Our queer world

[Kain]

http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2014/11/20/us-straights-wanttoseegayrightsbutnotkissingstudyshows.html

Hyperlink says it all, really, straights are all for gay rights 'till it starts to affect them.

[SCarpelan]

EDIT: Meanwhile in Finland...

Our law council voted against gender-neutral marriage 9-8 and has now rejected the suggested law.

...Despite the fact that majority of Finnish people support it in every survey. The parliament still may vote to accept the law but this entire process has been a year or two of politicians struggling and delaying the law. The parliament elections will be coming soon and HOPEFULLY this will affect the voters but as things are I am not happy with our democracy at the moment.

I was surprised to learn that there might be hope for the law still. The newspaper Helsingin Sanomat did some research on the opinions of the parliament members. It seems that 99 out of 199 voting members (the speaker doesn't vote) have expressed their support for gender neutral marriage and 79 have opposed the idea. Also, at least some SDP (Social Democratic Party) members who have opposed the idea seem to be reconsidering their position. This research is just about the general idea of gender neutral marriage and not this proposal particularly, though. One also has to remember that even if the proposal passes the vote it would not be immediately written into law. First the Grand Committee would take a look on the proposal and there would be several more votes on the issue.

Edit: To be factually more accurate all of the Finns (Perussuomalaiset) party members are counted as opposing the law despite some of them supporting gender neutral marriage. That's because in this particular vote the Finns party is the only one that requires their members to vote according to an official party position.

[Askold]

Yeah, there was a TrueFinn who said he supports gender-neutral marriage laws on the law council, BUT since this is the only issue where that party enforces an official party line he decided to let his back up member (a fundie level homophobe) Niikko vote instead of him... This way he avoided being thrown out of the party and hoped to avoid fall out from voters.

I am disappointed that so many of Center party members are against the law proposal but at least Tuomo Puumala is for it (A while ago when the leadership in the party changed he was one of the most likely candidates for the head of the party and the only "problem" with him was that he was too young.)

At the moment, chances of the law passing the vote from the parliament are quite high, but after that it gets a bit tougher...

Honestly the real problem is that those against same-sex marriage have been able to delay this law for so long and WILL be able to delay it even longer. And that is all they can do. The law will pass sooner or later, but if it had been passed when it first came up we would have been among the first nordic countries to do so. Now we will be the last one.

[SCarpelan]

All the major parties except The Finns Party seem to have the supporters and opponents of the proposal divided by age. It's obvious that it's the older generation who is holding the law back.

By the way, someone linked something precious on the Facebook. From The Finns Party leader Timo Soini's blog back in 2007:

The party discipline is on a stalinistic level in the bourgeois government. One mind, one language. The next thing that's going to be forbidden is starting motions? The constitution does not recognize party discipline.

I had no idea Soini had converted into a stalinist since then and has reinterpreted or changed the constitution. This issue is really showing his insane side; he's also foamed about cultural marxism and other conspiratorial right-wing talking points.

[Askold]

Director of the Human Rights Centre is Kristiina Kouros explained in an interview that Räsänen is not interpreting the human rights declaration correctly and that although in 1948 marriage was concidered to be between a man and a woman times have changed.

Charles Radcliffe, the head of the global issues section at the UN human rights office, was also interviewed by Finnish news and disagreed that samesex marriage would be illegal according to human rights declaration. Apparently either he also used the Finnish phrase "reading it like the devil reads the bible" to describe how Räsänen misinterpreted the declaration to fit her agenda or he used a different phrase and the reporter translated it into the Finnish phrase but it is rather fitting in this case...

[Eiki-mun]

I really like that phrase. "Like the devil reads the bible."

Just curious, what's that in Finnish?

[SCarpelan]

"Lukea kuin Piru Raamattua."

[Sleepy]

This is disgusting.

If you're her family and you actually give a damn about her, you'd take the time to fucking understand what transgender means and give her a proper funeral.

[Askold]

Oh boo hoo. Gay marriage has ruined Massachusetts according to this video:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSXFb6ULsCg" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSXFb6ULsCg</a>

(It has a Finnish title and subtitles because it is being used in anti-samesex marriage propaganda.)

...Here is a dare: Watch the video and try to spot even a single effect from gay marriage that is bad.

EDIT:
Also: The Archbishop of the Finnish Lutheran church made a statement where he actually supported samesex marriage. He explained that gay people marrying will not destroy the church and that the church can either a) Still only marry heterosexual couples b) Start marrying samesex couples as well or c) Stop marrying people at all and that this decision will still be left to the church to make on their own.

He also said that samesex marriage is not an issue of opinion, defending rainbow families is important and a matter of human rights.

...Naturally fundies are frothing and screaming that the skies are falling.

[SCarpelan]

Anyone who is surprised that the Archbishop supports equal marriage laws hasn't been paying attention for his previous public statements (I'm talking about the fundies, not you). Whenever he gives statements about the welfare state, income inequality or gay rights my respect for him grows. I was much more surprised to find out that there is a fairly popular facebook page for laestadians supporting gender neutral marriage. It made a huge change in my perspective of what goes on inside that particular sect.

[Askold]

One hour from now the Finnish parliament will vote on gender-neutral marriage. One way or another it will not be the final vote on the matter and although supporters seem to be winning based on earlier polls the law will still have a few more votes and council sessions before it will be official.

Yesterday the parliament debated on the subject but I didn't dare to watch it live and based on what I've heard there was nothing new in the debate anyway.

EDIT: ...Except that a parliament member talking about "gay men who dress like women" is still a very special kind of stupid. So was the guy who claimed that "the christian church had been ruling over marriage in Finland for thousands of years..."

EDIT2: http://yle.fi/uutiset/finnish_parliament_approves_same-sex_marriage/7657759

The vote was 105 to 92, with one MP absent.  Quite a close call.

[SCarpelan]

Special kudos to Arja Juvonen of the Finns Party who defied a direct order from her party leader by voting yes. I wouldn't be surprised if she is kicked out of her party for this.

Edit: 17 of the 25 Grand Committee members voted yes. Unless four of them change their minds the Committee will send the proposal back to a new, final vote. Hell yeah, this thing is actually going to pass!

Edit 2: A friend who is with the crowd in front of the Parliament building describes the situation: "10 000 people are singing, laughing and hugging each other."

[Dakota Bob]

Oh well, guess this means I'll be forced to become gay by the homosexual fascists. Anybody in the Helsinki area who's into fisting and Star Trek feel free to send me a PM

[Askold]

In the upper image we see the "small marginal group" of homosexuals and other degenerates who support samesex-marriage in the lower image we see "the people" who of course oppose it wether because of their deeply christian family values or simply because it is "unnatural and sick."


EDIT: Specifically there were 6000 protesting for gender neutral marriage act and 50 people protesting against it according to the police who were observing the protests.


And this is also appropriate: (warning NSFW)

(click to show/hide)

Atleast our dear "Special" lion isn't sticking a sword through his head in that image.

(Actually, had the lion been inserting anything into anything I would not have posted that image.)

[SCarpelan]

An update to the gender neutral marriage law: Grand Committee sent it back to the whole parliament and it passed again 101-90. Other laws will also need to be adjusted before this law will enter into force so that date is set as far as March 1, 2017. If the opponents of the law gain a majority in the next parliament they still can stop the process with a counter-proposal but that's probably not going to happen.