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Community => Religion and Philosophy => Topic started by: TheReasonator on November 01, 2012, 10:54:24 am

Title: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: TheReasonator on November 01, 2012, 10:54:24 am
It's never explicitly stated in the Bible, yet it's widely believed by Christians and has been even more strongly believed in the past than now.

Who said it was a sin? What social pressures lead them to say it and what social pressures lead others to propagate and follow it? Were they any countertendancies? Anybody who said that wasn't sound doctrine?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Mechtaur on November 01, 2012, 12:34:35 pm
As I recall right, the whole "No sex outside of marriage" thing came from the mitzvah that said that a woman that wasn't a virgin when she got married was to be stoned.

That and you have idiots that actually think that a ring will stop various sexual things like the guy running away if he knocks the girl up and stuff like that.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Canadian Mojo on November 01, 2012, 01:41:52 pm
Remember that whole patriarchy hangup we've had for the last few thousand years? As a man, you can never be sure that a child is yours unless you take steps to keep other men away from your property. It's a sin not because men think women are prone to it, it's a sin because men know they are.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 01, 2012, 03:01:07 pm
"It's never explicitly stated in the Bible"

Uh, the seventh commandment? That whole "thou shalt not commit adultery" thing? That's pretty fucking explicit.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: erictheblue on November 01, 2012, 03:37:29 pm
"It's never explicitly stated in the Bible"

Uh, the seventh commandment? That whole "thou shalt not commit adultery" thing? That's pretty fucking explicit.

From Merriam-Webster's Dictionary

Quote
voluntary sexual intercourse between a married man and someone other than his wife or between a married woman and someone other than her husband

If neither person is married, it is not adultery.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 01, 2012, 05:25:51 pm
The way it was explained to me (which Wikipedia tells me is in line with Catholic doctrine), was that adultery was having sex with anyone who was not your spouse. That meant that if you had sex with someone and you weren't married yet, well, they still aren't your spouse, so it's technically adultery anyway. Same with masturbation, because you aren't married to yourself.

Remember that whole patriarchy hangup we've had for the last few thousand years? As a man, you can never be sure that a child is yours unless you take steps to keep other men away from your property. It's a sin not because men think women are prone to it, it's a sin because men know they are.

This.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Old Viking on November 01, 2012, 05:44:43 pm
The precise theological formula is: If it's fun, it's a sin.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: ThunderWulf on November 01, 2012, 11:28:45 pm
The way it was explained to me (which Wikipedia tells me is in line with Catholic doctrine), was that adultery was having sex with anyone who was not your spouse. That meant that if you had sex with someone and you weren't married yet, well, they still aren't your spouse, so it's technically adultery anyway. Same with masturbation, because you aren't married to yourself.

Huh.  Yeah I guess if someone looked at it that way you could technically make any sex not between a married couple adultery.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RavynousHunter on November 01, 2012, 11:51:55 pm
The precise theological formula is: If it's fun, it's a sin.

Drinking, fighting, fucking...they basically outlawed 99% of the lifestyle of your typical Irishman.  Much less your typical Viking.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 02, 2012, 02:09:40 am
The way it was explained to me (which Wikipedia tells me is in line with Catholic doctrine), was that adultery was having sex with anyone who was not your spouse. That meant that if you had sex with someone and you weren't married yet, well, they still aren't your spouse, so it's technically adultery anyway. Same with masturbation, because you aren't married to yourself.

Huh.  Yeah I guess if someone looked at it that way you could technically make any sex not between a married couple adultery.

Welcome to Catholicism. Leave your sexual freedoms at the door and pick up a lifetime of sexual dysfunction on your way out.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Random Dinosaur on November 02, 2012, 03:15:00 am
And a bunch of old male pedophiles have the exclusive right to decide what God's Will is for all time.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Vypernight on November 02, 2012, 05:27:20 am
The precise theological formula is: If it's fun, it's a sin.

Drinking, fighting, fucking...they basically outlawed 99% of the lifestyle of your typical Irishman.  Much less your typical Viking.

Actually I think they welcome drinking.  It'd certainly help with the lack of sex (except for altar boys).
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 02, 2012, 12:58:38 pm
Drinking is fine to Christainity. Not Islam. Drunkness is a sin though.

Sin din sin din.

Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Cataclysm on November 02, 2012, 02:35:25 pm
The way it was explained to me (which Wikipedia tells me is in line with Catholic doctrine), was that adultery was having sex with anyone who was not your spouse. That meant that if you had sex with someone and you weren't married yet, well, they still aren't your spouse, so it's technically adultery anyway. Same with masturbation, because you aren't married to yourself.

Huh.  Yeah I guess if someone looked at it that way you could technically make any sex not between a married couple adultery.

Welcome to Catholicism. Leave your sexual freedoms at the door and pick up a lifetime of sexual dysfunction on your way out.

Catholicism is not representative of all Christianity.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Star Cluster on November 02, 2012, 04:20:59 pm
The way it was explained to me (which Wikipedia tells me is in line with Catholic doctrine), was that adultery was having sex with anyone who was not your spouse. That meant that if you had sex with someone and you weren't married yet, well, they still aren't your spouse, so it's technically adultery anyway. Same with masturbation, because you aren't married to yourself.

Huh.  Yeah I guess if someone looked at it that way you could technically make any sex not between a married couple adultery.

Welcome to Catholicism. Leave your sexual freedoms at the door and pick up a lifetime of sexual dysfunction on your way out.

Catholicism is not representative of all Christianity.

On a lot of topics, you're right.  But on this one, from my experience growing up in a Protestant home and (Methodist) church, sex outside of marriage is always considered a sin.  I was going to respond to Smurfette's comment that you quoted and say that it isn't just Catholics that think this way.  I also think her explanation of why it is considered adultery is correct.  At least, that's what I had always been taught.  If your sexual partner is not your spouse, it's adultery.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: m52nickerson on November 02, 2012, 08:16:46 pm
http://christianity.about.com/od/Bible-Verses/a/Adultery-And-Fornication.htm

"Ephesians 5:3–5
But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks. For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God."
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Cataclysm on November 02, 2012, 09:00:25 pm
The way it was explained to me (which Wikipedia tells me is in line with Catholic doctrine), was that adultery was having sex with anyone who was not your spouse. That meant that if you had sex with someone and you weren't married yet, well, they still aren't your spouse, so it's technically adultery anyway. Same with masturbation, because you aren't married to yourself.

Huh.  Yeah I guess if someone looked at it that way you could technically make any sex not between a married couple adultery.

Welcome to Catholicism. Leave your sexual freedoms at the door and pick up a lifetime of sexual dysfunction on your way out.

Catholicism is not representative of all Christianity.

On a lot of topics, you're right.  But on this one, from my experience growing up in a Protestant home and (Methodist) church, sex outside of marriage is always considered a sin.  I was going to respond to Smurfette's comment that you quoted and say that it isn't just Catholics that think this way.  I also think her explanation of why it is considered adultery is correct.  At least, that's what I had always been taught.  If your sexual partner is not your spouse, it's adultery.

If Smurphy's reasoning that premarital sex = adultery stems from catholic dogma, then even if other sects believe it, then it still stands that the Bible isn't against it. Although the Bible doesn't mention it. Probably because kids being married at age 12 meant pre-maritial sex was very rare in these times.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Star Cluster on November 02, 2012, 11:45:07 pm
If Smurphy's reasoning that premarital sex = adultery stems from catholic dogma, then even if other sects believe it, then it still stands that the Bible isn't against it. Although the Bible doesn't mention it. Probably because kids being married at age 12 meant pre-maritial sex was very rare in these times.

It is covered in the Bible.  As m52nickerson's post just before your last one pointed out, it's also called fornication, which specifically does include sex outside of marriage and is called a sin.  Don't know how it could be any clearer that the Bible is against it.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: TheL on November 05, 2012, 12:22:10 pm
From what I can tell, the original reason for making non-marital sex taboo was the following:

1. Before birth control, and in societies where property was handed down from father to son, you needed a way to be certain that your wife's kids were, in fact, your own.  If she'd never slept with anybody else, then you knew your stuff was in fact going to your kids.

2. If you were a pregnant woman, and the father of your child left you, you were screwed in both the literal and figurative sense, as women in many early cultures weren't allowed to own property and only had access to one profession--the world's oldest.  (This is also why Jewish prophets are recorded as saying a LOT about giving to widows--if you were a woman and didn't have a husband, you had NOTHING.)  If you were married to the father of your children, then he was automatically guaranteed to take responsibility, as they were now legally part of his family in addition to being blood offspring.

3. In the days when marriage was a financial transaction, a deflowered woman was considered less valuable than a virgin, partly for the reasons above, and partly because the system of inheritance in place at the time was so strongly dependent on controlling women.  If you could discourage premarital sex, and marry your daughters off young, then all the males in the arrangement benefited, and your daughters weren't left on the streets.

Naturally, the modern combination of readily-available birth control and higher ages at first marriage have made the need for a premarital sex taboo obsolete, which explains why our culture's attitudes toward premarital sex have changed so dramatically over the past 50 years or so.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: TheReasonator on November 05, 2012, 12:59:38 pm
Why didn't these societies just handle inheritance the way we do it i.e. by allowing you to dispose of it however you like? What was the function of mandating that it must pass from father to oldest son regardless of the father's wishes?

And what would've happened to a society that did choose to do inheritance by choice back then?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Paradox on November 05, 2012, 01:34:01 pm
I don't think that premarital sex is a sin.  Maybe staying a virgin until marriage was a practical option back when most people married in their teens, but nowdays the average age of marriage is around thirty, at least in America.  It's just not reasonable to tell people to completely deny their sexual urges until mid adulthood.

I do think that infidelity is wrong though.  Some people have open marriage and whatnot, but I try my best not to have an opinion on that sort of thing.  Lord only knows how that works out.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 05, 2012, 02:11:00 pm
From what I can tell, the original reason for making non-marital sex taboo was the following:

1. Before birth control, and in societies where property was handed down from father to son, you needed a way to be certain that your wife's kids were, in fact, your own.  If she'd never slept with anybody else, then you knew your stuff was in fact going to your kids.

Sheep(Or Goat, me thinks) intestine condoms have existed for quite a long time. You can find mention of them, to my knowledge, in Pompeii! Just they were pretty terrible compared to modern birth control.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: ironbite on November 05, 2012, 07:46:47 pm
Why didn't these societies just handle inheritance the way we do it i.e. by allowing you to dispose of it however you like? What was the function of mandating that it must pass from father to oldest son regardless of the father's wishes?

And what would've happened to a society that did choose to do inheritance by choice back then?

*smashes two stone tablets over Reasonator's head*

Because that was in the days before women were considered individuals.  Or are you not getting it?

Really I gotta go with Old Viking's reasoning.  It was fun.  Early Christianity considered anything fun a sin.

Ironbite-it's really that simple.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: erictheblue on November 06, 2012, 10:05:24 am
Why didn't these societies just handle inheritance the way we do it i.e. by allowing you to dispose of it however you like? What was the function of mandating that it must pass from father to oldest son regardless of the father's wishes?

And what would've happened to a society that did choose to do inheritance by choice back then?

*smashes two stone tablets over Reasonator's head*

Because that was in the days before women were considered individuals.  Or are you not getting it?

That doesn't actually address Reasonator's comment. What if the father hated his eldest son and wanted his second son to get everything? What if he wanted all his sons to share equally?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 06, 2012, 02:34:32 pm
Why didn't these societies just handle inheritance the way we do it i.e. by allowing you to dispose of it however you like? What was the function of mandating that it must pass from father to oldest son regardless of the father's wishes?

And what would've happened to a society that did choose to do inheritance by choice back then?

*smashes two stone tablets over Reasonator's head*

Because that was in the days before women were considered individuals.  Or are you not getting it?

That doesn't actually address Reasonator's comment. What if the father hated his eldest son and wanted his second son to get everything? What if he wanted all his sons to share equally?

To answer the second question, if not the first: breaking up inheritances is messy. There's deciding what goes to whom, but more than that: let's say you have ninety acres of land and you have three sons. You love your sons equally, so they each get thirty acres. Then each of them has three sons and breaks it up evenly, and so each of your grandsons get ten acres. It doesn't take that many generations to not having enough land to pass on. Better to keep everything in the family and giving away everything as one big chunk instead of giving it all away.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: TheReasonator on November 07, 2012, 02:37:21 am
Why didn't these societies just handle inheritance the way we do it i.e. by allowing you to dispose of it however you like? What was the function of mandating that it must pass from father to oldest son regardless of the father's wishes?

And what would've happened to a society that did choose to do inheritance by choice back then?

*smashes two stone tablets over Reasonator's head*

Because that was in the days before women were considered individuals.  Or are you not getting it?

Really I gotta go with Old Viking's reasoning.  It was fun.  Early Christianity considered anything fun a sin.

Ironbite-it's really that simple.

Why did they do that?
Why not have the first child, regardless of gender inherit? What was the impetus to limit it exclusively to males?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Sour Grapes on November 07, 2012, 03:15:39 am
Because, back then, giving an inheritance to a female was like leaving your farm to one of the cows.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: starseeker on November 07, 2012, 08:24:02 am
Because a woman's property would belong to her husband when she married (this was the case in UK law until 1870). This is why the rules about a woman inheriting tend to involve her marrying a male relative to keep the property in the family.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: TheReasonator on November 07, 2012, 11:53:01 am
Because a woman's property would belong to her husband when she married (this was the case in UK law until 1870). This is why the rules about a woman inheriting tend to involve her marrying a male relative to keep the property in the family.

So then why didn't they just allow joint ownership?
Or even separate places owned and then meeting at regular scheduled intervals for relations. I've read that at the latter part(meeting at regularly scheduled intervals) was/is still? a custom in some parts of India.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 07, 2012, 01:35:33 pm
I Think a rousing game of Crusader Kings 2 played entirely on Gravelkind could give you a very good idea why equal inheritance is terrible.

There's also a shift through later ages from Agnatic Inheritance to Agnatic-Cognate to eventually what we have today, absolute Cognate. Or male Only to females if there's no males (Elizabeth, Katherine as examples) to females and males inherit equally. Provided, of course, there's no will. I think the main issue why until recently why wills and the like usually didn't work that easily because if you could make a good argument that somebody 'coerced' the late individual into the will, you could start a succession struggle. Having clear rules regardless of who's king or duke or land owner, prevents such things. Either in personal violence or civil war.  As writing and witnesship became clearer, such claims could not be made without a great deal of doubt.

I mean, Charlemange's Holy Roman Empire originally was really Roman and an Empire, and was anointed by the pope (Therefore holy), but his son's got it split between the German/Italian portion and the French portion. Why splitting up inheritances results in awful things. Though it doesn't help that Feudalism is a terrible way to run a large country like France-Germany-Italy Empire. Why joint ownership also doesn't work (Originally the Sons were supposed to Joint Rule, but they just couldn't having an equal).
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 07, 2012, 04:02:42 pm
Because a woman's property would belong to her husband when she married (this was the case in UK law until 1870). This is why the rules about a woman inheriting tend to involve her marrying a male relative to keep the property in the family.

So then why didn't they just allow joint ownership?
Or even separate places owned and then meeting at regular scheduled intervals for relations. I've read that at the latter part(meeting at regularly scheduled intervals) was/is still? a custom in some parts of India.

Because for a long time women were considered men "gone wrong" and were incapable of rational thought, morality, or self-control. Later on women were considered "too pure" to be involved in things like property ownership and something that "dirty" should stay the domain of her male relatives.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 15, 2012, 02:40:55 pm
 The Bible promotes complete abstinence before marriage. Sex between a husband and his wife is the only form of sexual relations of which God approves. Just look at Hebrews 13:4
 "Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge" So why would one want to take part in immorality and risk their eternal soul. It is just not worth displeasing God for a bit of lustful fornication.


















Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Sleepy on November 15, 2012, 02:57:02 pm
I personally find it silly to wait until your status has changed legally so you can fuck, but that's just me.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 15, 2012, 03:58:55 pm
The Bible promotes complete abstinence before marriage. Sex between a husband and his wife is the only form of sexual relations of which God approves. Just look at Hebrews 13:4
 "Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge" So why would one want to take part in immorality and risk their eternal soul. It is just not worth displeasing God for a bit of lustful fornication.

(http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mdf3sntgBb1qkqjw2.gif)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Sleepy on November 15, 2012, 04:00:08 pm
Indeed. I was hoping for many more posts.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 15, 2012, 04:54:55 pm
The Bible promotes complete abstinence before marriage. Sex between a husband and his wife is the only form of sexual relations of which God approves. Just look at Hebrews 13:4
 "Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge" So why would one want to take part in immorality and risk their eternal soul. It is just not worth displeasing God for a bit of lustful fornication.

