Author Topic: UN Resolution 16/18 and free speech  (Read 1455 times)

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Offline Vypernight

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UN Resolution 16/18 and free speech
« on: December 08, 2012, 03:43:55 pm »
This resolution came out last year, but I was hearing about it on the radio and looked it up (If this was already discussed on these boards, sorry in advance). 

http://www.sodahead.com/united-states/do-you-know-what-resolution-1618-is/question-3214251/

Is this correct that Clinton, Obama, and the UN are making it illegal to insult other religions?  I understand treating other faiths with respect, but doesn't this violate freedom of speech?  It also seems like if you say something that causes another to act violently, you're responsible, not the person who acted. This base idea was that Clinton was appealing to the OIC or Muslim Brotherhood and trying to 'build a bridge' with a law that others think violates our rights.  Since it's a Conservative show though, I wanted both sides of it.

I keep trying to get the facts on this, but I get one side saying it's like a global 'Anti-bullying' law while the other screams it violate our freedom of speech by punishing us for saying bad about other faiths, even if they are acting like asses.

Can someone hee shed some light on this since it sounds like something that would affect this board (People here slam other faiths all the time, though 99% of the time, said faiths deserve it)?
Considering that's what this board is about
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Offline Jack Mann

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Re: UN Resolution 16/18 and free speech
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2012, 07:10:48 pm »
The good news is that it can't override the constitution.  And by a strict interpretation, it's not that bad.  Incitement to violence is the only thing that's actually restricted in the active part of the resolution, and this is already restricted in US law as an exception to free speech (and justly so).  But it does leave the meaning of incitement to violence rather vague.  When Reverend Jackass decided to burn the Koran, there were riots.  I know, I was there at the time.  People died.  Was that an incitement to violence?  And yet I wouldn't restrict his right to do what he did, as idiotic as it was.

I don't believe we'll use it that strictly.  I believe that the US will continue to use its current definition of incitement to violence (which basically requires someone to say, "Yo, guys, you should totally commit some violence").  But it's a concern.  And the language of the resolution encourages countries to illegalize criticism of other religions.  So that's bad.

All in all, it's not as bad as all that, but it's still not great.
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Offline Vypernight

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Re: UN Resolution 16/18 and free speech
« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2012, 05:11:18 am »
So in otherwords, she was just trying to make us look good in the eyes of the non-psychotic muslims (the majority) without actually jumping on our rights.  Hopefully that's accurate.
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Re: UN Resolution 16/18 and free speech
« Reply #3 on: December 09, 2012, 07:08:16 am »
I believe the vactican was also a major force behind this one.

Offline DogmasDemise

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Re: UN Resolution 16/18 and free speech
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2012, 08:38:40 pm »
This is resolution A/HRC/RES/16/18 right?

Grabbed it online but don't remember the exact link, here's what it says.

Read it all and decide if it's worth it:

Quote
Human Rights Council
Sixteenth session
Agenda item 9

Racism, racial discrimination, xenophobia and related form of intolerance, follow-up and implementation of the Durban Declaration and Programme of Action Resolution adopted by the Human Rights Council*
16/18
Combating intolerance, negative stereotyping and stigmatization of, and discrimination, incitement to violence and violence against, persons based on religion or belief
The Human Rights Council,
Reaffirming the commitment made by all States under the Charter of the United Nations to promote and encourage universal respect for and observance of all human rights and fundamental freedoms without distinction as to, inter alia, religion or belief,
Reaffirming also the obligation of States to prohibit discrimination on the basis of religion or belief and to implement measures to guarantee the equal and effective protection of the law,
Reaffirming further that the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights provides, inter alia, that everyone shall have the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion or belief, which shall include freedom to have or to adopt a religion or belief of his choice, and freedom, either individually or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief in worship, observance, practice and teaching,
Reaffirming the positive role that the exercise of the right to freedom of opinion and expression and the full respect for the freedom to seek, receive and impart information can play in strengthening democracy and combating religious intolerance,
Deeply concerned about incidents of intolerance, discrimination and violence against persons based on their religion or belief in all regions of the world,
* The resolutions and decisions adopted by the Human Rights Council will be contained in the report of
the Council on its sixteenth session (A/HRC/16/2), chap. I.

