FSTDT Forums
Community => Politics and Government => Topic started by: TigerHunter on September 23, 2012, 09:11:20 pm
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I was born in 1991, so I wasn't really paying attention to politics until Bush was in the Oval Office. Since he left, I've noticed that right-wingers (at least, those that make the main page) regard Obama's presidency as nothing short of apocalyptic. Even putting aside the rumors that he's a muslim, or wasn't born in this country, which can easily be attributed to his race, a number of them seem convinced that not only is he incompetent, he is malicious and actively trying to run America into the ground. I know that there were rumors about Clinton too - that he'd ordered people killed and such - but was he regarded in the same light, or is the right's venomous hatred a new phenomenon?
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Yes and no. The main problem today is that there is just so much more information (true or false, for good or ill) and more connection available today. Both the internet and the 24-hour news cycle were in their relative infancy under Clinton - both Fox News and MSNBC launched in 1996, neither with the reach nor content they would have even by 2004. Now the internet has created echo chambers of extreme political thought and cable news stations need to fill 24/7/365 with content. It's not necessarily that the feelings are different, it's that they're amplified.
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It varies. So far the Republicans have not moved for impeachment
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Of course, Clinton did commit adultery, and doing something illegal is grounds for impeachment, so at least with Clinton, they were kinda justified.
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When did adultery become illegal?
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I thought it was.
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1. The right wasn't this crazy, yes there were crazy conspiracy theory shit like the "Clinton Chronicles"(which was a whole lot of funny), and the whole impeachment(is it sad that I remember watching the vote as me and my family decorated the Christmas tree that year??). But in my opinion the right wing have amped up the crazy to about 15 on a scale from 1 to 10 under Obama.
2. Clinton was impeached because he lied under oath not because her cheated on Hilliary. If he would've just admitted to it, we would've avoided the whole BS. What really makes me sick, is that the assholes who made a big shit over it, were cheating on their spouses, so they really didn't have the moral high ground to begin with.
Oh yeah, and thanks for making me feel old.
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Oh yeah, and thanks for making me feel old.
You're welcome :P
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Speaking of 1991, which I was born in also, I found a book of political cartoons for that year and stumbled upon one about George Bush Sr. having no backbone to the Democrats.
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1. The right wasn't this crazy, yes there were crazy conspiracy theory shit like the "Clinton Chronicles"(which was a whole lot of funny), and the whole impeachment(is it sad that I remember watching the vote as me and my family decorated the Christmas tree that year??). But in my opinion the right wing have amped up the crazy to about 15 on a scale from 1 to 10 under Obama.
2. Clinton was impeached because he lied under oath not because her cheated on Hilliary. If he would've just admitted to it, we would've avoided the whole BS. What really makes me sick, is that the assholes who made a big shit over it, were cheating on their spouses, so they really didn't have the moral high ground to begin with.
Oh yeah, and thanks for making me feel old.
I have always wondered why the republicans never went after the sexual harassment angle since they had a boss taking advantage of his position of authority to get sexual favours from a subordinate.
Don't feel too old, I remember the Regan years quite well.
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2. Clinton was impeached because he lied under oath not because her cheated on Hilliary. If he would've just admitted to it, we would've avoided the whole BS.
Clinton didn't lie under oath. He asked how the court defined sex- narrowly- and then, accurately, told them he'd never had vaginal intercourse with Ms Lewinski. If he hadn't done that, he'd have been lying. And if they had decided he wasn't lying then, it would have been the 'murder' of Vince Foster or the Whitewater 'conspiracy' or some other nonsense. Or they'd have thrown someone else in prison for refusing to perjure themselves.
The point was not to uphold the law. The point was to headhunt a political opponent. And they were willing to outright abuse their power of impeachment to do it.
He was IMPEACHED for nothing. The Republicans (and even some Democrats, to their utter shame) abused their most serious power. They've done nothing like that for Obama.
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They've done nothing like that for Obama.
Yet.
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This basically. It was actually rather like Andrew Johnson's impeachment. No legal wrongdoing unlike Nixon just wanted to get rid of a political opponent.
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They've done nothing like that for Obama.
Yet.
wait 'til his second term
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I can say with certainty that it was nowhere this insane. This madness seems to have only come about in the last decade or so. If they were this mad back in the day, I never would have been a Repub.
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I don't remember it being so crazy-go-nuts either. Though I DO believe the internet has played a large part in stoking fires that otherwise would have smouldered quietly.
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Recent right-wing insanity: GIFT in action.
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I can say with certainty that it was nowhere this insane. This madness seems to have only come about in the last decade or so. If they were this mad back in the day, I never would have been a Repub.