(http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mdf3sntgBb1qkqjw2.gif)
Frankly I don't mind having a different view on the subject--even though I totally disagree. Actually I think that leads to the most fun on this board.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 15, 2012, 05:10:59 pm
The Bible promotes complete abstinence before marriage. Sex between a husband and his wife is the only form of sexual relations of which God approves. Just look at Hebrews 13:4
 "Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge" So why would one want to take part in immorality and risk their eternal soul. It is just not worth displeasing God for a bit of lustful fornication.

(http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mdf3sntgBb1qkqjw2.gif)
Frankly I don't mind having a different view on the subject--even though I totally disagree. Actually I think that leads to the most fun on this board.
Is a bit of hedonistic pleasure worth eternal damnation? God gave us a great big pineapple and He said don't touch it. He didn't say touch it once in a while; He didn't say take a nibble when you're hungry; He said don't touch it, period.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 15, 2012, 05:12:05 pm
The Bible promotes complete abstinence before marriage. Sex between a husband and his wife is the only form of sexual relations of which God approves. Just look at Hebrews 13:4
 "Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge" So why would one want to take part in immorality and risk their eternal soul. It is just not worth displeasing God for a bit of lustful fornication.

(http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mdf3sntgBb1qkqjw2.gif)
Frankly I don't mind having a different view on the subject--even though I totally disagree. Actually I think that leads to the most fun on this board.

Not picking on him for his opinion, I just think that it seems like trolling. Trolling or someone who has never used the internet.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: QueenofHearts on November 15, 2012, 05:14:08 pm
Pastor Dave- Because of you I have seen the light. Continue preaching to these God-less heathens. They work with demons, so they may mock you and say blasphemous things, but continue to pray for them as I will. More importantly, keep coming back and posting. It is the only way to save their souls.

Your sister in Christ
~QoH
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 15, 2012, 05:24:16 pm
There is no reason to mock me or the Lord. I am here to help you.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Hades on November 15, 2012, 05:28:20 pm
Unlike my fellow forum members, I appreciate your wanting to help us.

I have a hole that needs filling, pastor. I've tried filling it with many objects, and none of them have satiated my desire. Is it true that the Good Lord Jesus is the only one who can fill this hole? I need his holy girth. Tell me how to receive it.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: ironbite on November 15, 2012, 05:35:06 pm
Oh you're gonna last long here in the world of FSTDT.

Ironbite-but welcome to the Jungle, we've got fun and games....also I've been importing lesbian ninjas from the Allspark.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 15, 2012, 05:49:56 pm
Alright, I've been waiting to post in this thread for a while now.

As many of you know, I'm a devout Roman Catholic, and also a virgin who has every intention of waiting until marriage to have sex. It's true that this desire, at least growing up, was heavily influenced by my faith— my parents and my church made it clear that I should wait, and the younger me listened. But nowadays, as I've matured and come into my own beliefs, I have a different rationale for staying celibate until I marry.

Let me first say, though, that I don't see anything wrong with premarital sex. Simply put, it's your choice what you do with your body and sexuality, and I neither have nor desire any authority over that decision. Sex feels good for a reason. Evolutionarily speaking, it's fun because if it wasn't no one would do it. And, as someone who firmly believes in God, I don't believe He'd give us the gift of sex only to punish us when we use it. Sex isn't bad, and having doesn't make you bad.

I've chosen to stay celibate because I can only have my first time once. My first girlfriend, my first kiss, my first real dance... All those firsts are part of old relationships, of attempts that failed. But my virginity is still mine to give, and I want to give it to the person I plan to spend the rest of my life with. It's a token of my love, and a sign that I consider her worth that wait and sacrifice. Not all couples need this token— most don't, in fact. Love isn't all about sex, and sex doesn't prove or create love. But my Aspergers means that I'm always going to have trouble expressing my love through words and actions. So I've chosen to remain chaste and let that choice say the words for me, better than I ever could. I don't care if my future wife is a virgin or not— her body, her call. I may not want to know about her past sex life, but I can't fault her for having one. I don't plan to base my whole future relationship around her old relationships.

If you've had sex before marriage, I hope you were safe. I hope it was wonderful and you don't regret it one bit. I don't have an ounce of judgement in me towards you. Just as you chose to, I've chosen not to, for my own reasons. Neither of us is right or wrong.

Also, Pastor, I mean you no mockery when I say this: What petty God would damn His creations to hell for acting on a natural desire?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 15, 2012, 05:50:52 pm
Quote
Galatians 6:7

"Do not be deceived: God is not mocked, for whatever one sows, that will he also reap"
Those of you who don't realize your place before God,your faith shines through and above all those who dont realize that God is the Almighty God, and He is someone to fear. God bless you. I am praying for all of you.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 15, 2012, 05:52:46 pm
I pray for everyone every day, Pastor, to a God who doesn't judge for the sin of being human.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 15, 2012, 05:55:29 pm
Quote
Also, Pastor, I mean you no mockery when I say this: What petty God would damn His creations to hell for acting on a natural desire?
God is most glorified through you when you are most satisfied in Him. Through your suffering in staying pure God is being glorified by your decision to stay that way rather than give in to sinful temptation.




Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 15, 2012, 05:58:45 pm
Quote
Also, Pastor, I mean you no mockery when I say this: What petty God would damn His creations to hell for acting on a natural desire?
God is most glorified through you when you are most satisfied in Him. Through your suffering in staying pure God is being glorified by your decision to stay that way rather than give in to sinful temptation.

But how is sex sinful? Sex is something almost all human beings are capable of and desire (with the exception of asexuals), brings great joy to those involved, and, when practiced safely and intelligently, brings no harm to those who engage in it. Sex doesn't have to be a negative thing.

And my celibacy is in no way "suffering". It doesn't affect my life or happiness in any way.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Fpqxz on November 15, 2012, 05:59:39 pm
Quote
Also, Pastor, I mean you no mockery when I say this: What petty God would damn His creations to hell for acting on a natural desire?
God is most glorified through you when you are most satisfied in Him. Through your suffering in staying pure God is being glorified by your decision to stay that way rather than give in to sinful temptation.

I'm all for people controlling their urges and not being governed by their baser instincts.

I just don't see why anyone should need a permission slip from a clergyman before doing the ol' Horizontal Mambo.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: FirsthandTuna on November 15, 2012, 06:03:19 pm
God is most glorified through you when you are most satisfied in Him.

I didn't know god was into that sort of thing.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 15, 2012, 06:16:02 pm
Many things are pleasurable that should not be indulged in. Drinking and drugs are supposed to be pleasureable but lead to debaucherous behavior. Gambling is a worldly pleasure for though it leads to broken homes and tremendous loss. The Lord is testing us everyday with worldly pleasures. Unbridled lust, excess, licentiousness, wantonness, outrageousness, shamelessness, insolence, and drunkenness we must avoid like the plague. The Bible says that you “cannot serve two masters.” Either you are obeying God, doing what is right, or you are doing what the world does. Those who are seeking the pleasures in this world are honoring themselves, not God.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: QueenofHearts on November 15, 2012, 06:18:02 pm
Amen brother!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Hades on November 15, 2012, 06:22:38 pm
What if I choose to glorify God by jerking off with bacon grease? He should love me for who I am.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 15, 2012, 06:22:51 pm
Many things are pleasurable that should not be indulged in. Drinking and drugs are supposed to be pleasureable but lead to debaucherous behavior. Gambling is a worldly pleasure for though it leads to broken homes and tremendous loss. The Lord is testing us everyday with worldly pleasures. Unbridled lust, excess, licentiousness, wantonness, outrageousness, shamelessness, insolence, and drunkenness we must avoid like the plague. The Bible says that you “cannot serve two masters.” Either you are obeying God, doing what is right, or you are doing what the world does. Those who are seeking the pleasures in this world are honoring themselves, not God.

Drinking, drugs, and gambling aren't the same as sex. Each of those have clear negative consequences- drugs and alcohol are literally poisonous, for example. Under the brief pleasure is a lifetime of potential pain. In moderation, however, gambling and alcohol won't harm you, and hard drugs are easy to avoid. There's also no natural inborn desire to do any of those things, and none of them are part of human biology.

And before you say I'm a drunk or gambling addict or what have you, let me just point out that I'm a teetotaler who never gambles with real money.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: FirsthandTuna on November 15, 2012, 06:23:14 pm
What if I choose to glorify God by jerking off with bacon grease? He should love me for who I am.

As long as you're married to the bacon grease.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Hades on November 15, 2012, 06:25:33 pm
Many things are pleasurable that should not be indulged in. Drinking and drugs are supposed to be pleasureable but lead to debaucherous behavior. Gambling is a worldly pleasure for though it leads to broken homes and tremendous loss. The Lord is testing us everyday with worldly pleasures. Unbridled lust, excess, licentiousness, wantonness, outrageousness, shamelessness, insolence, and drunkenness we must avoid like the plague. The Bible says that you “cannot serve two masters.” Either you are obeying God, doing what is right, or you are doing what the world does. Those who are seeking the pleasures in this world are honoring themselves, not God.

Drinking, drugs, and gambling aren't the same as sex. Each of those have clear negative consequences- drugs and alcohol are literally poisonous, for example. Under the brief pleasure is a lifetime of potential pain. In moderation, however, gambling and alcohol won't harm you, and hard drugs are easy to avoid. There's also no natural inborn desire to do any of those things, and none of them are part of human biology.

And before you say I'm a drunk or gambling addict or what have you, let me just point out that I'm a teetotaler who never gambles with real money.

But you're gambling with your SOUL.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 15, 2012, 06:26:54 pm
Many things are pleasurable that should not be indulged in. Drinking and drugs are supposed to be pleasureable but lead to debaucherous behavior. Gambling is a worldly pleasure for though it leads to broken homes and tremendous loss. The Lord is testing us everyday with worldly pleasures. Unbridled lust, excess, licentiousness, wantonness, outrageousness, shamelessness, insolence, and drunkenness we must avoid like the plague. The Bible says that you “cannot serve two masters.” Either you are obeying God, doing what is right, or you are doing what the world does. Those who are seeking the pleasures in this world are honoring themselves, not God.

Drinking, drugs, and gambling aren't the same as sex. Each of those have clear negative consequences- drugs and alcohol are literally poisonous, for example. Under the brief pleasure is a lifetime of potential pain. In moderation, however, gambling and alcohol won't harm you, and hard drugs are easy to avoid. There's also no natural inborn desire to do any of those things, and none of them are part of human biology.

And before you say I'm a drunk or gambling addict or what have you, let me just point out that I'm a teetotaler who never gambles with real money.

But you're gambling with your SOUL.

If God plays poker, I can take God to the cleaners.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Hades on November 15, 2012, 06:30:33 pm
Come on, Rinella! TWO MORE POSTS.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Sleepy on November 15, 2012, 06:45:17 pm
I'm atheist, but if I weren't, why worship a god who's enough of a jackhole to make sex feel so good, then ban it under many circumstances? That's just a dick move.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 15, 2012, 06:49:24 pm
I'm atheist, but if I weren't, why worship a god who's enough of a jackhole to make sex feel so good, then ban it under many circumstances? That's just a dick move.

Some people would say it's a test of your obedience, or that He had to because we have free will. But I don't think of God as some sort of trickster just waiting for you to mess up or make a mistake so He can condemn you. Such complicated rules that run totally against human nature are more of a trap waiting to be sprung than a test of faith to be endured.

Come on, Rinella! TWO MORE POSTS.

Ooh, I better make the next one count.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 15, 2012, 07:02:52 pm
Many things are pleasurable that should not be indulged in. Drinking and drugs are supposed to be pleasureable but lead to debaucherous behavior. Gambling is a worldly pleasure for though it leads to broken homes and tremendous loss. The Lord is testing us everyday with worldly pleasures. Unbridled lust, excess, licentiousness, wantonness, outrageousness, shamelessness, insolence, and drunkenness we must avoid like the plague. The Bible says that you “cannot serve two masters.” Either you are obeying God, doing what is right, or you are doing what the world does. Those who are seeking the pleasures in this world are honoring themselves, not God.

Drinking, drugs, and gambling aren't the same as sex. Each of those have clear negative consequences- drugs and alcohol are literally poisonous, for example.
I know where this is headed: Sexually Transmitted Diseases.

Had an abstinence-only Sex Ed. class in school so I'm used to all the arguments against premarital sex.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 15, 2012, 07:05:00 pm
And am I the only one who thought of Pastor Dave from That 70's Show?

(http://www.tumblr.com/photo/1280/that70s/656996381/1/tumblr_l3eag4baK01qc1ev7)

Because he was pretty awesome.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 15, 2012, 07:13:16 pm
The Bible promotes complete abstinence before marriage. Sex between a husband and his wife is the only form of sexual relations of which God approves. Just look at Hebrews 13:4
 "Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge" So why would one want to take part in immorality and risk their eternal soul. It is just not worth displeasing God for a bit of lustful fornication.
(http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mdf3sntgBb1qkqjw2.gif)
Frankly I don't mind having a different view on the subject--even though I totally disagree. Actually I think that leads to the most fun on this board.
Is a bit of hedonistic pleasure worth eternal damnation? God gave us a great big pineapple and He said don't touch it. He didn't say touch it once in a while; He didn't say take a nibble when you're hungry; He said don't touch it, period.
I didn't even see that you quoted what I said. Were you responding to me?

Okay, well, I'm pretty much neutral on sex. If you want to have it outside of marriage that's up to you. If you want to wait until you marry that's also fine. To me it comes down to what you and your partner are comfortable with. Though I'm an atheist so unfortunately any argument based on Biblical admonitions won't really convince me.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: ironbite on November 15, 2012, 07:14:59 pm
I'm atheist, but if I weren't, why worship a god who's enough of a jackhole to make sex feel so good, then ban it under many circumstances? That's just a dick move.

Yeah but you're just a walking baby incubator so your opin-*blows up*

Ironbite-*respawns*  That was way too much bullshit even for me.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 15, 2012, 07:36:42 pm
Many things are pleasurable that should not be indulged in. Drinking and drugs are supposed to be pleasureable but lead to debaucherous behavior. Gambling is a worldly pleasure for though it leads to broken homes and tremendous loss. The Lord is testing us everyday with worldly pleasures. Unbridled lust, excess, licentiousness, wantonness, outrageousness, shamelessness, insolence, and drunkenness we must avoid like the plague. The Bible says that you “cannot serve two masters.” Either you are obeying God, doing what is right, or you are doing what the world does. Those who are seeking the pleasures in this world are honoring themselves, not God.

Drinking, drugs, and gambling aren't the same as sex. Each of those have clear negative consequences- drugs and alcohol are literally poisonous, for example.
I know where this is headed: Sexually Transmitted Diseases.

Had an abstinence-only Sex Ed. class in school so I'm used to all the arguments against premarital sex.

Ah, but I mentioned that it harms no one if done safely.

And my private Catholic high school taught Sex Ed the real way- encourage abstinence and good judgement, sure, but also explaining exactly how birth control and condoms work and how to be safe about it. The analogy they used was that "Telling you not to have sex is like telling you not to get acne— no matter how much your mind tries to resist, your body has other ideas."
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Fpqxz on November 15, 2012, 07:54:20 pm
What if I choose to glorify God by jerking off with bacon grease? He should love me for who I am.

If you really wanted to glorify God with bacon grease, you would use it to fry up some eggs and hash browns with onions and peppers.

Anything else, while not necessarily a sin, is a waste of perfectly good bacon grease.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Radiation on November 15, 2012, 10:21:50 pm
Mod_ Reactor Activated____|

Pastor Dave, people here are generally comfortable with their current religious status.  If you want to preach here, take it to the Preaching and Worship section of these forums and debate and proselytize there.

Mod_Reactor Deactived___|
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 15, 2012, 10:23:48 pm
Many things are pleasurable that should not be indulged in. Drinking and drugs are supposed to be pleasureable but lead to debaucherous behavior. Gambling is a worldly pleasure for though it leads to broken homes and tremendous loss. The Lord is testing us everyday with worldly pleasures. Unbridled lust, excess, licentiousness, wantonness, outrageousness, shamelessness, insolence, and drunkenness we must avoid like the plague. The Bible says that you “cannot serve two masters.” Either you are obeying God, doing what is right, or you are doing what the world does. Those who are seeking the pleasures in this world are honoring themselves, not God.

Drinking, drugs, and gambling aren't the same as sex. Each of those have clear negative consequences- drugs and alcohol are literally poisonous, for example.
I know where this is headed: Sexually Transmitted Diseases.

Had an abstinence-only Sex Ed. class in school so I'm used to all the arguments against premarital sex.

Ah, but I mentioned that it harms no one if done safely.

And my private Catholic high school taught Sex Ed the real way- encourage abstinence and good judgement, sure, but also explaining exactly how birth control and condoms work and how to be safe about it. The analogy they used was that "Telling you not to have sex is like telling you not to get acne— no matter how much your mind tries to resist, your body has other ideas."