United Nations A/HRC/RES/16/18
General Assembly Distr.: General
12 April 2011
Original: English
A/HRC/RES/16/18

Deploring any advocacy of discrimination or violence on the basis of religion or belief,
Strongly deploring all acts of violence against persons on the basis of their religion or belief, as well as any such acts directed against their homes, businesses, properties, schools, cultural centres or places of worship,
Concerned about actions that wilfully exploit tensions or target individuals on the basis of their religion or belief,
Noting with deep concern the instances of intolerance, discrimination and acts of violence in many parts of the world, including cases motivated by discrimination against persons belonging to religious minorities, in addition to the negative projection of the followers of religions and the enforcement of measures that specifically discriminate against persons on the basis of religion or belief,
Recognizing the valuable contribution of people of all religions or beliefs to humanity and the contribution that dialogue among religious groups can make towards an improved awareness and understanding of the common values shared by all humankind,
Recognizing also that working together to enhance implementation of existing legal regimes that protect individuals against discrimination and hate crimes, increase interfaith and intercultural efforts, and to expand human rights education are important first steps in combating incidents of intolerance, discrimination and violence against individuals on the basis of religion or belief,
1. Expresses deep concern at the continued serious instances of derogatory stereotyping, negative profiling and stigmatization of persons based on their religion or belief, as well as programmes and agendas pursued by extremist organizations and groups aimed at creating and perpetuating negative stereotypes about religious groups, in particular when condoned by Governments;
2. Expresses its concern that incidents of religious intolerance, discrimination and related violence, as well as of negative stereotyping of individuals on the basis of religion or belief, continue to rise around the world, and condemns, in this context, any advocacy of religious hatred against individuals that constitutes incitement to discrimination, hostility or violence, and urges States to take effective measures, as set forth in the present resolution, consistent with their obligations under international human rights law, to address and combat such incidents;
3. Condemns any advocacy of religious hatred that constitutes incitement to discrimination, hostility or violence, whether it involves the use of print, audio-visual or electronic media or any other means;
4. Recognizes that the open public debate of ideas, as well as interfaith and intercultural dialogue, at the local, national and international levels can be among the best protections against religious intolerance and can play a positive role in strengthening democracy and combating religious hatred, and convinced that a continuing dialogue on these issues can help overcome existing misperceptions;
5. Notes the speech given by Secretary-General of the Organization of the Islamic Conference at the fifteenth session of the Human Rights Council, and draws on his call on States to take the following actions to foster a domestic environment of religious tolerance, peace and respect, by:
(a) Encouraging the creation of collaborative networks to build mutual understanding, promoting dialogue and inspiring constructive action towards shared policy goals and the pursuit of tangible outcomes, such as servicing projects in the fields of
education, health, conflict prevention, employment, integration and media education;
A/HRC/RES/16/18
(b) Creating an appropriate mechanism within Governments to, inter alia,
identify and address potential areas of tension between members of different religious
communities, and assisting with conflict prevention and mediation;
(c) Encouraging training of Government officials in effective outreach strategies;
(d) Encouraging the efforts of leaders to discuss within their communities the
causes of discrimination, and evolving strategies to counter these causes;
(e) Speaking out against intolerance, including advocacy of religious hatred that
constitutes incitement to discrimination, hostility or violence;
(f) Adopting measures to criminalize incitement to imminent violence based on
religion or belief;
(g) Understanding the need to combat denigration and negative religious
stereotyping of persons, as well as incitement to religious hatred, by strategizing and
harmonizing actions at the local, national, regional and international levels through, inter
alia, education and awareness-building;
(h) Recognizing that the open, constructive and respectful debate of ideas, as
well as interfaith and intercultural dialogue at the local, national and international levels,
can play a positive role in combating religious hatred, incitement and violence;
6. Calls upon all States:
(a) To take effective measures to ensure that public functionaries in the conduct of their public duties do not discriminate against an individual on the basis of religion or belief;
(b) To foster religious freedom and pluralism by promoting the ability of members of all religious communities to manifest their religion, and to contribute openly and on an equal footing to society;
(c) To encourage the representation and meaningful participation of individuals, irrespective of their religion, in all sectors of society;
(d) To make a strong effort to counter religious profiling, which is understood to be the invidious use of religion as a criterion in conducting questionings, searches and other law enforcement investigative procedures;
7. Encourages States to consider providing updates on efforts made in this regard as part of ongoing reporting to the Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Human Rights;
8. Calls upon States to adopt measures and policies to promote the full respect for and protection of places of worship and religious sites, cemeteries and shrines, and to take measures in cases where they are vulnerable to vandalism or destruction;
9. Calls for strengthened international efforts to foster a global dialogue for the promotion of a culture of tolerance and peace at all levels, based on respect for human rights and diversity of religions and beliefs, and decides to convene a panel discussion on this issue at its seventeenth session, within existing resources.

