Author Topic: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet  (Read 273992 times)

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Offline ironbite

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1380 on: May 22, 2018, 07:34:51 pm »
I'm having a hard time figuring out why Lana Dragagon has taken this hill to die on.  I mean come on, it's Nazis.  We know what they're about.

Ironbite-these are not good people and their ideology should've been wiped from the face of the earth in 1950.

Offline Lana Reverse

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1381 on: May 22, 2018, 07:48:26 pm »
I'm having a hard time figuring out why Lana Dragagon has taken this hill to die on.  I mean come on, it's Nazis.  We know what they're about.

Ironbite-these are not good people and their ideology should've been wiped from the face of the earth in 1950.

Is it impossible to hate both Nazis and Antifa?
Beware those who hate the rich more than they love the poor.

Offline ironbite

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1382 on: May 22, 2018, 08:06:50 pm »
You know what?

Ironbite-fuck you I'm done.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2018, 08:15:01 pm by ironbite »

Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1383 on: May 22, 2018, 10:41:51 pm »
I'm having a hard time figuring out why Lana Dragagon has taken this hill to die on.  I mean come on, it's Nazis.  We know what they're about.

Ironbite-these are not good people and their ideology should've been wiped from the face of the earth in 1950.
Hey, the last incarnation was defending sex offenders on 4chan. At least it's in character!

Offline The_Queen

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1384 on: May 23, 2018, 12:14:21 am »
I'm having a hard time figuring out why Lana Dragagon has taken this hill to die on.  I mean come on, it's Nazis.  We know what they're about.

Ironbite-these are not good people and their ideology should've been wiped from the face of the earth in 1950.

Is it impossible to hate both Nazis and Antifa?

Lana, I rarely debate anymore for two reasons: (1) I am now paid for arguing with people and (2) as I grew older, I realized that discretion is the better part of valor. I just started asking myself questions like "is this really worth my time" and "is this really the hill I want to die on?"

Lana: Is defending Nazis and falsely equating them to Anti-Fa really the hill you want to die on?
Does anyone take Donald Trump seriously, anymore?

Offline Askold

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1385 on: May 23, 2018, 02:47:43 am »
Kid, you aren't "winning" this debate and I believe understanding why that is, is going to help you a lot in life.

This is not a game, there are no rules and referees (other than the forum rules but that's a separate matter) in this. You don't score points or win anything by trying to get a "gotcha" out of people. Most importantly, no matter how well you write your comments, no matter how many people you have helping you find articles that defend the indefensible, you can't "win" by trying to argue that up is down.

This is real life debate and there are only two things that matter: a) can you make people believe that you are correct? b) what is the correct answer to the debated issue?

For the first part, you haven't convinced anyone that Nazis are the real victims that need protection or that Antifa is somehow really, really bad. For the latter part the answer is pretty much the same, Nazis bad, Antifa hooligans who band together because they don't like Nazis.

And here's another thing: We don't really care about making you admit "defeat" either. This isn't a game for us. When we see someone jump in to defend Nazis and fictional Nazis and complain about people who oppose Nazis we get upset because that's a pretty shitty thing to do. If it looks like everyone is ganging up on you it's just because there's no one else here who uses every single excuse to defend Nazis.

Heck, I've talked about non-violence before when some folks (*cough* Niam *cough) go over board, but even I know that Nazis are the real villains here.

And as another person who would get a bullet in the head if they take charge this is not an idle topic. In fact, simply as a person who opposes genocides I take personal interest in the "should Nazis be allowed to freely preach their hate and gain political power" matters.

EDIT:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mNQ2SpHkNI" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mNQ2SpHkNI</a>

Right from the Fascist-horse's mouth: They do not care about free-speech and are only using it as a tool.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2018, 11:21:30 am by Askold »
No matter what happens, no matter what my last words may end up being, I want everyone to claim that they were:
"If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine."
Aww, you guys rock. :)  I feel the love... and the pitchforks and torches.  Tingly!

Offline davedan

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1386 on: May 23, 2018, 06:03:50 pm »
Radically Pragmatic. See I want to punch this guy, barely even because of his politics.

Offline The_Queen

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1387 on: May 23, 2018, 08:18:47 pm »
EDIT:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mNQ2SpHkNI" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mNQ2SpHkNI</a>

Right from the Fascist-horse's mouth: They do not care about free-speech and are only using it as a tool.

Wow, that almost sounds like something that a nazi would do...
Does anyone take Donald Trump seriously, anymore?

Offline Lana Reverse

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1388 on: May 23, 2018, 10:58:07 pm »
Kid, you aren't "winning" this debate and I believe understanding why that is, is going to help you a lot in life.

This is not a game, there are no rules and referees (other than the forum rules but that's a separate matter) in this. You don't score points or win anything by trying to get a "gotcha" out of people. Most importantly, no matter how well you write your comments, no matter how many people you have helping you find articles that defend the indefensible, you can't "win" by trying to argue that up is down.

This is real life debate and there are only two things that matter: a) can you make people believe that you are correct? b) what is the correct answer to the debated issue?

For the first part, you haven't convinced anyone that Nazis are the real victims that need protection or that Antifa is somehow really, really bad. For the latter part the answer is pretty much the same, Nazis bad, Antifa hooligans who band together because they don't like Nazis.

And here's another thing: We don't really care about making you admit "defeat" either. This isn't a game for us. When we see someone jump in to defend Nazis and fictional Nazis and complain about people who oppose Nazis we get upset because that's a pretty shitty thing to do. If it looks like everyone is ganging up on you it's just because there's no one else here who uses every single excuse to defend Nazis.