Same way. They referred to it as "Safer Sex" sort of how we refer to tasers as "Less-Lethal." It helps... but in some cases it still results in issues.

Which is true. "Safe-sex" isn't usually 100% fail-proof.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Mechtaur on November 16, 2012, 01:35:12 am
Ok, Dave, you're gonna have to take a better route than the whole "the commandment said none of this, so none of this ever", especially when you're dealing with a god that commanded no killing/murder, then ordered a whole lot of genocides (Before having his army stomped by some bumpkins with iron chariots).


EDIT: Might as well have some more fun with this, seeing as Rinella is making some more reasonable posts as compared to Dave.

Just curious about something, the definition of adultery according to most Christians is sex outside of marriage in any form. Be it pre-marriage, an extra-marital affair, or a widow remarrying (according to the Bible at any rate). Now, based on this, how can someone say that Jesus isn't the result of adultery. Last I checked, Mary wasn't married to Yahweh. Or does it not count since apparently "because God"?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: QueenofHearts on November 16, 2012, 02:05:22 am
And am I the only one who thought of Pastor Dave from That 70's Show?
Because he was pretty awesome.

I knew that name was familiar
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 16, 2012, 03:40:43 am
EDIT: Might as well have some more fun with this, seeing as Rinella is making some more reasonable posts as compared to Dave.

I hope that's a good thing.

Just curious about something, the definition of adultery according to most Christians is sex outside of marriage in any form. Be it pre-marriage, an extra-marital affair, or a widow remarrying (according to the Bible at any rate). Now, based on this, how can someone say that Jesus isn't the result of adultery. Last I checked, Mary wasn't married to Yahweh. Or does it not count since apparently "because God"?

I can't speak for all Christians, but I don't think of Christ as being "conceived" in the normal sense. He simply appeared in Mary's womb. God and Mary didn't literally have sex.

And adultery, to my knowledge, means cheating in a married relationship. Sex before marriage is "fornication".
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: TheL on November 16, 2012, 08:18:49 am
The Bible promotes complete abstinence before marriage. Sex between a husband and his wife is the only form of sexual relations of which God approves. Just look at Hebrews 13:4
 "Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge" So why would one want to take part in immorality and risk their eternal soul. It is just not worth displeasing God for a bit of lustful fornication.

OK, here's the thing: only 2 forms of sex are really condemned in the Bible.  Prostitution, and adultery.  And the only way to have adultery is if one or both of the people having sex are married to other people.

So if neither of you are married, it's not adultery.  Words have meanings.

By the way, Dave?  Here are a lot of hedonistic pleasures I enjoy, that are not considered sinful by any definition:

- Sewing.
- Playing video games.
- Singing silly songs.
- Quoting Doctor Who and Star Wars back and forth with my boyfriend.
- Crochet.
- Making Jell-O gummies.
- Playing tug-of-war and fetch with my dog.
- Reading.
- Walking in the fresh air and sunshine.
- Trying new foods.
- Dressing up for Renaissance Faires.

It just seems silly and wrong to equate all pleasure with sin the way you're doing.  There are so many pleasurable things in life that don't hurt anyone and are not against any religion.  Why would any loving deity not want our lives to have any fun in them at all?  Sure there's suffering, but there is also joy.  To ignore the joy will sap the life out of you if you let it.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 09:24:26 am
Many things are pleasurable that should not be indulged in. Drinking and drugs are supposed to be pleasureable but lead to debaucherous behavior. Gambling is a worldly pleasure for though it leads to broken homes and tremendous loss.

You forgot something here. Drinking and drugs can lead to debaucherous behavior. And gambling has potential to lead to broken homes and tremendous loss. Not will, but may.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 09:57:57 am

Quote
You forgot something here. Drinking and drugs can lead to debaucherous behavior. And gambling has potential to lead to broken homes and tremendous loss. Not will, but may.
  Why risk it? Not to mention the fact that you are sacrificing your eternal soul for worldly pleasures. 
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 10:05:26 am

 Why risk it? Not to mention the fact that you are sacrificing your eternal soul for worldly pleasures.

Because my belief structure differs from yours, the risk is very different. And again, differing beliefs, I tend to view my eternal soul differently along with the role of worldly pleasures. But really, none of that makes your argument that what you said about drinking, gambling, and drugs factually incorrect. It's really dishonest to say gambling, drinking, or drugs will lead to a broken home or anything else you've said.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 10:24:12 am
Sorry for the double post. For some reason, I couldn't get the modify button working.

Anyways, Pastor Dave, I have a question for you. You brought up Hebrews 13:4, which says "Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge" Awesome! But the problem is it does little to address the original question. See, being a whore means trading some sort of goods or services in exchange for sex. And adultery means at least one person in the relationship is married. But what the original question is talking about is premarital and (I'm assuming) with no thought to any kind of payment. Your verse did mention marriage is honorable, but it said nothing at all about premarriage. If you could address that, please, I'd like to hear your thoughts.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 10:30:28 am

Quote
You forgot something here. Drinking and drugs can lead to debaucherous behavior. And gambling has potential to lead to broken homes and tremendous loss. Not will, but may.
  Why risk it? Not to mention the fact that you are sacrificing your eternal soul for worldly pleasures.

I assume you aren't Catholic, possibly not Orthodox, because there's this thing... called. Forgiveness. I thought God was Merciful? To forgive is Divine?

So one only is 'sacrificing' their eternal soul if they have no desire to be forgiven of their sins. Your assumption that you do one bad thing and go directly to hell is bonkers.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 10:38:41 am
I assume you aren't Catholic, possibly not Orthodox, because there's this thing... called. Forgiveness. I thought God was Merciful? To forgive is Divine?

So one only is 'sacrificing' their eternal soul if they have no desire to be forgiven of their sins. Your assumption that you do one bad thing and go directly to hell is bonkers.

Well, forgiveness as I understood it was supposed to be insurance for honest oopsies or slip ups or lapses. Like swearing when you drop something on your toe or ignorance of something being a bonafide sin or someone pushing your buttons enough to react. Or it was supposed to fix the past, so to speak. As in before I was saved I yadda yadda yadda, but now I'm forgiven. I think forgiveness to cover willful sinning is not the way it works.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 10:42:01 am
Catholicism is a cult and of the devil. God loves you and me but hates our sin because our sin separates us from being with Him for eternity in Heaven. If you want to enter the kingdom of Heaven, one needs to walk right with Jesus and that means avoiding ALL worldly temptations every day as they do not please the holy spirit.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 10:42:50 am

Quote
You forgot something here. Drinking and drugs can lead to debaucherous behavior. And gambling has potential to lead to broken homes and tremendous loss. Not will, but may.
  Why risk it? Not to mention the fact that you are sacrificing your eternal soul for worldly pleasures.
Here's a question: I am an atheist, so religious arguments won't persuade me, so do you have any legitimate non-religious reasons as to why people should not have safe premarital sex?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 10:44:22 am
Catholicism is a cult and of the devil.
Pastor Dave I've been going easy on you because up until now you haven't really said anything offensive, but that kind of crosses the line. I have family members who are Catholic and I don't much care for being told they are members of a Satanic cult. Just a head's up that this kind of rhetoric is not appreciated.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 16, 2012, 10:46:55 am
I assume you aren't Catholic, possibly not Orthodox, because there's this thing... called. Forgiveness. I thought God was Merciful? To forgive is Divine?

So one only is 'sacrificing' their eternal soul if they have no desire to be forgiven of their sins. Your assumption that you do one bad thing and go directly to hell is bonkers.

Well, forgiveness as I understood it was supposed to be insurance for honest oopsies or slip ups or lapses. Like swearing when you drop something on your toe or ignorance of something being a bonafide sin or someone pushing your buttons enough to react. Or it was supposed to fix the past, so to speak. As in before I was saved I yadda yadda yadda, but now I'm forgiven. I think forgiveness to cover willful sinning is not the way it works.

I think he was talking to the Pastor. And in Catholicism, even willful sins can be forgiven. In fact, part of Reconciliation is acknowledging that you knew what you did was wrong and did it anyway.

Catholicism is a cult and of the devil. God loves you and me but hates our sin because our sin separates us from being with Him for eternity in Heaven. If you want to enter the kingdom of Heaven, one needs to walk right with Jesus and that means avoiding ALL worldly temptations every day as they do not please the holy spirit.

I'm going to leave aside your massive swing at my beloved faith here, though only because thisisn't the thread for it. Instead, let's focus on the second half of what you said. Not all things of joy in this life are evil—love, music, good food, friendship— and those are all worldly things. What makes the world so wrong in your eyes? Why is sex, a gift from God, so evil to you? What makes it so bad?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 10:56:16 am
Are we talking with Jack Chick in Disguise? You do know, Pastor Dave, that Protestantism was BORN from Catholicism. Calling the very thing that gave you your roots the devil is calling yourself the devil.

I assume you aren't Catholic, possibly not Orthodox, because there's this thing... called. Forgiveness. I thought God was Merciful? To forgive is Divine?

So one only is 'sacrificing' their eternal soul if they have no desire to be forgiven of their sins. Your assumption that you do one bad thing and go directly to hell is bonkers.

Well, forgiveness as I understood it was supposed to be insurance for honest oopsies or slip ups or lapses. Like swearing when you drop something on your toe or ignorance of something being a bonafide sin or someone pushing your buttons enough to react. Or it was supposed to fix the past, so to speak. As in before I was saved I yadda yadda yadda, but now I'm forgiven. I think forgiveness to cover willful sinning is not the way it works.

You can willfully sin and be forgiven. At least in catholic faith. Sincere desire for absolution and forgiveness is a requirement, so you may regret taking the action at all (Though not always), but you can gain forgiveness for any action. No matter how bad it is. Why Catholic Priests cannot be used as witnesses if they had a crime confessed to them in the reconciliation room. It's like a 1000x against their religion and would undermine the very concept of reconciliation. Though most Catholic Priests advise, if the crime wouldn't get the death penalty and Justice asks for reasonable punishment, that they accept the prison sentence and turn themselves in.

In Catholic tradition, there are two levels of sin. Venial, which are forgiven at every mass, and Mortal, which can only be forgiven through reconciliation. All sins start as venial, and only become mortal if you understand they are mortal. I was taught Lying is the most basic mortal sin and that goes up to things like genocide.

Its subject must be a grave (or serious) matter. (Though all the ten commandants are serious matters, so lying and cursing with God's name is mortal sinnery, provided the lie is more than a little.)
It must be committed with full knowledge, both of the sin and of the gravity of the offense (no one is considered ignorant of the principles of the moral law, which are inborn as part of human knowledge, but these principles can be misunderstood in a particular context).
It must be committed with deliberate and complete consent, enough for it to have been a personal decision to commit the sin. (Thus, if you rob someone to appease someone holding like, your love, with a gun to her head and you do it, it's only considered Venial.)

Orthodox tradition has a larger list of sins, with Pardonable being the bottom (Pardon as in you don't need penance to gain absolution) to Mortal (Meaning you need LOTS of penance for that absolution) at the top. It's seven long list.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 11:00:08 am
Roman Catholicism makes salvation a long, complicated process with no assurance of eternal life and forgiveness of all sin. Baptism, Mass, Confession, prayers to Mary and the Saints(evil), good works, and purgatory are all added to faith in Christ. By contrast, the Bible teaches salvation by faith in Jesus Christ alone. Bible salvation is God's free gift to any sinner who believes that Christ died for their sins and rose again for their defense. Bible salvation gives immediate assurance of eternal life. No church ever saved anyone, but Christ can and will save everyone who will come and trust Him as their Saviour. Membership or faith in a church does not secure salvation for anyone, but trust Christ and Him alone and you will be saved for all eternity. The Catholic religion is straight out of the pits of hell.  I do not call Catholicism a "church" because it is NOT a church, it is a FALSE religion.  How can you have a "church" when heathen people gather in the name of false doctrine?  You can't Jesus clearly made a direct correlation between worship and doctrine in Mark 6:6-9. 
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 11:03:13 am

I think he was talking to the Pastor.

Yeah, I know he was. But at that point, Pastor hasn't said anything too dickish. I thought the over sarcastic tone wasn't warranted just yet. I was hoping we'd wait til he said something a bit more douchey (like Catholicism is a cult and of the devil) before we jumped on him.

While I'm here, pastor, have you given any thought to my questions regarding Hebrews applying to premarital sex sans payment? Because one of our rules here is answering direct questions. I find ir a bit interesting (not to mention very telling) you thought it more worthy to jump on Catholicism due to a remark in passing rather than defend the Bible.

MD, you're right about the letter of the law. I was talking about the spirit. Sorry, I should have made that clearer. But it was meant to be an aside, not really meriting a serious discussion in regards to the topic at hand.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 11:06:24 am
I tend to always be somewhat sarcastic, even when I intend no offense.

Roman Catholicism makes salvation a long, complicated process with no assurance of eternal life and forgiveness of all sin. Baptism, Mass, Confession, prayers to Mary and the Saints(evil), good works, and purgatory are all added to faith in Christ. By contrast, the Bible teaches salvation by faith in Jesus Christ alone. Bible salvation is God's free gift to any sinner who believes that Christ died for their sins and rose again for their defense. Bible salvation gives immediate assurance of eternal life. No church ever saved anyone, but Christ can and will save everyone who will come and trust Him as their Saviour. Membership or faith in a church does not secure salvation for anyone, but trust Christ and Him alone and you will be saved for all eternity. The Catholic religion is straight out of the pits of hell.  I do not call Catholicism a "church" because it is NOT a church, it is a FALSE religion.  How can you have a "church" when heathen people gather in the name of false doctrine?  You can't Jesus clearly made a direct correlation between worship and doctrine in Mark 6:6-9.

Did you seriously just call people who went to heaven evil? Are you... how... what? My brain just. No. No. Just. Blarg. Saints are people who have gone to heaven.

The sacraments are there to help bring people closer to God and absolve them of sin. It does not get in their way, instead reconfirms and pulls them closer in.

On Good works...

17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead. James 2.

It also seems to be that your contradicting yourself. If all Jesus requires is belief and faith in him, wouldn't that mean you can do whatever you want while maintaining a fervent belief in him and still go to heaven? Why this concern for sin, when love of Jesus Christ will get you to heaven regardless of that?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 11:06:52 am
I would also like the Pastor to acknowledge my question on premarital sex.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 16, 2012, 11:16:29 am
I'm not going to derail the thread too much, but there is no way I'm letting this go unanswered.

Roman Catholicism makes salvation a long, complicated process with no assurance of eternal life and forgiveness of all sin.

Salvation isn't complicated. Do the right thing, and seek forgiveness for your sins, and the Kingdom of heaven shall be open to you. And it's true, we don't guarantee eternal life, but that's not a bad thing. If there's no guarantee that you'll be rewarded simply for saying a few words, then you have a reason to go out and work amongst the people and help them through their trouble. By that, you earn your place in Heaven.

Quote
Baptism, Mass, Confession, prayers to Mary and the Saints(evil), good works, and purgatory are all added to faith in Christ.

You do realize we don't actually pray to Mary and the saints, right? We ask them to pray for us, much like how you might ask a friend to pray for you in troubled times. We pray to God and Jesus Christ.

And what, exactly, is wrong with doing good works? Someone needs to do them, after all, and how could a loving God possibly be bothered by helping His creations, even if it isn't a requirement for salvation?

Christ, the Holy Son of God Himself, chose to work amongst the poor and marginalized. Who are we mere mortals to turn our backs on them?

Quote
By contrast, the Bible teaches salvation by faith in Jesus Christ alone. Bible salvation is God's free gift to any sinner who believes that Christ died for their sins and rose again for their defense. Bible salvation gives immediate assurance of eternal life. No church ever saved anyone, but Christ can and will save everyone who will come and trust Him as their Saviour. Membership or faith in a church does not secure salvation for anyone, but trust Christ and Him alone and you will be saved for all eternity. The Catholic religion is straight out of the pits of hell.  I do not call Catholicism a "church" because it is NOT a church, it is a FALSE religion.  How can you have a "church" when heathen people gather in the name of false doctrine?  You can't Jesus clearly made a direct correlation between worship and doctrine in Mark 6:6-9.

I trust in God with all my heart, but that doesn't mean I have to slavishly obey a book written thousands of years ago halfway across the world, in a language I can neither speak nor read, by men who lived in a patriarchal, militaristic theocracy. God's world has changed and grown, and as His follower I must change and grow with it.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 11:44:52 am
Quote
I trust in God with all my heart, but that doesn't mean I have to slavishly obey a book written thousands of years ago halfway across the world, in a language I can neither speak nor read, by men who lived in a patriarchal, militaristic theocracy. God's world has changed and grown, and as His follower I must change and grow with it.
And therin is your problem. The 1611 King James Holy Bible is the literal infallible word of God. You cannot trust in God while making a mockery of his word. And this is why I pray for your soul.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 16, 2012, 12:03:15 pm
Quote
I trust in God with all my heart, but that doesn't mean I have to slavishly obey a book written thousands of years ago halfway across the world, in a language I can neither speak nor read, by men who lived in a patriarchal, militaristic theocracy. God's world has changed and grown, and as His follower I must change and grow with it.
And therin is your problem. The 1611 King James Holy Bible is the literal infallible word of God. You cannot trust in God while making a mockery of his word. And this is why I pray for your soul.