46th meeting
24 March 2011
[Adopted without a vote.]

Now sure by a strict interpretation it doesn't seem to be THAT bad. The only problem is, who's to say it will be followed that way? I mean some people have a really low bar for what hate speech really means, look at people blaming Robert Spencer for what Anders Breivik did, even though Robert Spencer has never called for violence and in fact rejected it, and in some countries merely saying "I am an atheist show me proof of God" will get you arrested as it happened in Indonesia. Hate speech laws just don't work and can be easily abused to silence dissent, unless you're clearly instigating an illegal act against a religious group, it shouldn't be illegal.

But, it's worth noting that this resolution is sponsored by the OIC, Obama shouldn't even be engaged in dialog with them and call them out on their REAL goal and tell them to give it up, stop playing games. The OIC don't really care about combating real religious discrimination (like violence based on religion or institutionalized discrimination), most of those 57 countries have extremely poor human rights records when it comes to religion. The real agenda is that they just want to ban criticism of Islam, but because their previous resolutions were too blatantly anti-free speech, they changed the language a bit from "defamation of religion" to "Combating intolerance, negative stereotyping and stigmatization of, and discrimination, incitement to violence and violence against, persons based on religion or belief".

Quote
Ekmeleddin Ihsanoglu, secretary general of the Organisation of Islamic Cooperation (OIC), said his 57-nation body would not try again for United Nations support to ban insults to religion, but appealed for states to apply hate-speech laws concerning Islam.

"We could not convince them," said the Turkish head of the 57-member organisation which had tried from 1998 until 2011 to get a United Nations-backed ban on blasphemy.

"The European countries don't vote with us, the United States doesn't vote with us."

Western countries see the publication of such images and materials as a matter of free speech.
More on: http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/15/us-islam-blasphemy-idUSBRE89E18U20121015

I also want to point out that if you are serious about applying this resolution, it means both the Bible and the Qur'an would be banned or censored, since both mock non-believers in multiple parts. But as I said, the agenda is entirely different.

Also, this:

"(d) To make a strong effort to counter religious profiling, which is understood to be the invidious use of religion as a criterion in conducting questionings, searches and other law enforcement investigative procedures;"

What exactly is this supposed to mean? Are we now telling the police how to do their job? Now I'm not in law enforcement to know the details, so please enlighten me, what if they for example find evidence that points to the suspect being of a particular religion? Should they just ignore that lead and pretend everyone is equally likely to be involved? How exactly does this work?

"Understanding the need to combat denigration and negative religious stereotyping of persons"

Right so what if I say that "according to poll A, X% of Muslims would support the establishment of Sharia law"? I mean this is an important matter and should be openly discussed, and even if someone goes out and says "All Muslims are evil terrorists" or "all Christians are evil right-wing dominionists" or "all atheists have said in their hearts that there is no God" (oops?) or "all atheists are evil communists" it's better to just take them on on those ideas than criminalize them.