Heck, I've talked about non-violence before when some folks (*cough* Niam *cough) go over board, but even I know that Nazis are the real villains here.

And as another person who would get a bullet in the head if they take charge this is not an idle topic. In fact, simply as a person who opposes genocides I take personal interest in the "should Nazis be allowed to freely preach their hate and gain political power" matters.

First of all, I'd like to point out that I wasn't the one who talked about victory and defeat in this discussion, except to deny that I was losing. That was ironbite and Svata:

Lana can I ask you to stop?  Like seriously.  Just stop.

Ironbite-you lost long ago.

Everyone here has dismissed your arguments as frivolous and lacking in merit. You have convinced no one of anything, save that you think that protecting Nazis right to gather more Nazis and spread their hateful doctrine is more important than protecting oneself against Nazis. Take the L, already.

But now, I'd like to talk about the constant mischaracterization of my reasoning and why it makes it so much harder to discuss this issue with you. When I discuss things with people, I don't expect them to agree with me. What I do expect is for them to make an effort to understand my position and my reasons for holding it. I believe I understand your position, and that of the others. You seem to believe that the Nazis have to be stopped from gaining power and hurting people, and that the best way to do that is through violence. My stance is that people have certain rights and freedoms, no matter what their views are; that the "punch a Nazi" mentality does more harm than good; and that Antifa have attacked too many non-fascists to be lionized as some noble resistance movement. But you seem to believe that I hold the position I do because I hold alt-right sympathies. I do not, as I have repeatedly explained. But you keep on insisting that I must have far-right leanings, because what other reason could I possibly have for disagreeing with you? And these constant accusations just wear me down and irritate me. Even if they didn't, it's so hard to debate things with somebody who doesn't understand where I'm coming from. How am I supposed to argue with people who can't understand my viewpoint?

EDIT:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mNQ2SpHkNI" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mNQ2SpHkNI</a>

Right from the Fascist-horse's mouth: They do not care about free-speech and are only using it as a tool.

I know full well that the alt-right doesn't care about free speech. They are no friends of civil liberties. But they should still be able to express their viewpoints. As much as I despise what they have to say, I will defend to the death their right to say it. And it's not just for moral reasons, but practical ones too. Letting bigots and extremists express their viewpoints makes it easier to counter them. It also makes it harder for them to play victim or claim to have stumbled on a truth that "they" don't want the general public to know. I think we should let radical Muslims talk about how much they hate the West. We should let tankies scream about how their hatred of charity. And yes, we should let the alt-right spew its bile.
Beware those who hate the rich more than they love the poor.

Offline Skybison

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1389 on: May 23, 2018, 11:29:24 pm »
But you seem to believe that I hold the position I do because I hold alt-right sympathies. I do not, as I have repeatedly explained.

Actions speak louder then words. 

You are constantly making a thing about defending the free speech of alt-righters, frequently in situations where they aren't actually losing them.  But you never seem to care about alt-righters being violent or suppressing free speech unless we raise the matter.  Hell I once asked you if sending death threats to feminists was censorship and you seriously tried to weasel out of answering, saying their were "subtle nuances" on the issue.

I think you have alt-right sympathies because of your double standards, not because you disagree.  If you acted as someone who was against violence and censorship in general I wouldn't think that.

Offline Lana Reverse

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1390 on: May 23, 2018, 11:38:42 pm »
But you seem to believe that I hold the position I do because I hold alt-right sympathies. I do not, as I have repeatedly explained.

Actions speak louder then words. 

You are constantly making a thing about defending the free speech of alt-righters, frequently in situations where they aren't actually losing them.  But you never seem to care about alt-righters being violent or suppressing free speech unless we raise the matter.  Hell I once asked you if sending death threats to feminists was censorship and you seriously tried to weasel out of answering, saying their were "subtle nuances" on the issue.

I think you have alt-right sympathies because of your double standards, not because you disagree.  If you acted as someone who was against violence and censorship in general I wouldn't think that.

I started a thread about an eight-year-old boy getting lynched by alt-rightists. A thread where I pointed out that hate speech laws can hurt more than just the alt-right. You were saying?
Beware those who hate the rich more than they love the poor.

Offline Askold

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1391 on: May 24, 2018, 02:56:25 am »
"Remember that one time I wasn't defending Nazis because I spoke about one their victims before I went back to defending Nazis?"
No matter what happens, no matter what my last words may end up being, I want everyone to claim that they were:
"If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine."
Aww, you guys rock. :)  I feel the love... and the pitchforks and torches.  Tingly!

Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1392 on: May 24, 2018, 08:14:00 am »
Fact remains you spend a lot more energy defending people who, unlike the biracial lad why was nearly lynched, have never been in any physical danger but have been roundly criticised for spouting alt right talking points.

James Damore ring any bells? No, that's not an invitation for you to start soapboxing about him!

Offline Lana Reverse

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1393 on: May 24, 2018, 09:03:13 am »
When was the last time any of you suggested censoring or assaulting... say, Nation of Islam members? If you talked about that, I'd be defending their rights too.
Beware those who hate the rich more than they love the poor.

Offline Tolpuddle Martyr

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Re: Not-Good Things People Say on the Internet
« Reply #1394 on: May 24, 2018, 05:56:55 pm »
When was the last time any of you suggested censoring or assaulting... say, Nation of Islam members? If you talked about that, I'd be defending their rights too.
Not if your posting history is anything to go by.

Your role around here seems to be tireless defence of anything socially conservative to alt-right while claiming the mantle of social liberalism. It all smacks of concern trolling.