A translation of a translation from four hundred years ago? That's the infallible version? I'd think the most accurate version to the direct words of God is the original Hebrew and Aramaic. What makes an English translation from Latin so special and deserving of love?

I can't help but notice that you utterly ignored the rest of my post. You've been doing it often, in fact— many good points and questions have been raised by other posters and up have gone totally unanswered by you. You've spent your whole time here posting preplanned rants condemning people you've never met, ignoring anything you can't or don't want to answer because you're afraid of having to think for yourself, and demeaning my friends on this board because you consider yourself above them.

I'm sorry I don't seem to hear God's Word the way you do. Then again, our beloved Lord saw fit to have me born hearing-impaired.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 12:06:18 pm
I'm not ignoring the posts. I don't have much time therefore I respond to the points that I can.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 12:12:35 pm
Quote
I trust in God with all my heart, but that doesn't mean I have to slavishly obey a book written thousands of years ago halfway across the world, in a language I can neither speak nor read, by men who lived in a patriarchal, militaristic theocracy. God's world has changed and grown, and as His follower I must change and grow with it.
And therin is your problem. The 1611 King James Holy Bible is the literal infallible word of God. You cannot trust in God while making a mockery of his word. And this is why I pray for your soul.


[citation needed]


And just to make it an official direct question:  where is your proof that this version is the correct translation?


Also, a clue (all it a gift from me to you):  if you join this board and spout shit like that, you're gonna have a bad time.  Like, really really bad.  I'm pegging you at either Baptist or AoG, which is it?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Mechtaur on November 16, 2012, 12:16:54 pm
And therin is your problem. The 1611 King James Holy Bible is the literal infallible word of God. You cannot trust in God while making a mockery of his word. And this is why I pray for your soul.


Congrats, you just made me have a laugh I haven't had in a while.

Oh, and Rinella, don't worry. When I said I was going to have some fun with this, I meant more with this guy than you. I just know you won't scream "Praise Jesus" with every other breathe.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: SugarfreeJazz on November 16, 2012, 12:17:23 pm
I'm not ignoring the posts. I don't have much time therefore I respond to the points that I can.

If you are asked a direct question on this board you must answer. Your answer may be: addressing the question; you may say you do not want to answer, but you need to explain why; or you may leave the thread knowing you can not respond to points you find most convenient while avoiding others.

You are not alone in being busy, Pastor. That excuse doesn't really carry much weight as you decided to post here in the first place. Understand?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 16, 2012, 12:27:38 pm
I'm not ignoring the posts. I don't have much time therefore I respond to the points that I can.

And he ignores the entire rest of my post and my argument! Ladies and gentlemen, exhibit A.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 12:41:19 pm
I'm not ignoring the posts. I don't have much time therefore I respond to the points that I can.

Close, buddy. "Let me look at that and for accompanying verses. I'll get back to you." Boom, post answered. No, what you did is answer only the posts you wanted to, namely you went Catholic bashing, and claimed it was because you are pressed for time. What you did is say disparaging Roman Catholics is a higher priority. Good to know. It's been a while since we've had a chew toy.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 01:16:22 pm
Quote
you went Catholic bashing
,Catholic bashing? That's like bashing muggers and drunk drivers. Yes I AM vehemently Anti-Catholic as if you could not tell.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 16, 2012, 01:18:44 pm
Quote
you went Catholic bashing
,Catholic bashing? That's like bashing muggers and drunk drivers. Yes I AM vehemently Anti-Catholic as if you could not tell.

Please, elaborate on this point. I will enjoy making my history major useful.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 16, 2012, 01:19:34 pm
Quote
you went Catholic bashing
,Catholic bashing? That's like bashing muggers and drunk drivers. Yes I AM vehemently Anti-Catholic as if you could not tell.

Catholicism isn't quite the same as drunk driving or muggers. They kill people and rob them. We just disagree with you.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 01:42:59 pm
Quote
you went Catholic bashing
,Catholic bashing? That's like bashing muggers and drunk drivers. Yes I AM vehemently Anti-Catholic as if you could not tell.

Catholicism isn't quite the same as drunk driving or muggers. They kill people and rob them. We just disagree with you.
The Catholic Church has a long history of robbery, murder, and genocide. The criminal history on the papacy is well documented and my comparison is actually understated.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 16, 2012, 01:48:20 pm
Quote
you went Catholic bashing
,Catholic bashing? That's like bashing muggers and drunk drivers. Yes I AM vehemently Anti-Catholic as if you could not tell.

Catholicism isn't quite the same as drunk driving or muggers. They kill people and rob them. We just disagree with you.
The Catholic Church has a long history of robbery, murder, and genocide. The criminal history on the papacy is well documented and my comparison is actually understated.

Because Protestantism has never committed genocide or murder or robbery. Not ever.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 01:48:43 pm
The papacy also has a long history of ecumenism and noble giving. It depends on the Pope, because they are people. People during the 1200-1600s turned the Papacy into a position of physical power instead of spiritual, and the reformation drove the need for the Papacy to return to being, well, a decent individual in that seat. Luther and Calvin wanted to reform the church from Within, their followers created the split.

Just to get this out now. Pope=/=Catholic, Infallible, Emperor.

Quote
you went Catholic bashing
,Catholic bashing? That's like bashing muggers and drunk drivers. Yes I AM vehemently Anti-Catholic as if you could not tell.

Are you for real?

Are you? I just. I've never met someone in my life some vehemently viral to those whom he doesn't agree with.

I mean, I've met protestants before. Once I cleared up the whole "We don't worship Mary and Saints" Thing they were perfectly happy to get along with me. A nice ecumenical moment brought to you by understanding and not having blinders on.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 16, 2012, 01:48:50 pm
Quote
you went Catholic bashing
,Catholic bashing? That's like bashing muggers and drunk drivers. Yes I AM vehemently Anti-Catholic as if you could not tell.

Catholicism isn't quite the same as drunk driving or muggers. They kill people and rob them. We just disagree with you.
The Catholic Church has a long history of robbery, murder, and genocide. The criminal history on the papacy is well documented and my comparison is actually understated.

The institution's not perfect, I'll grant that. No major institution that has existed for hundreds of years on end is without it's past atrocities, and it's not perfect now either. But being Catholic shouldn't mean I am responsible for those actions. I had nothing to do with them.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 01:50:22 pm
Quote
you went Catholic bashing
,Catholic bashing? That's like bashing muggers and drunk drivers. Yes I AM vehemently Anti-Catholic as if you could not tell.

Catholicism isn't quite the same as drunk driving or muggers. They kill people and rob them. We just disagree with you.
The Catholic Church has a long history of robbery, murder, and genocide. The criminal history on the papacy is well documented and my comparison is actually understated.

Because Protestantism has never committed genocide or murder or robbery. Not ever.
Being as Protestantism is infallible this statement is moot.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: SugarfreeJazz on November 16, 2012, 01:53:57 pm
Quote
you went Catholic bashing
,Catholic bashing? That's like bashing muggers and drunk drivers. Yes I AM vehemently Anti-Catholic as if you could not tell.

Catholicism isn't quite the same as drunk driving or muggers. They kill people and rob them. We just disagree with you.
The Catholic Church has a long history of robbery, murder, and genocide. The criminal history on the papacy is well documented and my comparison is actually understated.

Because Protestantism has never committed genocide or murder or robbery. Not ever.
Being as Protestantism is infallible then statement is moot.

Provide evidence that it is infallible that does not use circular reasoning. If you want to successfully argue your point you must back it up with something of substance.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 01:56:30 pm
Quote
you went Catholic bashing
,Catholic bashing? That's like bashing muggers and drunk drivers. Yes I AM vehemently Anti-Catholic as if you could not tell.

Catholicism isn't quite the same as drunk driving or muggers. They kill people and rob them. We just disagree with you.
The Catholic Church has a long history of robbery, murder, and genocide. The criminal history on the papacy is well documented and my comparison is actually understated.

Because Protestantism has never committed genocide or murder or robbery. Not ever.
Being as Protestantism is infallible then statement is moot.

Provide evidence that it is infallible that does not use circular reasoning. If you want to successfully argue your point you must back it up with something of substance.
God has backed it up with the 1611 KJV Bible. Clear is day at least for the non-heathen anyway.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 01:58:06 pm
Quote
I trust in God with all my heart, but that doesn't mean I have to slavishly obey a book written thousands of years ago halfway across the world, in a language I can neither speak nor read, by men who lived in a patriarchal, militaristic theocracy. God's world has changed and grown, and as His follower I must change and grow with it.
And therin is your problem. The 1611 King James Holy Bible is the literal infallible word of God. You cannot trust in God while making a mockery of his word. And this is why I pray for your soul.


[citation needed]


And just to make it an official direct question:  where is your proof that this version is the correct translation?


Also, a clue (all it a gift from me to you):  if you join this board and spout shit like that, you're gonna have a bad time.  Like, really really bad.  I'm pegging you at either Baptist or AoG, which is it?


Attention Pastor Dave

There are two (2) direct questions in the quote above.  This was posted prior to your last return to the threads.  I expect that these will be answered in some fashion.

According to board rules, which you are expected to know prior to posting, when asked a direct question, you must answer.  While you may not have actually read the board rules (nor the bible, if your current postings are any indication), this rule has now been pointed out at least three (3) times for you.

I require answers to these questions, and I am completely open in the fact that I am attempting to nail you down on a few things prior to debating you in earnest (namely, whether you are for real or if you are just a troll who thinks they are clever). 
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: SugarfreeJazz on November 16, 2012, 02:01:00 pm
Ad hom to avoid making a point and circular reasoning in one post.

Now really, present your evidence and try to make some sort of well thought argument. I'm giving you an open forum to educate on your belief system, and you're just being lazy and childish.


Edit: typo
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Star Cluster on November 16, 2012, 02:01:45 pm
Being as Protestantism is infallible this statement is moot.

You actually just made this statement?  And in all seriousness, I presume? 

Sorry, but you just proved yourself to be a troll.  Not that you've said anything worthwhile up to this point, but you have just lost any semblance of credibility you may have hoped to have with this statement.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 02:03:08 pm
Quote
you went Catholic bashing
,Catholic bashing? That's like bashing muggers and drunk drivers. Yes I AM vehemently Anti-Catholic as if you could not tell.

Catholicism isn't quite the same as drunk driving or muggers. They kill people and rob them. We just disagree with you.
The Catholic Church has a long history of robbery, murder, and genocide. The criminal history on the papacy is well documented and my comparison is actually understated.
(http://atheiststoday.com/images/kkk_jesus_saves.gif)

Look familiar? All Protestants.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 02:04:11 pm
Quote
you went Catholic bashing
,Catholic bashing? That's like bashing muggers and drunk drivers. Yes I AM vehemently Anti-Catholic as if you could not tell.

Catholicism isn't quite the same as drunk driving or muggers. They kill people and rob them. We just disagree with you.
The Catholic Church has a long history of robbery, murder, and genocide. The criminal history on the papacy is well documented and my comparison is actually understated.
(http://atheiststoday.com/images/kkk_jesus_saves.gif)

Look familiar? All Protestants.

Not only Protestants, but actively interested in running those filthy Catholics out of the South....
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: SugarfreeJazz on November 16, 2012, 02:05:26 pm
Incoming No True Scotsman fallacy in 3…2…
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 02:05:40 pm
Quote
you went Catholic bashing
,Catholic bashing? That's like bashing muggers and drunk drivers. Yes I AM vehemently Anti-Catholic as if you could not tell.

Catholicism isn't quite the same as drunk driving or muggers. They kill people and rob them. We just disagree with you.
The Catholic Church has a long history of robbery, murder, and genocide. The criminal history on the papacy is well documented and my comparison is actually understated.

Because Protestantism has never committed genocide or murder or robbery. Not ever.
Being as Protestantism is infallible then statement is moot.

Provide evidence that it is infallible that does not use circular reasoning. If you want to successfully argue your point you must back it up with something of substance.
God has backed it up with the 1611 KJV Bible. Clear is day at least for the non-heathen anyway.
So Protestantism is infallible because the Protestant version of the Bible says so?...
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 02:12:46 pm
Quote
I trust in God with all my heart, but that doesn't mean I have to slavishly obey a book written thousands of years ago halfway across the world, in a language I can neither speak nor read, by men who lived in a patriarchal, militaristic theocracy. God's world has changed and grown, and as His follower I must change and grow with it.
And therin is your problem. The 1611 King James Holy Bible is the literal infallible word of God. You cannot trust in God while making a mockery of his word. And this is why I pray for your soul.


[citation needed]


And just to make it an official direct question:  where is your proof that this version is the correct translation?


Also, a clue (all it a gift from me to you):  if you join this board and spout shit like that, you're gonna have a bad time.  Like, really really bad.  I'm pegging you at either Baptist or AoG, which is it?


Attention Pastor Dave

There are two (2) direct questions in the quote above.  This was posted prior to your last return to the threads.  I expect that these will be answered in some fashion.

According to board rules, which you are expected to know prior to posting, when asked a direct question, you must answer.  While you may not have actually read the board rules (nor the bible, if your current postings are any indication), this rule has now been pointed out at least three (3) times for you.

I require answers to these questions, and I am completely open in the fact that I am attempting to nail you down on a few things prior to debating you in earnest (namely, whether you are for real or if you are just a troll who thinks they are clever). 
        Satan is the author of confusion, remember that. If Satan can't get you to deny the Scriptures, then he'll try to get you to doubt the Scriptures. If Satan can't get you to deny or doubt the Scriptures, then he'll try to confuse you concerning “which Bible” to use. The 1611 King James Bible is God's inspired, infallible, inerrant, impeccable and preserved Words of God. That's what it is. We have God's inspired Words in the English-speaking language, without error. I fully realize that most King James Bibles published today are based upon the 1769 Oxford text (an edition of the 1611 version). The authorized 1611 King James Version has never been revised, only edited. The main purpose of the 1762 and 1769 editions was the standardization of spelling. This in no way altered the meaning or preservation or inspiration of the 1611 King James Bible. We can trust our 1611 King James Bible.
The false prophets who say that the King James Bible is not inerrant, also embrace the modern corrupt versions (such as the New International Version) as being God's Word too. They view all Bibles as being inferior and inerrant; but anyone with a brain can see that all of the modern Bible versions ATTACK the deity of Jesus Christ. As for your second question I am a Independent fundamentalist Baptist that proudly brandishes the sword of the Lord.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 16, 2012, 02:15:42 pm
As for your second question I am a Independent fundamentalist Baptist that proudly brandishes the sword or the Lord.

I realize that it's a typo, but I'm picturing a dude trying to hit you with a dead Jesus.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 02:18:53 pm
How do you know its true? It has literally 1611 years removal from Jesus. It's in a completely foreign language and was translated from the Greek (Not Aramaic) bibles. One thing that really lends Catholics credibility on this subject is because they tend to admit that most of the books were written after the fact and most weren't eyewitness. With some debate over Saint John the Divine supposedly 100 year life and Mark being really young child follower of Jesus at the time. Also... you said Saints are Evil. If Saint John the Divine is evil, you called the Gospel of John AND Revelation evil. Trying to contain my mockery laughter is hard.

I'd prefer to have my sword made of steel and then tempered with the Holy Spirit, personally. I shall then put on my white cross and batwing helmet, and ride you down as a Teutonic Knight, you Heretic!

Reminds me trying to argue with my roommate about the Bible and belief structures when he approaches it like a fundie Protestant and I approach it as a Liberal Catholic. I use a different bible, have a vastly different tradition, and was much more deeply embedded than him. I'm an agnostic and he's an atheist, but still. Though he's also one of those people who believes all his opinions to be facts and all his assumed knowledge to be facts.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 02:21:22 pm
Anyways, Pastor Dave, I have a question for you. You brought up Hebrews 13:4, which says "Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge" Awesome! But the problem is it does little to address the original question. See, being a whore means trading some sort of goods or services in exchange for sex. And adultery means at least one person in the relationship is married. But what the original question is talking about is premarital and (I'm assuming) with no thought to any kind of payment. Your verse did mention marriage is honorable, but it said nothing at all about premarriage. If you could address that, please, I'd like to hear your thoughts.

