Author Topic: Best Political Cartoons  (Read 1652837 times)

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Offline davedan

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pyro

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Re: Best Political Cartoons
« Reply #5386 on: November 27, 2015, 07:57:45 pm »
I hear a point in the chick's remark, but "guys" as gender-neutral is getting pretty standard now, especially when it's used in "you guys" --- the plural form of "you".

Offline Lt. Fred

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Offline Sigmaleph

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Re: Best Political Cartoons
« Reply #5388 on: November 27, 2015, 08:41:30 pm »
I hear a point in the chick's remark, but "guys" as gender-neutral is getting pretty standard now, especially when it's used in "you guys" --- the plural form of "you".

Bah. Clearly the plural form of you is y'all.

English speakers being all "oh no we contracted all forms of the second person pronoun into one and now we need to make distinctions" is fascinating to me.
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pyro

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Re: Best Political Cartoons
« Reply #5389 on: November 27, 2015, 08:53:06 pm »
English speakers being all "oh no we contracted all forms of the second person pronoun into one and now we need to make distinctions" is fascinating to me.


Offline guizonde

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Re: Best Political Cartoons
« Reply #5390 on: November 27, 2015, 09:13:10 pm »
I hear a point in the chick's remark, but "guys" as gender-neutral is getting pretty standard now, especially when it's used in "you guys" --- the plural form of "you".

Bah. Clearly the plural form of you is y'all.

English speakers being all "oh no we contracted all forms of the second person pronoun into one and now we need to make distinctions" is fascinating to me.

you want fun? try teaching an englishman and an american the distinctions between familiar and formal (vous/tu or usted/vos//tu). from experience, an american will adopt the familiar form, an englishman will adopt the formal (strict translation of "you", after all). and us bilinguals get very confused very quickly about which form to use with whom when mental and physical fatigue come into play.

my friends still make fun of me when i address a crowd as "tu" and one of them as "vous" when i'm not thinking clearly. to be fair, it's one crowd, so one entity, so it's a legit mistake. [/smartass]

@pyro: good one, i think there's one floating around about all the false rhymes too, something about only a native speaker being able to pronounce it correctly (although seeing some words, i'm pretty sure you need at least high school education to pull it off).
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Offline Sleepy

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Re: Best Political Cartoons
« Reply #5391 on: November 27, 2015, 09:27:02 pm »
I honestly wish English had a modern "usted" equivalent, because I've felt the need for it several times when speaking to people like professors and bosses.
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Offline The_Queen

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Re: Best Political Cartoons
« Reply #5392 on: November 27, 2015, 11:15:33 pm »
Eh, I learned "Sie" in German without much trouble. But, I am Southern. The type of Southern where I would get slapped across the face if I didn't refer to someone as "Mr.," "Ms.," "Sir," or "Ma'am." Probably helped me recognize the formal parts of language a bit easier.
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Offline Sigmaleph

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Re: Best Political Cartoons
« Reply #5393 on: November 27, 2015, 11:21:21 pm »
I honestly wish English had a modern "usted" equivalent, because I've felt the need for it several times when speaking to people like professors and bosses.

It trades against the problem that you'd end up with people where formality standards are unclear and you don't know which to use. I've had professors who objected to overly-formal address, made them feel old.

I'd suggest bringing back 'thou', except given current cultural context it's going to sound more formal than 'you' and not less.
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Offline Svata

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Re: Best Political Cartoons
« Reply #5394 on: November 27, 2015, 11:39:23 pm »
You is a bastardization of thou anyways. See wkikpedia thorn page section "Middle and Early Modern English". Extrapolate from "ye" (as in "ye olde butcherede englishe") being the, and pronounced as such, and, well, you see where I'm going.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2015, 11:44:09 pm by Svata »
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Offline guizonde

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Re: Best Political Cartoons
« Reply #5395 on: November 27, 2015, 11:48:56 pm »
I honestly wish English had a modern "usted" equivalent, because I've felt the need for it several times when speaking to people like professors and bosses.

It trades against the problem that you'd end up with people where formality standards are unclear and you don't know which to use. I've had professors who objected to overly-formal address, made them feel old.

I'd suggest bringing back 'thou', except given current cultural context it's going to sound more formal than 'you' and not less.

that happened to me wednesday. i was with an irish client, so when we first met, i was very polite and formal in french. then the translation started and we switched to english, and it sounded downright casual compared to when we spoke french. turned out it was a blessing in disguise as the session was about some very serious family business, and the family enjoyed the casualness my translation injected into the conversation.

also, first time i met my (american) anglophone coworkers, we instinctively switched to informal in french to try and grab back some of that casual feel from english. we got some odd stares from the russophones, talking with informal construction within minutes of meeting each other. it would seem maghrebi arabic is similar in that regard.

any pretense at knowing what we're doing flies out the window when addressing or getting addressed by english anglophones, though. "tu" and "vous" become interchangeable, which is part of the anglophone charm, or so i'm told.

to address your last point, sigma, i don't think bringing back thou is necessary, all we need to do is define clearly whether a language is formal or informal at its core. if it's informal like american, then use honorifics, like "sir", "ma'am", "miss" etc... that's how i've been winging it for the past few years, and it seems to be working, although i get "aww, cute, a little yankee" looks from englishmen.
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Offline Ultimate Paragon

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Re: Best Political Cartoons
« Reply #5396 on: November 28, 2015, 11:47:59 am »

Offline davedan

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Re: Best Political Cartoons
« Reply #5397 on: November 28, 2015, 11:54:16 am »
That actually is an objectively good political cartoon. Drawing could be better and sad rather than funny.
But good point well made (and cleverly too)


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pyro

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Re: Best Political Cartoons
« Reply #5398 on: November 28, 2015, 01:36:18 pm »
And they didn't use a computer or xerox for the people.

Offline guizonde

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Re: Best Political Cartoons
« Reply #5399 on: November 28, 2015, 01:36:49 pm »
that is clever. it represents very well voter apathy. that's also why voting is a right, not a duty. you're free to choose.
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