essence no different from things that were (and I guess still are) being said about the current US president.  Professing a belief in christianity to aid your chances of election and actually being a christian are not the same thing. 

You'd be wise not to take the words of politicians at face value.

Although you quoted me, used proper sentence structure and grammar, you actually failed to address anything I said.  It was the Christian majority who voted Hitler into power.  It was the Christian majority who blamed the Jews because the Jews managed to stay affluent while many around them struggled in poverty, and it was the Christian majority who gleefully seized their properties, trashed their businesses and loaded them up on trains and sent them off to camps when they could no longer deport them.

EDIT:  I noticed that Katsuro also said the same thing.
And the Nazis' pogrom against the Jews had some Christian influences too. For example, the Church prohibited intermarrying between Jews and Christians and actually forced Jews to wear badges to distinguish themselves from non-Jews:



"In several provinces, a difference in vestment distinguishes the Jews or the Saracens from the Christians; but in others, the confusion has reached such proportions that a difference can no longer be perceived.

Hence, at times it has occurred that Christians have had sexual intercourse in error with Jewish or Saracen women and Jews or Saracens with Christian women. That the crime of such a sinful mixture shall no longer find evasion or cover under the pretext of error, we order that they [Jews and Saracens] of both sexes, in all Christian lands and at all times, shall be publicly differentiated from the rest of the population by the quality of their garment, especially since this is ordained by Moses."
-Fourth Lateran Council, 1215

Martin Luther was virulently anti-Jewish and wrote a book called On the Jews and Their Lies. He outlined a plan of what should be done to the Jews--maybe some of this will sound familiar:

"First to set fire to their synagogues or schools and to bury and cover with dirt whatever will not burn, so that no man will ever again see a stone or cinder of them. This is to be done in honor of our Lord and of Christendom, so that God might see that we are Christians, and do not condone or knowingly tolerate such public lying, cursing, and blaspheming of his Son and of his Christians. For whatever we tolerated in the past unknowingly ­ and I myself was unaware of it ­ will be pardoned by God. But if we, now that we are informed, were to protect and shield such a house for the Jews, existing right before our very nose, in which they lie about, blaspheme, curse, vilify, and defame Christ and us (as was heard above), it would be the same as if we were doing all this and even worse ourselves, as we very well know.

Second, I advise that their houses also be razed and destroyed. For they pursue in them the same aims as in their synagogues. Instead they might be lodged under a roof or in a barn, like the gypsies. This will bring home to them that they are not masters in our country, as they boast, but that they are living in exile and in captivity, as they incessantly wail and lament about us before God.

Third, I advise that all their prayer books and Talmudic writings, in which such idolatry, lies, cursing and blasphemy are taught, be taken from them[...]

Fourth, I advise that their rabbis be forbidden to teach henceforth on pain of loss of life and limb. For they have justly forfeited the right to such an office by holding the poor Jews captive with the saying of Moses (Deuteronomy 17:10) in which he commands them to obey their teachers on penalty of death, although Moses clearly adds: "what they teach you in accord with the law of the Lord." Those villains ignore that. They wantonly employ the poor people's obedience contrary to the law of the Lord and infuse them with this poison, cursing, and blasphemy. In the same way the pope also held us captive with the declaration in Matthew (16:18), "You are Peter," etc, inducing us to believe all the lies and deceptions that issued from his devilish mind. He did not teach in accord with the word of God, and therefore he forfeited the right to teach.

Fifth, I advise that safe­conduct on the highways be abolished completely for the Jews. For they have no business in the countryside, since they are not lords, officials, tradesmen, or the like. Let they stay at home[...]

Sixth, I advise that usury be prohibited to them, and that all cash and treasure of silver and gold be taken from them and put aside for safekeeping. The reason for such a measure is that, as said above, they have no other means of earning a livelihood than usury, and by it they have stolen and robbed from us all they possess. Such money should now be used in no other way than the following: Whenever a Jew is sincerely converted, he should be handed one hundred, two hundred, or three hundred florins, as personal circumstances may suggest. With this he could set himself up in some occupation for the support of his poor wife and children, and the maintenance of the old or feeble. For such evil gains are cursed if they are not put to use with God's blessing in a good and worthy cause.