Earlier this morning, a couple pages ago, I brought this up. Looking back, there are no question marks there. Mea Culpa. But we can fix that right now. How does Hebrews 13:4 (which you brought up and I'm using your quote text for) deal with premarital sex?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 02:24:07 pm
How do you know its true? It has literally 1611 years removal from Jesus. It's in a completely foreign language and was translated from the Greek (Not Aramaic) bibles. One thing that really lends Catholics credibility on this subject is because they tend to admit that most of the books were written after the fact and most weren't eyewitness. With some debate over Saint John the Divine supposedly 100 year life and Mark being really young child follower of Jesus at the time. Also... you said Saints are Evil. If Saint John the Divine is evil, you called the Gospel of John AND Revelation evil. Trying to contain my mockery laughter is hard.

I'd prefer to have my sword made of steel and then tempered with the Holy Spirit, personally. I shall then put on my white cross and batwing helmet, and ride you down as a Teutonic Knight, you Heretic!

Reminds me trying to argue with my roommate about the Bible and belief structures when he approaches it like a fundie Protestant and I approach it as a Liberal Catholic. I use a different bible, have a vastly different tradition, and was much more deeply embedded than him. I'm an agnostic and he's an atheist, but still. Though he's also one of those people who believes all his opinions to be facts and all his assumed knowledge to be facts.
It's true because it is the true written word of the Lord, It's all right there, just open your eyes and heart. My opinions are not opinions, they are a truth that you will one day be faced with.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 02:28:25 pm
How do you know its true? It has literally 1611 years removal from Jesus. It's in a completely foreign language and was translated from the Greek (Not Aramaic) bibles. One thing that really lends Catholics credibility on this subject is because they tend to admit that most of the books were written after the fact and most weren't eyewitness. With some debate over Saint John the Divine supposedly 100 year life and Mark being really young child follower of Jesus at the time. Also... you said Saints are Evil. If Saint John the Divine is evil, you called the Gospel of John AND Revelation evil. Trying to contain my mockery laughter is hard.

I'd prefer to have my sword made of steel and then tempered with the Holy Spirit, personally. I shall then put on my white cross and batwing helmet, and ride you down as a Teutonic Knight, you Heretic!

Reminds me trying to argue with my roommate about the Bible and belief structures when he approaches it like a fundie Protestant and I approach it as a Liberal Catholic. I use a different bible, have a vastly different tradition, and was much more deeply embedded than him. I'm an agnostic and he's an atheist, but still. Though he's also one of those people who believes all his opinions to be facts and all his assumed knowledge to be facts.
It's true because it is the true written word of the Lord, It's all right there, just open your eyes and heart. My opinions are not opinions, they are a truth that you will one day be faced with.

That is circular logic. Circular Logic. CIRCULAR LOGIC. Stop being like a snake devouring its own tail.

Some English guys who decided it'd be nice if divorce was a little more liberal are the deciding factors of who the written word of the lord is! Anglicans are barely Protestants! They separated because the King wanted more power! Yet they are the ones to write the true written word of the Lord? 1611 years after Jesus? This doesn't make sense theologically nor does it make sense logically.

I'm sorry to get aggressive, but your stupidity is making me angry.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 02:29:45 pm
How do you know its true? It has literally 1611 years removal from Jesus. It's in a completely foreign language and was translated from the Greek (Not Aramaic) bibles. One thing that really lends Catholics credibility on this subject is because they tend to admit that most of the books were written after the fact and most weren't eyewitness. With some debate over Saint John the Divine supposedly 100 year life and Mark being really young child follower of Jesus at the time. Also... you said Saints are Evil. If Saint John the Divine is evil, you called the Gospel of John AND Revelation evil. Trying to contain my mockery laughter is hard.

I'd prefer to have my sword made of steel and then tempered with the Holy Spirit, personally. I shall then put on my white cross and batwing helmet, and ride you down as a Teutonic Knight, you Heretic!

Reminds me trying to argue with my roommate about the Bible and belief structures when he approaches it like a fundie Protestant and I approach it as a Liberal Catholic. I use a different bible, have a vastly different tradition, and was much more deeply embedded than him. I'm an agnostic and he's an atheist, but still. Though he's also one of those people who believes all his opinions to be facts and all his assumed knowledge to be facts.
It's true because it is the true written word of the Lord, It's all right there, just open your eyes and heart. My opinions are not opinions, they are a truth that you will one day be faced with.

Circular logic is perfectly circular!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 16, 2012, 02:31:25 pm
Who called the troll a whole five pages ago? Moi.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 02:32:31 pm
Who called the troll a whole five pages ago? Moi.

I agree, true. I let it pass for a while. But the urge to educate the ignorant is sometimes overriding of my good sense.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 02:32:52 pm
Quote
I trust in God with all my heart, but that doesn't mean I have to slavishly obey a book written thousands of years ago halfway across the world, in a language I can neither speak nor read, by men who lived in a patriarchal, militaristic theocracy. God's world has changed and grown, and as His follower I must change and grow with it.
And therin is your problem. The 1611 King James Holy Bible is the literal infallible word of God. You cannot trust in God while making a mockery of his word. And this is why I pray for your soul.


[citation needed]


And just to make it an official direct question:  where is your proof that this version is the correct translation?


Also, a clue (all it a gift from me to you):  if you join this board and spout shit like that, you're gonna have a bad time.  Like, really really bad.  I'm pegging you at either Baptist or AoG, which is it?


Attention Pastor Dave

There are two (2) direct questions in the quote above.  This was posted prior to your last return to the threads.  I expect that these will be answered in some fashion.

According to board rules, which you are expected to know prior to posting, when asked a direct question, you must answer.  While you may not have actually read the board rules (nor the bible, if your current postings are any indication), this rule has now been pointed out at least three (3) times for you.

I require answers to these questions, and I am completely open in the fact that I am attempting to nail you down on a few things prior to debating you in earnest (namely, whether you are for real or if you are just a troll who thinks they are clever). 
        Satan is the author of confusion, remember that. If Satan can't get you to deny the Scriptures, then he'll try to get you to doubt the Scriptures. If Satan can't get you to deny or doubt the Scriptures, then he'll try to confuse you concerning “which Bible” to use. The 1611 King James Bible is God's inspired, infallible, inerrant, impeccable and preserved Words of God. That's what it is. We have God's inspired Words in the English-speaking language, without error. I fully realize that most King James Bibles published today are based upon the 1769 Oxford text (an edition of the 1611 version). The authorized 1611 King James Version has never been revised, only edited. The main purpose of the 1762 and 1769 editions was the standardization of spelling. This in no way altered the meaning or preservation or inspiration of the 1611 King James Bible. We can trust our 1611 King James Bible.
The false prophets who say that the King James Bible is not inerrant, also embrace the modern corrupt versions (such as the New International Version) as being God's Word too. They view all Bibles as being inferior and inerrant; but anyone with a brain can see that all of the modern Bible versions ATTACK the deity of Jesus Christ. As for your second question I am a Independent fundamentalist Baptist that proudly brandishes the sword of the Lord.

You're a troll.  This is proof right here.  This is the exact over top wording that trolls who are trying to emulate fundies use.

No Baptist who is actually attempting to convert people would actually say (or type) this line of reasoning.

Nice try.  Little hint, next time just ignore the people who are trying to nail you down and take the ban.  It's only for a week or so, you can actually get by with the trolling for a good month or so before the account is banned for a year.

Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 02:33:49 pm
Anyways, Pastor Dave, I have a question for you. You brought up Hebrews 13:4, which says "Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge" Awesome! But the problem is it does little to address the original question. See, being a whore means trading some sort of goods or services in exchange for sex. And adultery means at least one person in the relationship is married. But what the original question is talking about is premarital and (I'm assuming) with no thought to any kind of payment. Your verse did mention marriage is honorable, but it said nothing at all about premarriage. If you could address that, please, I'd like to hear your thoughts.
Quote
Mariage is honorable in all, and the bed vndefiled: but whoremongers, and adulterers God will iudge.
Marriage is the ONLY honorable institution where sex can take place. Outside of a holy union of a Man and a Woman it is debaucherous fornication which is a sin. God will judge those who indulge in pre-marital sex just as he judges whoremongers and adulterers. This is what this passage means.



Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 02:37:47 pm
Anyways, Pastor Dave, I have a question for you. You brought up Hebrews 13:4, which says "Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge" Awesome! But the problem is it does little to address the original question. See, being a whore means trading some sort of goods or services in exchange for sex. And adultery means at least one person in the relationship is married. But what the original question is talking about is premarital and (I'm assuming) with no thought to any kind of payment. Your verse did mention marriage is honorable, but it said nothing at all about premarriage. If you could address that, please, I'd like to hear your thoughts.

Earlier this morning, a couple pages ago, I brought this up. Looking back, there are no question marks there. Mea Culpa. But we can fix that right now. How does Hebrews 13:4 (which you brought up and I'm using your quote text for) deal with premarital sex?

Whoremongering is actually the chasing or use of whores.  This does not detract from or change the original question or point in any fashion.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 02:40:39 pm
How do you know its true? It has literally 1611 years removal from Jesus. It's in a completely foreign language and was translated from the Greek (Not Aramaic) bibles. One thing that really lends Catholics credibility on this subject is because they tend to admit that most of the books were written after the fact and most weren't eyewitness. With some debate over Saint John the Divine supposedly 100 year life and Mark being really young child follower of Jesus at the time. Also... you said Saints are Evil. If Saint John the Divine is evil, you called the Gospel of John AND Revelation evil. Trying to contain my mockery laughter is hard.

I'd prefer to have my sword made of steel and then tempered with the Holy Spirit, personally. I shall then put on my white cross and batwing helmet, and ride you down as a Teutonic Knight, you Heretic!

Reminds me trying to argue with my roommate about the Bible and belief structures when he approaches it like a fundie Protestant and I approach it as a Liberal Catholic. I use a different bible, have a vastly different tradition, and was much more deeply embedded than him. I'm an agnostic and he's an atheist, but still. Though he's also one of those people who believes all his opinions to be facts and all his assumed knowledge to be facts.
It's true because it is the true written word of the Lord, It's all right there, just open your eyes and heart. My opinions are not opinions, they are a truth that you will one day be faced with.
But all you're doing is saying something is true and then, when asked why it's true, repeatedly insisting that it is true. Repeating an assertion is neither an argument nor is it evidence.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 02:41:34 pm
Quote
I trust in God with all my heart, but that doesn't mean I have to slavishly obey a book written thousands of years ago halfway across the world, in a language I can neither speak nor read, by men who lived in a patriarchal, militaristic theocracy. God's world has changed and grown, and as His follower I must change and grow with it.
And therin is your problem. The 1611 King James Holy Bible is the literal infallible word of God. You cannot trust in God while making a mockery of his word. And this is why I pray for your soul.


[citation needed]


And just to make it an official direct question:  where is your proof that this version is the correct translation?


Also, a clue (all it a gift from me to you):  if you join this board and spout shit like that, you're gonna have a bad time.  Like, really really bad.  I'm pegging you at either Baptist or AoG, which is it?


Attention Pastor Dave

There are two (2) direct questions in the quote above.  This was posted prior to your last return to the threads.  I expect that these will be answered in some fashion.

According to board rules, which you are expected to know prior to posting, when asked a direct question, you must answer.  While you may not have actually read the board rules (nor the bible, if your current postings are any indication), this rule has now been pointed out at least three (3) times for you.

I require answers to these questions, and I am completely open in the fact that I am attempting to nail you down on a few things prior to debating you in earnest (namely, whether you are for real or if you are just a troll who thinks they are clever). 
        Satan is the author of confusion, remember that. If Satan can't get you to deny the Scriptures, then he'll try to get you to doubt the Scriptures. If Satan can't get you to deny or doubt the Scriptures, then he'll try to confuse you concerning “which Bible” to use. The 1611 King James Bible is God's inspired, infallible, inerrant, impeccable and preserved Words of God. That's what it is. We have God's inspired Words in the English-speaking language, without error. I fully realize that most King James Bibles published today are based upon the 1769 Oxford text (an edition of the 1611 version). The authorized 1611 King James Version has never been revised, only edited. The main purpose of the 1762 and 1769 editions was the standardization of spelling. This in no way altered the meaning or preservation or inspiration of the 1611 King James Bible. We can trust our 1611 King James Bible.
The false prophets who say that the King James Bible is not inerrant, also embrace the modern corrupt versions (such as the New International Version) as being God's Word too. They view all Bibles as being inferior and inerrant; but anyone with a brain can see that all of the modern Bible versions ATTACK the deity of Jesus Christ. As for your second question I am a Independent fundamentalist Baptist that proudly brandishes the sword of the Lord.

You're a troll.  This is proof right here.  This is the exact over top wording that trolls who are trying to emulate fundies use.

No Baptist who is actually attempting to convert people would actually say (or type) this line of reasoning.

Nice try.  Little hint, next time just ignore the people who are trying to nail you down and take the ban.  It's only for a week or so, you can actually get by with the trolling for a good month or so before the account is banned for a year.
You can shoot the messenger all you would like however you cant destroy the message. My child posted here at one time. Thats why I am here. My child fell into the pitfall of drugs and pre-marital sex and this cesspool called a forum is symptom of the problem. If I can save one soul here then the Lord will be pleased.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 02:41:58 pm
That's not what it says. It says the marriage bed is honorably in all. If you're married to each other, go nuts. It says whoremongers and adulterers God will judge. So buying and selling sex is out. As is cheating on one's spouse. It doesn't say a damn thing about sex where two people aren't married and who aren't paying. Marriage is honorable in all. Not Only marriage is honorable. Stop putting words in God's mouth.

Hold up. Are you implying that we drove your child into drugs and premarital sex? Direct question and I want a direct answer right fast.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 02:42:43 pm
Who is this "Child?"
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 02:44:39 pm
Quote
I trust in God with all my heart, but that doesn't mean I have to slavishly obey a book written thousands of years ago halfway across the world, in a language I can neither speak nor read, by men who lived in a patriarchal, militaristic theocracy. God's world has changed and grown, and as His follower I must change and grow with it.
And therin is your problem. The 1611 King James Holy Bible is the literal infallible word of God. You cannot trust in God while making a mockery of his word. And this is why I pray for your soul.


[citation needed]


And just to make it an official direct question:  where is your proof that this version is the correct translation?


Also, a clue (all it a gift from me to you):  if you join this board and spout shit like that, you're gonna have a bad time.  Like, really really bad.  I'm pegging you at either Baptist or AoG, which is it?


Attention Pastor Dave

There are two (2) direct questions in the quote above.  This was posted prior to your last return to the threads.  I expect that these will be answered in some fashion.

According to board rules, which you are expected to know prior to posting, when asked a direct question, you must answer.  While you may not have actually read the board rules (nor the bible, if your current postings are any indication), this rule has now been pointed out at least three (3) times for you.

I require answers to these questions, and I am completely open in the fact that I am attempting to nail you down on a few things prior to debating you in earnest (namely, whether you are for real or if you are just a troll who thinks they are clever). 
        Satan is the author of confusion, remember that. If Satan can't get you to deny the Scriptures, then he'll try to get you to doubt the Scriptures. If Satan can't get you to deny or doubt the Scriptures, then he'll try to confuse you concerning “which Bible” to use. The 1611 King James Bible is God's inspired, infallible, inerrant, impeccable and preserved Words of God. That's what it is. We have God's inspired Words in the English-speaking language, without error. I fully realize that most King James Bibles published today are based upon the 1769 Oxford text (an edition of the 1611 version). The authorized 1611 King James Version has never been revised, only edited. The main purpose of the 1762 and 1769 editions was the standardization of spelling. This in no way altered the meaning or preservation or inspiration of the 1611 King James Bible. We can trust our 1611 King James Bible.
The false prophets who say that the King James Bible is not inerrant, also embrace the modern corrupt versions (such as the New International Version) as being God's Word too. They view all Bibles as being inferior and inerrant; but anyone with a brain can see that all of the modern Bible versions ATTACK the deity of Jesus Christ. As for your second question I am a Independent fundamentalist Baptist that proudly brandishes the sword of the Lord.

You're a troll.  This is proof right here.  This is the exact over top wording that trolls who are trying to emulate fundies use.

No Baptist who is actually attempting to convert people would actually say (or type) this line of reasoning.

Nice try.  Little hint, next time just ignore the people who are trying to nail you down and take the ban.  It's only for a week or so, you can actually get by with the trolling for a good month or so before the account is banned for a year.
You can shoot the messenger all you would like however you cant destroy the message. My child posted here at one time. Thats why I am here. My child fell into the pitfall of drugs and pre-marital sex and this cesspool called a forum is symptom of the problem. If I can save one soul here then the Lord will be pleased.

Lying is a sin.  Not only that, but it also breaks the 9th commandment.  You are lying because you are lying.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 02:44:44 pm
Who called the troll a whole five pages ago? Moi.
I tried to give him a chance but you are indeed correct. Not only that, it's not nearly as much fun as I anticipated. Well, I know what time it is...