I respectfully disagree. I think the level of craziness we are seeing today was already present under Clinton, and in fact had been present in some form in U.S. politics for a long time, even prior to WWII. A lot of the same criticisms Obama is facing now were thrown at FDR and his New Deal (e.g. that he was a socialist, fascist, etc.).
Remember also that the Republican Revolution of 1994 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republican_Revolution) and the Oklahoma City bombing of 1995 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma_City_bombing) both happened during Clinton's first term.
The point was not to uphold the law. The point was to headhunt a political opponent. And they were willing to outright abuse their power of impeachment to do it.
He was IMPEACHED for nothing. The Republicans (and even some Democrats, to their utter shame) abused their most serious power. They've done nothing like that for Obama.
I agree with Lt. Fred on this one. The Republicans hated Clinton at least as much as they hate Obama, though for slightly different reasons. The only difference is, this time the GOP has yet to find sufficient ammunition to go after the Obama administration.
When did adultery become illegal?
I thought it was.
Just as a point of law, adultery is prosecutable in the military under Article 134 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice (http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/934) under certain circumstances, and is usually grounds for divorce in most states. It is not, to my knowledge, a prosecutable offense under the civilian criminal laws of the United States or any state or territory, and has not been for some time.
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The crazy was there, but back in the early 90s not every nutbar in his mountain cabin could have internet access. Now they can, and it seems like they do.
One of the things people credit the internet with, that whole bit about forming communities based on commonalities not found locally. It isn't all roses when you realize the psychotics get a go at it too.
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Infants in their infancy, adults in their adultery ...
Not exactly pertinent, but I thought I'd toss it out there.
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Recent right-wing insanity: GIFT in action.
Guy In Fancy Turban
Gene Influencing for Flatulence Termination
Get In the Fucking TARDIS
...?
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Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory
http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2004/03/19/ (http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2004/03/19/)
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Recent right-wing insanity: GIFT in action.
Guy In Fancy Turban
Gene Influencing for Flatulence Termination
Get In the Fucking TARDIS
...?
Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory, Proggy.
As defined by the Penny Arcade webcomic: Average person + Anonyimity + Internet = Fuckwad
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A bit late there, Priestling.
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by two minutes and seventeen seconds, Saturn. I was catching up on the thread.
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Thanks you two. That would have been my next guess. Really... :p
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Kinda close. The far right has a shrill, hysterical edge to it that it didn't seem to have in the 90s (okay, MORE shrill and hysterical, I mean), and the obstructionism is even greater, but yeah. Chalk it up to the fact that the president is near, the religious hysteria is much greater, and the average age of the religious right is "ancient."
But...yeah. It was a pale, watered-down version of the sheer psychotic batfuckery that we're experiencing now, but it was sort of close. If Obama wins in November, look for them to start impeachment proceedings at some point regardless of what he (a) did or (b) didn't do. Everything old is new again.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UwJYfTC9Hw
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Kinda close. The far right has a shrill, hysterical edge to it that it didn't seem to have in the 90s (okay, MORE shrill and hysterical, I mean), and the obstructionism is even greater, but yeah. Chalk it up to the fact that the president is near, the religious hysteria is much greater, and the average age of the religious right is "ancient."
But...yeah. It was a pale, watered-down version of the sheer psychotic batfuckery that we're experiencing now, but it was sort of close. If Obama wins in November, look for them to start impeachment proceedings at some point regardless of what he (a) did or (b) didn't do. Everything old is new again.
Near where I live, one person has a sign in their van window that says "Yes we can...impeach Obama!"
This was put up about a month after his initial inauguration.
Yeah... I think I'll go curl up in a corner and weep for America now.
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Kinda close. The far right has a shrill, hysterical edge to it that it didn't seem to have in the 90s (okay, MORE shrill and hysterical, I mean), and the obstructionism is even greater, but yeah. Chalk it up to the fact that the president is near, the religious hysteria is much greater, and the average age of the religious right is "ancient."
But...yeah. It was a pale, watered-down version of the sheer psychotic batfuckery that we're experiencing now, but it was sort of close. If Obama wins in November, look for them to start impeachment proceedings at some point regardless of what he (a) did or (b) didn't do. Everything old is new again.
What everyone is missing is the fact that Rush Limbaugh was a new thing back in the Clinton days. Yes, there was right wing radio/talk shows, but it was largely relegated to AM stations and only listened to by the super crazy conspiracy theorists. Fox News at that time was very subtle about being the media arm of the GOP. In the time since, there has been an explosion on that type of thing, which has only served to whip the crazies into a frenzy and infect supposedly "normal" conservatives.
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Near where I live, one person has a sign in their van window that says "Yes we can...impeach Obama!"
This was put up about a month after his initial inauguration.
Democrats simply aren't allowed to win elections. The US government ought to be a single-party system and the Republicans, for some reason, ought to be that single party.