Seventh, I commend putting a flail, an ax, a hoe, a spade, a distaff, or a spindle into the hands of young, strong Jews and Jewesses and letting them earn their bread in the sweat of their brow, as was imposed on the children of Adam (Gen 3:19). For it is not fitting that they should let us accursed Goyim toil in the sweat of our faces while they, the holy people, idle away their time behind the stove, feasting and farting, and on top of all, boasting blasphemously of their lordship over the Christians by means of our sweat. No, one should toss out these lazy rogues by the seat of their pants."


This is what Dr. E. H. Schulz and Dr. R. Frercks had to say in Why the Aryan Law? (1934):

Martin Luther wrote this of the Jews in his book "The Jews and their Lies": "They hold we Christians captive in our own land. They have seized our goods by their cursed usury, they mock and insult us because we work. They are our lords, and we and our goods belong to them." If in the coming days the Jewish race is driven out of the non-Jewish world, it will have at least this consolation: It has made clear to them for all time the value of maintaining the purity of race and blood in clear, understandable and unforgettable ways.

National Socialist racial legislation has reduced the influence of Jewry in all professions, and above all excluded them from the leading offices of the nation. That is an important step in the relationship between Germans and Jews, but one cannot ignore the fact that we have not yet fully eliminated the influence of the Jewish foreign body in German national life.


So racial and religious hatred of Jews, stemming from Medieval Christian anti-Semitism.

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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #155 on: February 27, 2013, 10:51:21 am »
Even just skimming over this thread, I can actually feel my brain cells dying. I also have a sneaking suspicion that even a retarded monkey would have the same reaction.

Me too, though I personally had more brain cells die in the thread against heliocentrism. I mean, that shit was disputed plenty of centuries ago.

That thread isn't so much a few brain cells giving up as a full lobotomy.

Offline kefkaownsall

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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #156 on: February 27, 2013, 11:34:48 am »
It's hard to say Hitlers beliefs but either way for examples of evil Christians.  Look at the Croats and Serbians

Offline Scotsgit

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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #157 on: February 27, 2013, 12:15:40 pm »
It's hard to say Hitlers beliefs but either way for examples of evil Christians.  Look at the Croats and Serbians

Or PIRA and UVF. 

Come to that, the War of the Three Kingdoms (sometimes called the English Civil War) doesn't show Christianity in a good light, particularly events such as the Siege of Drogheda or the Massacre at Philiphaugh.
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Offline starseeker

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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #158 on: February 27, 2013, 03:49:20 pm »
Even just skimming over this thread, I can actually feel my brain cells dying. I also have a sneaking suspicion that even a retarded monkey would have the same reaction.

Me too, though I personally had more brain cells die in the thread against heliocentrism. I mean, that shit was disputed plenty of centuries ago.

That thread isn't so much a few brain cells giving up as a full lobotomy.

I shouldn't be curious enough to ask if that thread still exists should I?

Edit: found it, this should be fun.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2013, 03:51:04 pm by starseeker »

Offline Osama bin Bambi

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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #159 on: February 27, 2013, 05:45:59 pm »
Unskeptical skepticism always make me smile.  It is in essence no different from things that were (and I guess still are) being said about the current US president.  Professing a belief in christianity to aid your chances of election and actually being a christian are not the same thing. 

You'd be wise not to take the words of politicians at face value.

Although you quoted me, used proper sentence structure and grammar, you actually failed to address anything I said.  It was the Christian majority who voted Hitler into power.  It was the Christian majority who blamed the Jews because the Jews managed to stay affluent while many around them struggled in poverty, and it was the Christian majority who gleefully seized their properties, trashed their businesses and loaded them up on trains and sent them off to camps when they could no longer deport them.

EDIT:  I noticed that Katsuro also said the same thing.