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Cbf7rnRp74c/TsWfFt8qEWI/AAAAAAAAAGI/BkIdnIb0Q-g/s1600/troll-spray.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 02:46:43 pm
I was hoping for a Nautical level debate thread.  Instead we got Skyfire.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 02:47:00 pm
Quote
I trust in God with all my heart, but that doesn't mean I have to slavishly obey a book written thousands of years ago halfway across the world, in a language I can neither speak nor read, by men who lived in a patriarchal, militaristic theocracy. God's world has changed and grown, and as His follower I must change and grow with it.
And therin is your problem. The 1611 King James Holy Bible is the literal infallible word of God. You cannot trust in God while making a mockery of his word. And this is why I pray for your soul.


[citation needed]


And just to make it an official direct question:  where is your proof that this version is the correct translation?


Also, a clue (all it a gift from me to you):  if you join this board and spout shit like that, you're gonna have a bad time.  Like, really really bad.  I'm pegging you at either Baptist or AoG, which is it?


Attention Pastor Dave

There are two (2) direct questions in the quote above.  This was posted prior to your last return to the threads.  I expect that these will be answered in some fashion.

According to board rules, which you are expected to know prior to posting, when asked a direct question, you must answer.  While you may not have actually read the board rules (nor the bible, if your current postings are any indication), this rule has now been pointed out at least three (3) times for you.

I require answers to these questions, and I am completely open in the fact that I am attempting to nail you down on a few things prior to debating you in earnest (namely, whether you are for real or if you are just a troll who thinks they are clever). 
        Satan is the author of confusion, remember that. If Satan can't get you to deny the Scriptures, then he'll try to get you to doubt the Scriptures. If Satan can't get you to deny or doubt the Scriptures, then he'll try to confuse you concerning “which Bible” to use. The 1611 King James Bible is God's inspired, infallible, inerrant, impeccable and preserved Words of God. That's what it is. We have God's inspired Words in the English-speaking language, without error. I fully realize that most King James Bibles published today are based upon the 1769 Oxford text (an edition of the 1611 version). The authorized 1611 King James Version has never been revised, only edited. The main purpose of the 1762 and 1769 editions was the standardization of spelling. This in no way altered the meaning or preservation or inspiration of the 1611 King James Bible. We can trust our 1611 King James Bible.
The false prophets who say that the King James Bible is not inerrant, also embrace the modern corrupt versions (such as the New International Version) as being God's Word too. They view all Bibles as being inferior and inerrant; but anyone with a brain can see that all of the modern Bible versions ATTACK the deity of Jesus Christ. As for your second question I am a Independent fundamentalist Baptist that proudly brandishes the sword of the Lord.

You're a troll.  This is proof right here.  This is the exact over top wording that trolls who are trying to emulate fundies use.

No Baptist who is actually attempting to convert people would actually say (or type) this line of reasoning.

Nice try.  Little hint, next time just ignore the people who are trying to nail you down and take the ban.  It's only for a week or so, you can actually get by with the trolling for a good month or so before the account is banned for a year.
You can shoot the messenger all you would like however you cant destroy the message. My child posted here at one time. Thats why I am here. My child fell into the pitfall of drugs and pre-marital sex and this cesspool called a forum is symptom of the problem. If I can save one soul here then the Lord will be pleased.
I won't call you a liar but I will post this picture of Homer Simpson with his pants on fire:
(http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6889zvJNz1ryqf9po1_400.gif)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 02:47:59 pm
Nothing here but liberal, drug using, Atheists and Catholics who voted for Obama. Cesspool of society. Repent and accept Jesus.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 02:49:27 pm
Yeah, cause that's how you get people to believe you. I wish if it was a Troll, he was attempting to be good at being a Troll.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 02:49:34 pm
Who is this "Child?"
Michael McDoesntexist.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 02:49:45 pm
Nothing here but liberal, drug using, Atheists and Catholics who voted for Obama. Cesspool of society. Repent and accept Jesus.

Voted??

Them's fightin words!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 02:50:30 pm
Nothing here but liberal, drug using, Atheists and Catholics who voted for Obama. Cesspool of society. Repent and accept Jesus.
Just as soon as you accept Satan.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 02:51:37 pm
Who is this "Child?"
Michael McDoesntexist.

I was making that assumption, but I was going to like the Ouroborus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ouroboros) Can disentangle itself.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 02:53:59 pm
Nothing here but liberal, drug using, Atheists and Catholics who voted for Obama. Cesspool of society. Repent and accept Jesus.

No. You vote Democrat, use drugs, and accept the flying Spaghetti Monster as your very own personal savior before it's too late and the Samurai Cephelopod  reigns down his fiery justice!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 02:54:16 pm
Who is this "Child?"
Michael McDoesntexist.

I was making that assumption, but I was going to like the Ouroborus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ouroboros) Can disentangle itself.
He won't even make up a name, he'll just ignore you.

If we're going to get trolled I at least expect some entertainment value. This is pathetic.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 02:54:39 pm
Time to become a picture thread!

(http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p100/drburr/Confused.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 02:55:21 pm
It is no wonder why this forum is the subject of much hilarity over at EFF forum. Funny in a sad sort of way. Repent and accept Jesus.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 02:56:12 pm
This thread is now kittens.

(http://my10online.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Kittens-In-some-cups-animal-humor-45323_450_302.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Radiation on November 16, 2012, 02:57:23 pm
Quote
I trust in God with all my heart, but that doesn't mean I have to slavishly obey a book written thousands of years ago halfway across the world, in a language I can neither speak nor read, by men who lived in a patriarchal, militaristic theocracy. God's world has changed and grown, and as His follower I must change and grow with it.
And therin is your problem. The 1611 King James Holy Bible is the literal infallible word of God. You cannot trust in God while making a mockery of his word. And this is why I pray for your soul.


[citation needed]


And just to make it an official direct question:  where is your proof that this version is the correct translation?


Also, a clue (all it a gift from me to you):  if you join this board and spout shit like that, you're gonna have a bad time.  Like, really really bad.  I'm pegging you at either Baptist or AoG, which is it?


Attention Pastor Dave

There are two (2) direct questions in the quote above.  This was posted prior to your last return to the threads.  I expect that these will be answered in some fashion.

According to board rules, which you are expected to know prior to posting, when asked a direct question, you must answer.  While you may not have actually read the board rules (nor the bible, if your current postings are any indication), this rule has now been pointed out at least three (3) times for you.

I require answers to these questions, and I am completely open in the fact that I am attempting to nail you down on a few things prior to debating you in earnest (namely, whether you are for real or if you are just a troll who thinks they are clever).

The rule as you are speaking of states:

Quote
Address the points given by others in as civil a manner as you can (i.e. with a minimum of flaming).
Address questions given to you, either by answering them or saying why you won't (such as "I don't know," "I'm not comfortable answering that," "it's personal and I don't feel it's your business," etc.).

Which he has violated as well as a few other rules.



Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 02:58:05 pm
It is no wonder why this forum is the subject of much hilarity over at EFF forum. Funny in a sad sort of way. Repent and accept Jesus.
EFF forum? Never heard of it.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 02:58:10 pm
It is no wonder why this forum is the subject of much hilarity over at EFF forum. Funny in a sad sort of way. Repent and accept Jesus.

WHen did the electronic Frontier Foundation gain a forum? And why does it hate us?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 02:59:31 pm
It is no wonder why this forum is the subject of much hilarity over at EFF forum. Funny in a sad sort of way. Repent and accept Jesus.

EFF?


Radiation - what's the rule on blatant trolling?

Rabbit, those kittens are too sweet

(http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p100/drburr/24.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: SugarfreeJazz on November 16, 2012, 03:01:14 pm
It is no wonder why this forum is the subject of much hilarity over at EFF forum. Funny in a sad sort of way. Repent and accept Jesus.

When you can't win a debate. Insult! No one will recognize your impotence!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 03:02:38 pm
Repent and accept Jesus.
I'M SORRY, PASTOR DAVE. I'M AFRAID I CAN'T DO THAT.

(http://www.netbrawl.com/uploads/b23b2d9e0348c7ea2b06212e37a65a8b.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 16, 2012, 03:02:54 pm
Nothing here but liberal, drug using, Atheists and Catholics who voted for Obama. Cesspool of society. Repent and accept Jesus.

Not actually a drug user, but thanks for playing.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 03:03:22 pm
This is relevant:

(http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p100/drburr/snaps_pope_john-paul-ii.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 03:04:13 pm
http://www.eff-clan.org/ It's a Star Wars fan site where I guess a pastor is kinda like being a Jedi master.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 03:04:30 pm
It is no wonder why this forum is the subject of much hilarity over at EFF forum. Funny in a sad sort of way. Repent and accept Jesus.

EFF?


Radiation - what's the rule on blatant trolling?

Rabbit, those kittens are too sweet

(http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p100/drburr/24.jpg)
Moar!

(http://oaklandanimalservices.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/cute-kittens.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 03:05:06 pm
http://www.eff-clan.org/ It's a Star Wars fan site.
So he's not a Baptist, he's a Sith Lord?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 16, 2012, 03:05:39 pm
Repent and accept Jesus.
I'M SORRY, PASTOR DAVE. I'M AFRAID I CAN'T DO THAT.

Sigged.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 16, 2012, 03:05:47 pm
I hope my posts have proven helpful, and that the Pastor hasn't turned any of you against me.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 03:06:09 pm
Just going through my old photobucket.  Kinda slim pickings

(http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p100/drburr/dog_owner_alert.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 03:06:40 pm
So he's not a Baptist, he's a Sith Lord?

Sigged
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: SugarfreeJazz on November 16, 2012, 03:08:05 pm
http://www.eff-clan.org/ It's a Star Wars fan site where I guess a pastor is kinda like being a Jedi master.

But where failing at trolling and debate is still failing.


Quote
So he's not a Baptist, he's a Sith Lord?

Only until the batteries run out on his sabers.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 16, 2012, 03:09:23 pm
http://www.eff-clan.org/ It's a Star Wars fan site.
So he's not a Baptist, he's a Sith Lord?

Clearly he was just made by the Presbyterian church. (http://winterson.com/2009/01/episode-iii-backstroke-of-west-redux.html)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 03:09:29 pm
I hope my posts have proven helpful, and that the Pastor hasn't turned any of you against me.
Pastor used logical fallacies? Must...crush...Catholicism...

Of course not, Rinella.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 03:10:23 pm
That's not the Pastor you're looking for.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 16, 2012, 03:10:55 pm
http://www.eff-clan.org/ It's a Star Wars fan site.
So he's not a Baptist, he's a Sith Lord?

Clearly he was just made by the Presbyterian church. (http://winterson.com/2009/01/episode-iii-backstroke-of-west-redux.html)

I think he comes from the planet of Landover.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 03:11:20 pm
So he's not a Baptist, he's a Sith Lord?

Sigged
Wow, I've already been quoted in signatures twice in one conversation.

(http://bbsimg.ngfiles.com/1/24195000/ngbbs50428c7193ce9.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 03:12:33 pm
So he's not a Baptist, he's a Sith Lord?

Sigged
Wow, I've already been quoted in signatures twice in one conversation.


Put your hand on your monitor.
That was your hi five.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 03:15:49 pm
So he's not a Baptist, he's a Sith Lord?

Sigged
Wow, I've already been quoted in signatures twice in one conversation.


Put your hand on your monitor.
That was your hi five.
Hooray!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 03:17:36 pm
(http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p100/drburr/internet_high_five-2496.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 03:20:57 pm
Repent and accept Jesus.
I'M SORRY, PASTOR DAVE. I'M AFRAID I CAN'T DO THAT.

Sigged.
This has also been a long time coming but we seem to agree on a fair amount of stuff so...

(http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/432/886/94d.gif)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 16, 2012, 03:22:26 pm
I kind of hope the preacher man stays around. It's fun having a free, self-posting strawman.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Radiation on November 16, 2012, 03:28:06 pm
These are the "don't be a dick" rules:

Quote
Don't be a dick.

    Do not make personal attacks outside of Flame & Burn.
    Do not make racist, sexist, or other attacks against a person's genetic or formative traits, or for their creed or beliefs.
    Keep name-calling to a minimum outside Flame & Burn.
    Do not make accusations about another person and call them facts without being able to back it up.
    Do not make a second account.
    Do not share your account.
    Address the points given by others in as civil a manner as you can (i.e. with a minimum of flaming).
    Address questions given to you, either by answering them or saying why you won't (such as "I don't know," "I'm not comfortable answering that," "it's personal and I don't feel it's your business," etc.).
    Do not persist on a point or question that another has said they won't address.
    Do not flame someone for ignorance on a topic or about another person's actions or posting habits.
    Do not make posts, or start a thread, with the intent to bait someone into a potentially rules violating response.
    If a discussion is spiralling out of control or rapidly derailing, either start a new thread on the topic (in Flame & Burn if necessary) or use PMs.
    Do not bring outside arguments with other users to the forum.
    When making a post, make sure to give an explanation or description of linked content, and to provide your own thoughts on said linked content. (Simply saying "Discuss," or similar is not acceptable, but asking for clarification on the content is permissible.)

Looking back on the thread, he has violated at least 8 of these rules. As for now, I can either move this to F&B, P&W or just lock the thread.



Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 03:36:44 pm
It is no wonder why this forum is the subject of much hilarity over at EFF forum. Funny in a sad sort of way. Repent and accept Jesus.

EFF?
 Evolution Fairytle Forum. Don't be obtuse.

Radiation - what's the rule on blatant trolling?

Rabbit, those kittens are too sweet

(http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p100/drburr/24.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 16, 2012, 03:38:08 pm
Well, someone doesn't understand how quotes work.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 03:38:54 pm
It is no wonder why this forum is the subject of much hilarity over at EFF forum. Funny in a sad sort of way. Repent and accept Jesus.

EFF?
 Evolution Fairytle Forum. Don't be obtuse.

Wait wait wait...you're from the same forum as the eye beams guy (http://www.fstdt.com/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=77098)? Okay, NOW this is funny! ;D

EDIT: There's enough stupid on that forum to fill a warehouse.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 03:42:59 pm
http://evolutionfairytale.com/forum//index.php?act=idx

I'm getting my boots on. There's a fair bit of high quality manure going on there.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 03:43:08 pm
Or how about this one:

Quote
So here is a problem for you. Which came first, the chicken or the egg. Now considering that the egg needs to be kept warm. And the parents have to take car of it. You know that the chicken has to be first. Which poses a huge problem for evolution. Because if the first chicken was born without an egg. Then why did reproduction using eggs start? Because survival of the fittest doe not apply because eggs can be eaten by other animals. And natural selection does not make sense about eggs. Through what process were eggs determined the better way? And why would egg reproduction start anyway? -ikester7579

Dafuq? :D
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 03:43:46 pm
Evolution Fairytle Forum. Don't be obtuse.

My wife tells me I'm acute.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 04:03:13 pm
Quote
Wait wait wait...you're from the same forum as the eye beams guy? Okay, NOW this is funny!

EDIT: There's enough stupid on thus forum to fill a warehouse.
Corrected for you.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: RinellaWasHere on November 16, 2012, 04:05:18 pm
Quote
Wait wait wait...you're from the same forum as the eye beams guy? Okay, NOW this is funny!

EDIT: There's enough stupid on thus forum to fill a warehouse.
Corrected for you.

AND HE MISSPELLED IT OH GOD I'M DYING.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 04:06:26 pm
Quote
Wait wait wait...you're from the same forum as the eye beams guy? Okay, NOW this is funny!

EDIT: There's enough stupid on thus forum to fill a warehouse.
Corrected for you.

Well, now it just doesn't make sense.  Good to see that Pasture Dave has a uniform posting strategy!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 04:10:39 pm
Quote
Wait wait wait...you're from the same forum as the eye beams guy? Okay, NOW this is funny!

EDIT: There's enough stupid on thus forum to fill a warehouse.
Corrected for you.

AND HE MISSPELLED IT OH GOD I'M DYING.

He's obviously giving you a break. You had a great run. Sit out a couple pages and let him take over. He'll go ahead and make fun of himself for a while. Thanks, Dave!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Saturn500 on November 16, 2012, 04:14:36 pm
Dave, if I may interject, trolling a forum filled with people happily living lifestyles which don't fit your worldview seems to be a sign of envy. In your envy of people who are actually happy- and whilist following so-called "deviant" lifestyles, no less- you attempt to make everyone here miserable, thus undoing the conflict people living happy lives without conforming to your worldview has with the idea that only fundies can be truly happy.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 04:21:32 pm
Quote
Dave, if I may interject, trolling a forum filled with people happily living lifestyles which don't fit your worldview seems to be a sign of envy. In your envy of people who are actually happy- and whilist following so-called "deviant" lifestyles, no less- you attempt to make everyone here miserable, thus undoing the conflict people living happy lives without conforming to your worldview has with the idea that only fundies can be truly happy.
Why would I envy foul mouthed filthy pigs who show no respect for themselves and even less love for Jesus.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: FirsthandTuna on November 16, 2012, 04:24:57 pm
Quote
Dave, if I may interject, trolling a forum filled with people happily living lifestyles which don't fit your worldview seems to be a sign of envy. In your envy of people who are actually happy- and whilist following so-called "deviant" lifestyles, no less- you attempt to make everyone here miserable, thus undoing the conflict people living happy lives without conforming to your worldview has with the idea that only fundies can be truly happy.
Why would I envy foul mouthed filthy pigs who show no respect for themselves and even less love for Jesus.
What? Why didn't you tell us that god's given you the power to see into the hearts and minds of forum posters?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 04:38:27 pm
Quote
Dave, if I may interject, trolling a forum filled with people happily living lifestyles which don't fit your worldview seems to be a sign of envy. In your envy of people who are actually happy- and whilist following so-called "deviant" lifestyles, no less- you attempt to make everyone here miserable, thus undoing the conflict people living happy lives without conforming to your worldview has with the idea that only fundies can be truly happy.
Why would I envy foul mouthed filthy pigs who show no respect for themselves and even less love for Jesus.

(http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p100/drburr/30259832.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Dakota Bob on November 16, 2012, 04:41:59 pm
Hey guys, am I late for something?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 04:44:38 pm
Quote
Wait wait wait...you're from the same forum as the eye beams guy? Okay, NOW this is funny!

EDIT: There's enough stupid on thus forum to fill a warehouse.
Corrected for you.

AND HE MISSPELLED IT OH GOD I'M DYING.
(http://dr1ve.files.wordpress.com/2012/07/laughing.gif)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 04:44:53 pm
Quote
What? Why didn't you tell us that god's given you the power to see into the hearts and minds of forum posters?
I apologize, now you know. This whole forum is devoted to mocking those who worship the lord Jesus Christ and adhere to Biblical truths like YEC. Pot meet kettle.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 04:46:20 pm
Quote
What? Why didn't you tell us that god's given you the power to see into the hearts and minds of forum posters?
I apologize, now you know. This whole forum is devoted to mocking those who worship the lord Jesus Christ and adhere to Biblical truths like YEC. Pot meet kettle.

Well, that's blatantly false.

Don't forget number 9, PD
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 04:46:46 pm
Quote
What? Why didn't you tell us that god's given you the power to see into the hearts and minds of forum posters?
I apologize, now you know. This whole forum is devoted to mocking those who worship the lord Jesus Christ and adhere to Biblical truths like YEC. Pot meet kettle.
Biblical truths? Isn't that like jumbo shrimp or something? Either something is true or false. Take your pick.

Here's a question, how come in the Bible God creates light before the Sun and the rest of the stars?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 04:47:15 pm
Hey, hey. Pastor. So... Bible is equal to Lord Jesus Christ? Is he the fourth member of the trinity or something?

Quote
Dave, if I may interject, trolling a forum filled with people happily living lifestyles which don't fit your worldview seems to be a sign of envy. In your envy of people who are actually happy- and whilist following so-called "deviant" lifestyles, no less- you attempt to make everyone here miserable, thus undoing the conflict people living happy lives without conforming to your worldview has with the idea that only fundies can be truly happy.
Why would I envy foul mouthed filthy pigs who show no respect for themselves and even less love for Jesus.

I respected myself enough that I understood that despite our lusty wants, my boyfriend and I would be better off waiting until we felt absolutely sure of our commitments to one another before sharing the special bond that only two people in love can share.

You are the one spewing the disrespect and hate, sir. The filth and foul mouthing has primarily come from your corner, even if it has lacked less curse words.

If you love Jesus, why don't you show it by helping the needy? Sell your things and serve among them.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 04:48:00 pm
Quote
What? Why didn't you tell us that god's given you the power to see into the hearts and minds of forum posters?
I apologize, now you know. This whole forum is devoted to mocking those who worship the lord Jesus Christ and adhere to Biblical truths like YEC. Pot meet kettle.
Biblical truths? Isn't that like jumbo shrimp or something? Either something is true or false. Take your pick.

Here's a question, how come in the Bible God creates light before the Sun and the rest of the stars?

Because screw you, that's why!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 04:48:56 pm
Quote
What? Why didn't you tell us that god's given you the power to see into the hearts and minds of forum posters?
I apologize, now you know. This whole forum is devoted to mocking those who worship the lord Jesus Christ and adhere to Biblical truths like YEC. Pot meet kettle.
Biblical truths? Isn't that like jumbo shrimp or something? Either something is true or false. Take your pick.

Here's a question, how come in the Bible God creates light before the Sun and the rest of the stars?

Because screw you, that's why!
SCREW THE RULES, I HAVE JESUS!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 04:50:07 pm
Hey, hey. Pastor. So... Bible is equal to Lord Jesus Christ? Is he the fourth member of the trinity or something?

Quote
Dave, if I may interject, trolling a forum filled with people happily living lifestyles which don't fit your worldview seems to be a sign of envy. In your envy of people who are actually happy- and whilist following so-called "deviant" lifestyles, no less- you attempt to make everyone here miserable, thus undoing the conflict people living happy lives without conforming to your worldview has with the idea that only fundies can be truly happy.
Why would I envy foul mouthed filthy pigs who show no respect for themselves and even less love for Jesus.
If you love Jesus, why don't you show it by helping the needy? Sell your things and serve among them.
Nah he'd rather devote his time to denying science and trashing people he's never met on the Internets.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 16, 2012, 04:51:34 pm
Quote
What? Why didn't you tell us that god's given you the power to see into the hearts and minds of forum posters?
I apologize, now you know. This whole forum is devoted to mocking those who worship the lord Jesus Christ and adhere to Biblical truths like YEC. Pot meet kettle.

Well, I'm glad you figured out quoting. Good for you!

So are you going to make a thread when you get back to your circle jerk about how mean we were to you and picked on you because of your need to satisfy Jesus' ego? Because I would like to find that thread and follow it.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 04:53:52 pm
Quote
What? Why didn't you tell us that god's given you the power to see into the hearts and minds of forum posters?
I apologize, now you know. This whole forum is devoted to mocking those who worship the lord Jesus Christ and adhere to Biblical truths like YEC. Pot meet kettle.

Well, I'm glad you figured out quoting. Good for you!

So are you going to make a thread when you get back to your circle jerk about how mean we were to you and picked on you because of your need to satisfy Jesus' ego? Because I would like to find that thread and follow it.
I can see it now..."They were persecuting me on an online forum!"
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 04:54:02 pm
Let me just point out how happy I am that he changed his profile pic from that creepy middle-aged man to the Christian persecution symbol!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 04:55:57 pm
Quote
Nah he'd rather devote his time to denying science and trashing people he's never met on the Internets
.  Deny Science? What Science that Man came from Monkeys? LOL Typical evo babble.

 WARNING, WARNING, THIS IS AN ACTIVATION OF THE EMERGENCY EVO-BABBLER ALERT SYSTEM.
THIS ALERT IS ISSUED WHEN A SEVERE CASE OF EVO-BABBLER HAS BEEN DETECTED.

PRECAUTIONARY/PREPAREDNESS ACTIONS...

THIS IS AN EXTREMELY HAZARDOUS AND MIND THREATENING SITUATION. IF YOU
ARE IN THE PATH OF THIS VAPOROUS NONSENSE, ... TAKE COVER IMMEDIATELY.
DO NOT SEEK SHELTER IN A PUBLIC SCHOOL. AVOID ANY COLLEGE PROFESSOR,
ESPECIALLY IF THEY DRIVE A VW BUS AND EAT TOFU. 

 
 
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 04:58:19 pm
Quote
Nah he'd rather devote his time to denying science and trashing people he's never met on the Internets
.  Deny Science? What Science that Man came from Monkeys? LOL Typical evo babble.

 WARNING, WARNING, THIS IS AN ACTIVATION OF THE EMERGENCY EVO-BABBLER ALERT SYSTEM.
THIS ALERT IS ISSUED WHEN A SEVERE CASE OF EVO-BABBLER HAS BEEN DETECTED.

PRECAUTIONARY/PREPAREDNESS ACTIONS...

THIS IS AN EXTREMELY HAZARDOUS AND MIND THREATENING SITUATION. IF YOU
ARE IN THE PATH OF THIS VAPOROUS NONSENSE, ... TAKE COVER IMMEDIATELY.
DO NOT SEEK SHELTER IN A PUBLIC SCHOOL. AVOID ANY COLLEGE PROFESSOR,
ESPECIALLY IF THEY DRIVE A VW BUS AND EAT TOFU. 

 
No, humans did not "[come] from Monkeys". We do, however, share a common ancestor with apes.

And your hatred of education certainly explains a lot.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 04:59:00 pm
Quote
Nah he'd rather devote his time to denying science and trashing people he's never met on the Internets
.  Deny Science? What Science that Man came from Monkeys? LOL Typical evo babble.

 WARNING, WARNING, THIS IS AN ACTIVATION OF THE EMERGENCY EVO-BABBLER ALERT SYSTEM.
THIS ALERT IS ISSUED WHEN A SEVERE CASE OF EVO-BABBLER HAS BEEN DETECTED.

PRECAUTIONARY/PREPAREDNESS ACTIONS...

THIS IS AN EXTREMELY HAZARDOUS AND MIND THREATENING SITUATION. IF YOU
ARE IN THE PATH OF THIS VAPOROUS NONSENSE, ... TAKE COVER IMMEDIATELY.
DO NOT SEEK SHELTER IN A PUBLIC SCHOOL. AVOID ANY COLLEGE PROFESSOR,
ESPECIALLY IF THEY DRIVE A VW BUS AND EAT TOFU. 

 

Apes, actually.  Wouldn't expect you to know that since you cover your ears and shout no whenever something threatens your extremely narrow world view.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Dakota Bob on November 16, 2012, 04:59:44 pm
Some dude dying then coming back to life is perfectly fine, but evolution is silly? 'kay bro. Also, we didn't 'come' from monkeys, we evolved from a common ancestor. Just sayin'
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 05:01:53 pm
Maybe he'll introduce some groundbreaking evidence for Creationism ;D
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 05:02:25 pm
Quote
Nah he'd rather devote his time to denying science and trashing people he's never met on the Internets
.  Deny Science? What Science that Man came from Monkeys? LOL Typical evo babble.

 WARNING, WARNING, THIS IS AN ACTIVATION OF THE EMERGENCY EVO-BABBLER ALERT SYSTEM.
THIS ALERT IS ISSUED WHEN A SEVERE CASE OF EVO-BABBLER HAS BEEN DETECTED.

PRECAUTIONARY/PREPAREDNESS ACTIONS...

THIS IS AN EXTREMELY HAZARDOUS AND MIND THREATENING SITUATION. IF YOU
ARE IN THE PATH OF THIS VAPOROUS NONSENSE, ... TAKE COVER IMMEDIATELY.
DO NOT SEEK SHELTER IN A PUBLIC SCHOOL. AVOID ANY COLLEGE PROFESSOR,
ESPECIALLY IF THEY DRIVE A VW BUS AND EAT TOFU. 

 

Ouroboros Continues to eat itself.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 05:04:00 pm
Quote
No, humans did not "[come] from Monkeys". We do, however, share a common ancestor with apes.
Wrong. The religion of evolution has brainwashed you.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 05:04:48 pm
Quote
No, humans did not "[come] from Monkeys". We do, however, share a common ancestor with apes.
Wrong. The religion of evolution has brainwashed you.
Fine, prove me wrong, sir. Where is your scientific evidence that Creationism is true?

And yes, that is a direct question.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 05:08:30 pm
Quote
No, humans did not "[come] from Monkeys". We do, however, share a common ancestor with apes.
Wrong. The religion of evolution has brainwashed you.

YUCK YUCK YUCK.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 05:08:39 pm
Quote
Fine, prove me wrong, sir. Where is your scientific evidence that Creationism is true?
The 1611 KJV bible first of all. Secondly if you would bother to visit a real institution of scientific knowledge like the one in Petersburg Kentucky then you would have all of the scientific proof for Creationism you need. http://creationmuseum.org (http://creationmuseum.org)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 05:09:58 pm
Quote
Fine, prove me wrong, sir. Where is your scientific evidence that Creationism is true?
The 1611 KJV bible first of all. Secondly if you would bother to visit a real institution of scientific knowledge like the one in Petersburg Kentucky then you would have all of the scientific prood for Creationism you need. http://creationmuseum.org (http://creationmuseum.org)
Yes your Bible and link to the Creation Museum are duly noted.

Now, I am asking you for scientific evidence that Creationism is true. A peer reviewed article or something would be nice.

EDIT: Actually I won't even go that far because no such article exists. How about your own personal (scientific) arguments in favor of Creationism.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 05:11:15 pm
Quote
Fine, prove me wrong, sir. Where is your scientific evidence that Creationism is true?
The 1611 KJV bible first of all. Secondly if you would bother to visit a real institution of scientific knowledge like the one in Petersburg Kentucky then you would have all of the scientific proof for Creationism you need. http://creationmuseum.org (http://creationmuseum.org)

Holy shit, my brain just asploded!

Also, why did you change back to the creepy guy?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 05:11:28 pm
Quote
Fine, prove me wrong, sir. Where is your scientific evidence that Creationism is true?
The 1611 KJV bible first of all. Secondly if you would bother to visit a real institution of scientific knowledge like the one in Petersburg Kentucky then you would have all of the scientific proof for Creationism you need. http://creationmuseum.org (http://creationmuseum.org)

So... A place that states that natural selection functions, but somehow magically does not function when trying to create different and fascinating creatures? Not getting into the bible that is only literally true because you say it is.

Ouroboros!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 05:19:01 pm
Let me clarify this, PastorDave. I want your own personal reasons as to why you support Creationism and disbelieve evolution. That is, without you simply replying with a Bible quote or a general link to the main page of a Creation site.

I'm just looking for specifics here and I find your answers to be vague and overbroad.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: PastorDave on November 16, 2012, 05:22:07 pm
Quote
Now, I am asking you for scientific evidence that Creationism is true. A peer reviewed article or something would be nice.
The 1611 KJV Bible is all the peer review you need. 
Quote
Also, why did you change back to the creepy guy?
Ah a personal attack. I wouldn't expect anything less from a devil worshipping heathen.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 05:22:50 pm
PDizzle, I have a request (not a question):

I have to go home from work in a few minutes and I tend to not get on as much over the weekend (what with raising my kids to be evil like me).  Can you try not to be so much of a dick so that you don't get banned?  That way we can play again next week :)

Luv yer guts!

ETA this:

Quote
Also, why did you change back to the creepy guy?
Ah a personal attack. I wouldn't expect anything less from a devil worshipping heathen.

Not a heathen, an apostate.  Please get your religious based insults straight!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 05:24:13 pm
Quote
Now, I am asking you for scientific evidence that Creationism is true. A peer reviewed article or something would be nice.
The 1611 KJV Bible is all the peer review you need.
No, no it isn't. I want a valid scientific argument. Not one based in faith.

Now, what scientific evidence do YOU have for Creationism?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 05:25:33 pm
Quote
Also, why did you change back to the creepy guy?
Ah a personal attack. I wouldn't expect anything less from a devil worshipping heathen.
Did you reprimand someone for a personal attack with a personal attack? :o
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 05:26:02 pm
Quote
Now, I am asking you for scientific evidence that Creationism is true. A peer reviewed article or something would be nice.
The 1611 KJV Bible is all the peer review you need.

Wait, 1611 KJV (sounds like a brand of booze!) has been peer reviewed?  Where is this review?  You do understand the term "peer review", right?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 05:26:39 pm
Quote
Also, why did you change back to the creepy guy?
Ah a personal attack. I wouldn't expect anything less from a devil worshipping heathen.
Did you reprimand someone for a personal attack with a personal attack? :o

With an incorrect attack at that.  I renounced my faith, I am not someone who never had any!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 05:27:11 pm
Quote
Now, I am asking you for scientific evidence that Creationism is true. A peer reviewed article or something would be nice.
The 1611 KJV Bible is all the peer review you need. 
Quote
Also, why did you change back to the creepy guy?
Ah a personal attack. I wouldn't expect anything less from a devil worshipping heathen.

He didn't know it was your picture, bro.

Pastor. The Ouroboros is a warning, not a symbol you should accept and make your own.

This is your animal symbol: (http://beacondeacon.com/ichthus.gif) A fish swims forwards, seeking out food and trying to work with the current. It adjusts and can swim.