Also note that the majority of the anti-Semitic canards the Nazis leveled against Jews in propaganda were not new ideas, but rather offshoots or repetitions of the same old anti-Semitic beliefs that had been echoing in Europe for hundreds and hundreds of years. They were also often inspired by or at least reinforced by Christianity. For example, many thought that the Jews killed Jesus and thus they were vilified as greedy and untrustworthy. Many Christian nations throughout their history expelled Jews from the country, limited where they were allowed to live, forced them to convert to Christianity, subjected them to pogroms, and barred them from certain jobs (with the general exception of money-lending, since the Catholic sin of "usury" was considered acceptable for Jews). The policies of Nazi Germany were simply a revival of that. It was in no way fueled by atheism.

EDIT: I started this earlier but only finished it now, and then Rabbit beat me to it, the bastard. :P
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Offline Rabbit of Caerbannog

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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #160 on: February 27, 2013, 06:46:56 pm »
Unskeptical skepticism always make me smile.  It is in essence no different from things that were (and I guess still are) being said about the current US president.  Professing a belief in christianity to aid your chances of election and actually being a christian are not the same thing. 

You'd be wise not to take the words of politicians at face value.

Although you quoted me, used proper sentence structure and grammar, you actually failed to address anything I said.  It was the Christian majority who voted Hitler into power.  It was the Christian majority who blamed the Jews because the Jews managed to stay affluent while many around them struggled in poverty, and it was the Christian majority who gleefully seized their properties, trashed their businesses and loaded them up on trains and sent them off to camps when they could no longer deport them.

EDIT:  I noticed that Katsuro also said the same thing.
EDIT: I started this earlier but only finished it now, and then Rabbit beat me to it, the bastard. :P
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Offline Captain Jack Harkness

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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #161 on: February 28, 2013, 12:50:05 am »
The Holocaust was in large part due to the Atheist hatred of Jews and Christians

lol, atheist Jew here. Also, a lot of Nazis - in fact, I'd say most of them - were Christian.

The Nazi party was given practically unanimous power over Germany in 1933.  Who voted him into power?  Atheists?  It's pretty interesting to read some of his speeches.  I don't think a single atheist would elect someone who used that much Jesus speak.

Unskeptical skepticism always make me smile.  It is in essence no different from things that were (and I guess still are) being said about the current US president.  Professing a belief in christianity to aid your chances of election and actually being a christian are not the same thing. 

You'd be wise not to take the words of politicians at face value.

I would be inclined to agree with you, but you're invoking the "No True Scotsman" fallacy I think.
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Offline Meshakhad

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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #162 on: February 28, 2013, 02:05:40 am »
I figured out Hitler's religion long ago.

He worshiped himself.

His beliefs may have been drawn from other sources, but I do not believe that Hitler believed in any power higher than himself. I'd say the same about Saddam Hussein, the Kim dynasty, and possibly even Osama bin Laden.
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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #163 on: February 28, 2013, 09:44:17 am »
Unskeptical skepticism always make me smile.  It is in essence no different from things that were (and I guess still are) being said about the current US president.  Professing a belief in christianity to aid your chances of election and actually being a christian are not the same thing. 

You'd be wise not to take the words of politicians at face value.

Although you quoted me, used proper sentence structure and grammar, you actually failed to address anything I said.  It was the Christian majority who voted Hitler into power.  It was the Christian majority who blamed the Jews because the Jews managed to stay affluent while many around them struggled in poverty, and it was the Christian majority who gleefully seized their properties, trashed their businesses and loaded them up on trains and sent them off to camps when they could no longer deport them.

EDIT:  I noticed that Katsuro also said the same thing.

The Nazi party never had a majority in anything. They got 33% of the vote in the general election, then filled the German (Whatever the Republic uses) with armed stormtroopers as their members, put their platform forwards to dissolve the [thing], and intimidated them into doing what they wanted. It looks like a majority because it was proportionate representation and they had the largest proportion at the time for an individual party.
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Offline Rime

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Re: The Atheist should self censor.
« Reply #164 on: February 28, 2013, 11:00:15 am »
I guess my point isn't all that valid, but there are plenty of others who made excellent points. :)
And when we're done soul searching,
And we carry the weight and die for a cause.
Is misery made beautiful
Right before our eyes.

Mercy be revealed, or blind us where we stand?