This is what you actually are acting like: (http://ktismatics.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/ouroboros.jpg) A symbol of unchanging, self consumption. It's a powerful symbol, but a warning as well. A snake is much more powerful when not eating itself.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 05:30:52 pm
Quote
Now, I am asking you for scientific evidence that Creationism is true. A peer reviewed article or something would be nice.
The 1611 KJV Bible is all the peer review you need. 
Quote
Also, why did you change back to the creepy guy?
Ah a personal attack. I wouldn't expect anything less from a devil worshipping heathen.

He didn't know it was your picture, bro.



Seriously, that's you (Pastor Dave, Not Material)?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 16, 2012, 05:34:44 pm
Cause space ships have wonderful typing abilities.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 05:36:34 pm
Cause space ships have wonderful typing abilities.

Don't judge me!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 05:39:54 pm
Quote
Now, I am asking you for scientific evidence that Creationism is true. A peer reviewed article or something would be nice.
The 1611 KJV Bible is all the peer review you need. 
Quote
Also, why did you change back to the creepy guy?
Ah a personal attack. I wouldn't expect anything less from a devil worshipping heathen.

He didn't know it was your picture, bro.



Seriously, that's you (Pastor Dave, Not Material)?
So he really is a middle-aged pastor trying to start fights on an online forum? For shame. And here I thought he had better things to do like tend to his flock.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: mellenORL on November 16, 2012, 05:44:01 pm
http://www.evolutionfairytale.com/forum/forum_rules.htm (http://www.evolutionfairytale.com/forum/forum_rules.htm)

Well, Pastor Dave was also violating the rules of his own forum while he was online here. So, yeah,
UBERTROLL.

Very rude. Hmmmf. Snicker snicker.

Shall Radiation send a disciplinary request/complaint note to the EFF Admin about P.D?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 05:44:54 pm
Quote
Now, I am asking you for scientific evidence that Creationism is true. A peer reviewed article or something would be nice.
The 1611 KJV Bible is all the peer review you need. 
Quote
Also, why did you change back to the creepy guy?
Ah a personal attack. I wouldn't expect anything less from a devil worshipping heathen.

He didn't know it was your picture, bro.



Seriously, that's you (Pastor Dave, Not Material)?
So he really is a middle-aged pastor trying to start fights on an online forum? For shame. And here I thought he had better things to do like tend to his flock.

Yes, but he has a reason!  His mysterious child used to post here and was drawn into the world of drugs and pre-marital sex!  It was just like Reefer Madness but real!


For the record, I'm still fairly sure this person is just another random troll who doesn't quite get that we are fucking with him.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Bezron on November 16, 2012, 05:46:26 pm
http://www.evolutionfairytale.com/forum/forum_rules.htm (http://www.evolutionfairytale.com/forum/forum_rules.htm)

Well, Pastor Dave was also violating the rules of his own forum while he was online here. So, yeah,
UBERTROLL.

Very rude. Hmmmf. Snicker snicker.

Shall Radiation send a disciplinary request/complaint note to the EFF Admin about P.D?

That's not something we do here.  We can, however, send someone over there with a link to this thread.  But that might incite a flood of asshats from there trying to troll us.  And that pisses off the Distind-beast
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Dakota Bob on November 16, 2012, 05:56:38 pm
A TL;DR of Pastor Daves nonsense:

"Y'AAL MOTHAFUCKAS NEED JESUS"
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Radiation on November 16, 2012, 06:42:29 pm
Ok after some discussion with another moderator, I have permabanned PastorDave for violating a majority of the Don't Be a Dick rules and also that he was nothing more than a blatant troll. I will let this thread go on for a few more hours and then I will lock it and throw it away. A thread on a similar subject can be remade if desired.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 07:11:51 pm
Well as long as the evidence of his hilarity is still visible that's fine by me. This thread cracked me up.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: ironbite on November 16, 2012, 07:47:53 pm
Aww don't lock it.  It was funny.

Ironbite-and also blew the fuck up while I was asleep.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Joey on November 16, 2012, 08:26:30 pm
The 1611 KJV Bible is all the peer review you need.

Obvious poe is obvious
Go back to Landover Baptist
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: SpaceProg on November 16, 2012, 08:36:49 pm
Well... that was entertaining while it lasted. :)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Canadian Mojo on November 16, 2012, 09:09:05 pm
Aww, I just cued up the devil's music and everything.

http://youtu.be/Rh2IDlME6io
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 16, 2012, 09:20:54 pm
The 1611 KJV Bible is all the peer review you need.

Obvious poe is obvious
Go back to Landover Baptist
Actually he came from the same site as...this guy (http://www.fstdt.com/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=77519).
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: kiwimac on November 16, 2012, 09:50:38 pm
Quote
And therin is your problem. The 1611 King James Holy Bible is the literal infallible word of God. You cannot trust in God while making a mockery of his word. And this is why I pray for your soul.

It is nothing of the sort. It is a now dated Translation into English. There are newer and better.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Mechtaur on November 17, 2012, 01:58:42 am
You know, part of me suspects he wasn't actually a pastor.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 17, 2012, 02:09:46 am
You know, part of me suspects he wasn't actually a pastor.

Can't tell if sarcasm?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Mechtaur on November 17, 2012, 04:57:15 am
You know, part of me suspects he wasn't actually a pastor.

Can't tell if sarcasm?

Very much sarcasm.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Star Cluster on November 17, 2012, 09:08:55 am
Isn't it amazing how quickly these fundie trolls delve into insults and name-calling when we don't respond favorably to their proselytizing?  Like they're going to say anything we haven't already heard.  And Pastor Dave went there quicker than most.

Ya know?  I rather miss some of the old ones like Big Chris Film and Carico.  They were fun to fuck with.  Sometimes I think we're a little too quick to ban them.

Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: SpaceProg on November 17, 2012, 09:24:00 am
^ Agreed.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 17, 2012, 10:30:24 am
Isn't it amazing how quickly these fundie trolls delve into insults and name-calling when we don't respond favorably to their proselytizing?  Like they're going to say anything we haven't already heard.  And Pastor Dave went there quicker than most.

Ya know?  I rather miss some of the old ones like Big Chris Film and Carico.  They were fun to fuck with.  Sometimes I think we're a little too quick to ban them.
Pity that I wasn't around for Big Chris Film or Carico :(
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: SpaceProg on November 17, 2012, 10:46:30 am
I remember Carico, but Big Chris Film draws a blank.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: erictheblue on November 17, 2012, 11:21:40 am
Aww, Radiation... You threw away our new toy. :(
I know I wasn't posting in this thread, but it was a lot of fun to read. But I agree with the others; we just don't get trolls like Chris and carico any more.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 17, 2012, 11:41:42 am
But I agree with the others; we just don't get trolls like Chris and carico any more.

Very true! I wonder what happened to all the decent trolls. Not just Carico and BCF, but Mannnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn, that American Cowboy guy, and there were a few others I can't remember their names. It's a shame really.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 17, 2012, 12:24:24 pm
But I agree with the others; we just don't get trolls like Chris and carico any more.

Very true! I wonder what happened to all the decent trolls. Not just Carico and BCF, but Mannnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn, that American Cowboy guy, and there were a few others I can't remember their names. It's a shame really.
At the very least I was here for some of our own forum members to go off the deep end. Like that Lawful Stupid guy and the one who was defending Reddit pedophiles.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Star Cluster on November 17, 2012, 12:33:31 pm
I remember Carico, but Big Chris Film draws a blank.
BCF was a serious wackadoodle fundie who was big-time into professional wrestling.  Not Carico batshit nuts, but still, pretty much out there.  But for a while, we were able to hold debates with him without him getting ultra-pissy like some have, but, alas, he eventually got to spamming the boards with walls of C&P when no one would accept his bullshit preaching and eventually got perma-banned.

He made a board that modeled after this one that went by the name of Atheists Say the Scariest Things, but the only ones that even posted on it were a few of us.

Good times.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: czechmate on November 17, 2012, 12:58:57 pm
In many societies around this planet, women are considered unmarriageable if they are virgins!
One example is the Polynesian where a man cannot wed his lady unless she is pregnant.
In Guam, girls seeking potential mates do their level best to get laid and even advertise for temporary mates to do the job.
Zulu women have to produce an offspring to their future mates to prove they are capable of producing more.
Unfortunately the Church has sought to control our lives from conception to (and often beyond) the grave to maintain their power.
As to the origin of the marriage ceremony itself - this came from the Babylonian heirachy to show their plebicite their new concubines. The ceremony included a 7 day bacchanalian orgy which, for some obscure reason, was omitted from the Abrahamic books.
In any case, people marry each other. The Church is merely a witness.
BTW, I come from Bohemia :-)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Osama bin Bambi on November 17, 2012, 01:11:12 pm
But I agree with the others; we just don't get trolls like Chris and carico any more.

Very true! I wonder what happened to all the decent trolls. Not just Carico and BCF, but Mannnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn, that American Cowboy guy, and there were a few others I can't remember their names. It's a shame really.
At the very least I was here for some of our own forum members to go off the deep end. Like that Lawful Stupid guy and the one who was defending Reddit pedophiles.

cestlefun14 and TigerHunter?
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 17, 2012, 01:37:50 pm
But I agree with the others; we just don't get trolls like Chris and carico any more.

Very true! I wonder what happened to all the decent trolls. Not just Carico and BCF, but Mannnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn, that American Cowboy guy, and there were a few others I can't remember their names. It's a shame really.
At the very least I was here for some of our own forum members to go off the deep end. Like that Lawful Stupid guy and the one who was defending Reddit pedophiles.

cestlefun14 and TigerHunter?
Yeah, those two douchenozzles.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: m52nickerson on November 17, 2012, 11:09:09 pm
The Mods ban the trolls to fast now.  He was harmless, and funny.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Thejebusfire on November 18, 2012, 02:03:25 am
I miss a lot of funny threads when I don't pay attention to what's going on.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Meshakhad on November 18, 2012, 02:18:28 am
Yeah, I wish we had kept this guy around for longer. I was looking forward to launching my own attack on his KJV-only position - namely, that the only TRUE version of the Bible is the original Hebrew, with all others being translations, and therefore potentially erroneous.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Askold on November 18, 2012, 03:07:57 am
Yeah, I wish we had kept this guy around for longer. I was looking forward to launching my own attack on his KJV-only position - namely, that the only TRUE version of the Bible is the original Hebrew, with all others being translations, and therefore potentially erroneous.

I'm not sure if that would have worked. Some people do keep claiming that the KJV is the original one.

Then again if you believe that God is omnipotent and omnipresent (and sometimes a dick) then I suppose the fact that KJV version is newer than the hebrew version doesn't really matter.



LOL I gave them dirty jews the wrong version and then went to the future and gave the REAL bible to the british so that they could give it to the americans because they are my true children and blessed nation. (But if they ever let those homos get married in MY churches I'll be sure to send some floods and meteor their way.)
(http://t.qkme.me/fjd.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: ironbite on November 18, 2012, 03:32:45 am
I miss a lot of funny threads when I don't pay attention to what's going on.

Oh I hope you're last in the avatar thread!
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: syaoranvee on November 18, 2012, 04:58:31 am
I can guess on how our good pastor got the idea of coming here:

A thread was posted on the 14th that mentioned FSTDT a few posts on (http://evolutionfairytale.com/forum//index.php?showtopic=5271)


Quote
In fact FSDT is dedicated to ripping on religious people... Is there such a thing for ripping on atheists?

Quote
Truth is truth, honesty is honesty and fairness is fairness. And by the way I went over to the FSTDT forums (never been there before but thanks for the "you people"-type remarks) and read a few topics and while there is 4-chan type rudeness that is common anywhere there is not intense censorship, the only "ripping" I saw in my albeit brief sampling was fierce ripping on peoples' ideas, not them personally. Which there is nothing wrong with.

Quote
You mustn't have looked very hard at FSTDT, (or not at all) since the entire site is one ad hominem after another, (which by the way are logical fallacies).

Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 18, 2012, 09:43:21 am
I tried reading some of the page, but the first post was like "This... this is too stupid to read." Especially since their forum is named "Evolution Fairy Tale" and ban people for calling Creationism a myth for 'disrespecting others views'. Oh God, the DARVO. It burns.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: ironbite on November 18, 2012, 04:41:27 pm
Wow...just wow.  We have a site dedicated to ripping out logical falancies in some fundies argument and we're the ones who do one ad hom after another?

Ironbite-how cute and quaint.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: rookie on November 18, 2012, 04:44:06 pm
Wow...just wow.  We have a site dedicated to ripping out logical falancies in some fundies argument and we're the ones who do one ad hom after another?

Ironbite-how cute and quait.

My guess is they heard the phrase somewhere and it thought it sounds better than (a more accurate) "Nuh uh! You are!"
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Osama bin Bambi on November 19, 2012, 06:25:02 pm
I would like to make an update. I found the source of PastorDave's avatar. The source picture is of an actual pastor. I contacted this person about the troll who was misrepresenting him on an online forum. He replied promptly. He is not PastorDave, he has never posted on this forum, and none of his children have been involved with drugs.

So yeah, whoever posted here was definitely a troll who stole someone else's identity.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: SpaceProg on November 19, 2012, 06:43:12 pm
Veddy interestink... *Monocle falls in Pepsi*  Shit.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: czechmate on November 20, 2012, 04:44:14 am
Yeah, I wish we had kept this guy around for longer. I was looking forward to launching my own attack on his KJV-only position - namely, that the only TRUE version of the Bible is the original Hebrew, with all others being translations, and therefore potentially erroneous.
Aramaic - Hebrew script came later. Since most of the stories were the result of 2 millenia of Chinese Whispers in the first place, their true validity is inherently suspect.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Material Defender on November 20, 2012, 11:09:08 am
Yeah, I wish we had kept this guy around for longer. I was looking forward to launching my own attack on his KJV-only position - namely, that the only TRUE version of the Bible is the original Hebrew, with all others being translations, and therefore potentially erroneous.
Aramaic - Hebrew script came later. Since most of the stories were the result of 2 millenia of Chinese Whispers in the first place, their true validity is inherently suspect.

I've heard that Jesus was a teacher who was teaching Buddhist teaching to the people of the land. But I've heard that once. And This would only be six hundred years removed and Indian.

Sooooo.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 20, 2012, 02:01:06 pm
I would like to make an update. I found the source of PastorDave's avatar. The source picture is of an actual pastor. I contacted this person about the troll who was misrepresenting him on an online forum. He replied promptly. He is not PastorDave, he has never posted on this forum, and none of his children have been involved with drugs.

So yeah, whoever posted here was definitely a troll who stole someone else's identity.

Well, that's obnoxious.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 20, 2012, 03:56:53 pm
I would like to make an update. I found the source of PastorDave's avatar. The source picture is of an actual pastor. I contacted this person about the troll who was misrepresenting him on an online forum. He replied promptly. He is not PastorDave, he has never posted on this forum, and none of his children have been involved with drugs.

So yeah, whoever posted here was definitely a troll who stole someone else's identity.

Well, that's obnoxious.
But you see it's okay to steal someone's personal identity and use it to snipe at people in an online forum as long as it's for Jesus.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Cataclysm on November 20, 2012, 04:16:11 pm
I find it doubtful that the troll was even a Christian.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 20, 2012, 04:25:50 pm
I find it doubtful that the troll was even a Christian.

This.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Rabbit of Caerbannog on November 20, 2012, 08:42:40 pm
I find it doubtful that the troll was even a Christian.
I still would not be shocked if he did consider himself Christian and just enjoys trolling atheists.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: unknown on November 21, 2012, 05:21:31 am
Yeah, I wish we had kept this guy around for longer. I was looking forward to launching my own attack on his KJV-only position - namely, that the only TRUE version of the Bible is the original Hebrew, with all others being translations, and therefore potentially erroneous.
Aramaic - Hebrew script came later. Since most of the stories were the result of 2 millenia of Chinese Whispers in the first place, their true validity is inherently suspect.

I think I saw someone claim once that the reason the KJV Bible is the most accurate English translation, and thus the true word of God, is because they believed God guided the translators into writing a completely-faithful-to-the-original English Bible.
Title: Re: Why Is Sex Outside of Marriage A Sin?
Post by: Smurfette Principle on November 22, 2012, 12:25:27 pm
Yeah, I wish we had kept this guy around for longer. I was looking forward to launching my own attack on his KJV-only position - namely, that the only TRUE version of the Bible is the original Hebrew, with all others being translations, and therefore potentially erroneous.
Aramaic - Hebrew script came later. Since most of the stories were the result of 2 millenia of Chinese Whispers in the first place, their true validity is inherently suspect.

I think I saw someone claim once that the reason the KJV Bible is the most accurate English translation, and thus the true word of God, is because they believed God guided the translators into writing a completely-faithful-to-the-original English Bible.

OK, then why can't it be assumed that that every time someone re-translates the Bible, they're guided by God? Because the KJV sounds prettier? God speaks only in Elizabethan now?